Torn between lcs or fx!

[ackuric]

Stoti, the impact can only reach the same or better power levels with heavy modifications or the power plenum. 

The LCS being a hammerless design is semi auto by default. Most semi auto airguns use a recycled air system to cycle the pellet probe. Whereas the LCS is using the same air in the reservoir and the gun is always “cocked” without a pellet probe. This hammerless tech makes the gun extremely efficient as it removes any flaws such as hammer bounce, dwell, etc. A .25 LCS, set at 110 reg pressure shooting JSB 34 gr @880 FPS, will use about 1.8 bars for every shot. Stoti if you have a .25 impact do you know what kind of efficiency it’s running at?

You need to equate that pressure (1.8 bar) to volume for valid comparison, which is why we use fpe/ci as a standard in measuring an airguns efficiency, due to the differences in reservoir volumes.



For example, my rifle is 190cc, shooting 34 gr at 888 fps will result in 3.4~ bar use per shot...but for a gun with twice that volume (380cc) that would be 1.7 bar per shot, and a rifle with 480 cc that would be 1.34 bar per shot, which is far more efficient than the LCS....



I just ran the math, and at 1.8 bar per shot with a 480 cc cylinder is only 1.1~ fpe/ci, where as I am making 1.37 fpe/ci, shooting at a slightly higher velocity...and out of a 19.5" barrel compared to a 23" one...with a hammer driven valve....



And whats equally important, is the fpe/ci at what particular pressure and energy level. 1.37 fpe/ci at 2000 psi and 60 fpe (my current config) is entirely different than 1.37 fpe/ci at 2500 psi making 30 fpe...


Both thermal and volumetric efficiency essentially translate to when the valve closed relative to the pellets position down the barrel. You tell me the fpe/ci, and thanks to my deep understanding of pcp's, I can determine if the valve is closing as the pellet approaches roughly 10%, 33%, or 50% of the barrels volume in distance...

 

[Pale_Rider]

Stoti, the impact can only reach the same or better power levels with heavy modifications or the power plenum. 

The LCS being a hammerless design is semi auto by default. Most semi auto airguns use a recycled air system to cycle the pellet probe. Whereas the LCS is using the same air in the reservoir and the gun is always “cocked” without a pellet probe. This hammerless tech makes the gun extremely efficient as it removes any flaws such as hammer bounce, dwell, etc. A .25 LCS, set at 110 reg pressure shooting JSB 34 gr @880 FPS, will use about 1.8 bars for every shot. Stoti if you have a .25 impact do you know what kind of efficiency it’s running at?

You need to equate that pressure (1.8 bar) to volume for valid comparison, which is why we use fpe/ci as a standard in measuring an airguns efficiency, due to the differences in reservoir volumes.



For example, my rifle is 190cc, shooting 34 gr at 888 fps will result in 3.4~ bar use per shot...but for a gun with twice that volume (380cc) that would be 1.7 bar per shot, and a rifle with 480 cc that would be 1.34 bar per shot, which is far more efficient than the LCS....

Thanks. How would I calculate it with volume in the equation?

 

[NickT]

If by Power you literally mean wattage (energy/second), then it may go to the LCS. But, if you’re actually talking Energy, then it clearly goes to the Impact (0.35).

 

[ackuric]

Stoti, the impact can only reach the same or better power levels with heavy modifications or the power plenum. 

The LCS being a hammerless design is semi auto by default. Most semi auto airguns use a recycled air system to cycle the pellet probe. Whereas the LCS is using the same air in the reservoir and the gun is always “cocked” without a pellet probe. This hammerless tech makes the gun extremely efficient as it removes any flaws such as hammer bounce, dwell, etc. A .25 LCS, set at 110 reg pressure shooting JSB 34 gr @880 FPS, will use about 1.8 bars for every shot. Stoti if you have a .25 impact do you know what kind of efficiency it’s running at?

You need to equate that pressure (1.8 bar) to volume for valid comparison, which is why we use fpe/ci as a standard in measuring an airguns efficiency, due to the differences in reservoir volumes.



For example, my rifle is 190cc, shooting 34 gr at 888 fps will result in 3.4~ bar use per shot...but for a gun with twice that volume (380cc) that would be 1.7 bar per shot, and a rifle with 480 cc that would be 1.34 bar per shot, which is far more efficient than the LCS....

Thanks. How would I calculate it with volume in the equation?

http://www.calc.sikes.us/1/

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Y7Boso1AgFxWk1ZiNoCStnT1K8hDpS4r_m73gSsj96Q/copy?usp=sharing



Top version doesn't consider regulated rifles and shooting below regulated set point, where as the second one (my personally coded version) does...although the second calculator is much more involved and more than an efficiency calculator, such calculations are included.



** added into my original post above but will include here in case someone looks over it...**

And whats equally important, is the fpe/ci at what particular pressure and energy level. 1.37 fpe/ci at 2000 psi and 60 fpe (my current config) is entirely different than 1.37 fpe/ci at 2500 psi making 30 fpe…

Both thermal and volumetric efficiency essentially translate to when the valve closed relative to the pellets position down the barrel. You tell me the fpe/ci, and thanks to my deep understanding of pcp's, I can determine if the valve is closing as the pellet approaches roughly 10%, 33%, or 50% of the barrels volume in distance…

 

[stoti]

Stoti, the impact can only reach the same or better power levels with heavy modifications or the power plenum. 

The LCS being a hammerless design is semi auto by default. Most semi auto airguns use a recycled air system to cycle the pellet probe. Whereas the LCS is using the same air in the reservoir and the gun is always “cocked” without a pellet probe. This hammerless tech makes the gun extremely efficient as it removes any flaws such as hammer bounce, dwell, etc. A .25 LCS, set at 110 reg pressure shooting JSB 34 gr @880 FPS, will use about 1.8 bars for every shot. Stoti if you have a .25 impact do you know what kind of efficiency it’s running at?

Legionair, I don't know the efficiency, I've never measured it, don't really care. I'm concerned with power becasue I've been testing slugs with my Impact almost constantly for the last year and a half. I need all the power I can get for the heavier slugs and for tuning from high to low velocities. I understand the efficiency of hammerless designsand agree it's a phenomenal design, I was kind of joking and wasn't trying to be arguementative. Becasue it's semi-fully automatic, I was implying it wouldn't be efficient at all because in my case at least, my boys would constantly have the trigger pinned to the rear...Completely wasting lead and air! LOL As far as power goes, the guy is considering the .35 Impact which will come with the power plenum and according to Jon's video be easily capable of 150fpe out of the box, without modification. Different calibers but if he's looking for power, the .35 Impact is the ticket. Have a great evening. Stoti

 

[Pale_Rider]

Stoti, the impact can only reach the same or better power levels with heavy modifications or the power plenum. 

The LCS being a hammerless design is semi auto by default. Most semi auto airguns use a recycled air system to cycle the pellet probe. Whereas the LCS is using the same air in the reservoir and the gun is always “cocked” without a pellet probe. This hammerless tech makes the gun extremely efficient as it removes any flaws such as hammer bounce, dwell, etc. A .25 LCS, set at 110 reg pressure shooting JSB 34 gr @880 FPS, will use about 1.8 bars for every shot. Stoti if you have a .25 impact do you know what kind of efficiency it’s running at?

You need to equate that pressure (1.8 bar) to volume for valid comparison, which is why we use fpe/ci as a standard in measuring an airguns efficiency, due to the differences in reservoir volumes.



For example, my rifle is 190cc, shooting 34 gr at 888 fps will result in 3.4~ bar use per shot...but for a gun with twice that volume (380cc) that would be 1.7 bar per shot, and a rifle with 480 cc that would be 1.34 bar per shot, which is far more efficient than the LCS....

Thanks. How would I calculate it with volume in the equation?

http://www.calc.sikes.us/1/

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Y7Boso1AgFxWk1ZiNoCStnT1K8hDpS4r_m73gSsj96Q/copy?usp=sharing



Top version doesn't consider regulated rifles and shooting below regulated set point, where as the second one (my personally coded version) does...although the second calculator is much more involved and more than an efficiency calculator, such calculations are included.



** added into my original post above but will include here in case someone looks over it...**

And whats equally important, is the fpe/ci at what particular pressure and energy level. 1.37 fpe/ci at 2000 psi and 60 fpe (my current config) is entirely different than 1.37 fpe/ci at 2500 psi making 30 fpe…

Both thermal and volumetric efficiency essentially translate to when the valve closed relative to the pellets position down the barrel. You tell me the fpe/ci, and thanks to my deep understanding of pcp's, I can determine if the valve is closing as the pellet approaches roughly 10%, 33%, or 50% of the barrels volume in distance…

I can’t download the file for the calculator

 

[Pale_Rider]

Stoti, the impact can only reach the same or better power levels with heavy modifications or the power plenum. 

The LCS being a hammerless design is semi auto by default. Most semi auto airguns use a recycled air system to cycle the pellet probe. Whereas the LCS is using the same air in the reservoir and the gun is always “cocked” without a pellet probe. This hammerless tech makes the gun extremely efficient as it removes any flaws such as hammer bounce, dwell, etc. A .25 LCS, set at 110 reg pressure shooting JSB 34 gr @880 FPS, will use about 1.8 bars for every shot. Stoti if you have a .25 impact do you know what kind of efficiency it’s running at?

Legionair, I don't know the efficiency, I've never measured it, don't really care. I'm concerned with power becasue I've been testing slugs with my Impact almost constantly for the last year and a half. I need all the power I can get for the heavier slugs and for tuning from high to low velocities. I understand the efficiency of hammerless designsand agree it's a phenomenal design, I was kind of joking and wasn't trying to be arguementative. Becasue it's semi-fully automatic, I was implying it wouldn't be efficient at all because in my case at least, my boys would constantly have the trigger pinned to the rear...Completely wasting lead and air! LOL As far as power goes, the guy is considering the .35 Impact which will come with the power plenum and according to Jon's video be easily capable of 150fpe out of the box, without modification. Different calibers but if he's looking for power, the .35 Impact is the ticket. Have a great evening. Stoti

Lol I do go through a bit more air and lead than my repeating airguns
100% the .35 has more power 

 

[stoti]

We've been looking for a new gun for my son Cooper for a while now. I shoot an Impact most of the time, my oldest son Alex the RAW HM1000X and Cooper was shooting either the Brocock or Streamline. Now it's his turn for a new gun and of course he wants a SK-19. He would have a blast with it and would want to shoot with dad and his brother all the time. But Dad, the voice of reason wants to buy him a Veteran, Uragan, Wildcat MKIII, Prophet or something along those lines. I told him we could get what he wanted, as long as we talked it over, but.... He and Alex are both great shots and I want them to work on getting better by learning to be patient, working on their breath control, proper hold, trigger press, follow through, etc... I'm afraid the SK-19 will just be used for blasting stuff, playing and having fun. I can appreciate that, but.... I talked to someone the other day, after that, I am now really leaning toward the Veteran, Uragan or Prophet. Then today, there was Gino's(mtnGhost) post on the crazy power he's getting with his modified Veteran .22. So many great choices, almost too many! It a great time to be an air gunner!

Have a good one! Stoti

 

[vmaxpro]

Stoti talk him into the uragan! My friend shoots one with me I love that thing. His in 30 cal

 

[stoti]

Yeah, it’s probably the Uragan or Veteran. I want to get him the Veteran but we like the bottle better on the Uragan. Can’t decide.

Stoti

 

[Chefman]

I can not for the life of me decide on which one to get! Either wait for the impact .35, or get a .25 lcs sk19. Pros and cons for each. If I get the lcs Im going to do alot of tinkering. I really want to learn that gun! Id also look into a custom much longer barrel and Id machine the rest. Id love to get a tj’s on there and push some 43gr or heavier slugs over 100ftlbs. But then theres the trigger... As for the impact, I would just wait for the slug liners to come out and prob do a dual bottle and thats about it. Tough decisions these days lol

Get both

 

[7Green]

You really don't need heavy mods to get more power out of an impact. They can be ordered with the powerblock now. Slap in huma dual tranfer port and power spring kit, followed by a tungsten hammer and nsa probe, and you have a 200fpe gun. No drilling required, grinding, polishing, etc.... Simple plug and play. That isn't heavily modified imo. It does add cost though.

Also, they fixed the issue with changing calibers to my knowledge. You would still need the barrel change/correct transfer port and probe for what ever caliber you chose.

Personally, I would get the m3 in a 30 cal. Plenty of power for most, lots of people with proven slug tunes, and the ability to get more usable power by doing the same mods I mentioned above. Heavy liners are already out too.

 

[ChRiSiS]

You really don't need heavy mods to get more power out of an impact. They can be ordered with the powerblock now. Slap in huma dual tranfer port and power spring kit, followed by a tungsten hammer and nsa probe, and you have a 200fpe gun. No drilling required, grinding, polishing, etc.... Simple plug and play. That isn't heavily modified imo. It does add cost though.

Also, they fixed the issue with changing calibers to my knowledge. You would still need the barrel change/correct transfer port and probe for what ever caliber you chose.

Personally, I would get the m3 in a 30 cal. Plenty of power for most, lots of people with proven slug tunes, and the ability to get more usable power by doing the same mods I mentioned above. Heavy liners are already out too.

You do realize that this was a 2 year old thread, right? The M3 didn’t exist when the thread was started AND completed!

 

[7Green]

Nope, but thanks for pointing it out haha