Budget Scope AO Scale/Adjustment

[Jalan]

Hello All,
I'm still pretty green around here so forgive me. My first PCP I got the A.V. Avenger Bullpup (2), 25 cal. I got a budget CVLife 2-10x32 AO. It's compact, illuminated, came with a nice cantelever mount. It's seemed to always hold well. My question is regarding the parallax adjustment.
Generally, I like to zero at 30 yards as my raccoon activities are generally 30-40. Till today, I was basically setting the Objective to the 30 yard mark and leaving it. I had to remount so now with a pinch more experience I checked things a little closer.
The design of the Bullpup is hard to move the head around with a full picture without moving the rifle, so I'm behind it, looking thru and pretty much only seeing the center of the reticle.
As I shifted around it was definitely floating. I slowly adjusted, check, repeat. When it reached the point where the dot was glued regardless of shifting/wiggling around, I see it's set at just under the 50 yard setting on the dial?
I trust my eyes more than a number on a dial but I'm wondering if this is the proper way to approach it? Are there any indicators I could be missing? I will say after this change I was inside 1/2" at 30 so... With a 32 objective, I guess there's less possible error but it's there. With the scale being so far off I'm wondering if I'm missing something?
Thanks Very Much

 

[PEP3]

They are set at a certain magnification, so it will change if you use a different magnification. No big deal as long as you sight picture is clear.
Peyton

 

[Joes41]

I always go by what's clear to my eye and not the yards marked on the parallax wheel. I've had plenty of budget scopes off the mark. Your definitely checking the eye box for parallax error the right way. And congrats on your first pcp. Game changer, right?

 

[Jalan]

They are set at a certain magnification, so it will change if you use a different magnification. No big deal as long as you sight picture is clear.
Peyton

My understanding is that magnification change doesn't create any more/less parallax error but whatever error there is becomes more obvious. This definitely means sense as I was siting with minimal and when I went to my max of 10 is where I noticed it.

 

[Jalan]

I always go by what's clear to my eye and not the yards marked on the parallax wheel. I've had plenty of budget scopes off the mark. Your definitely checking the eye box for parallax error the right way. And congrats on your first pcp. Game changer, right?

Thanks... Game changer is putting it mildly. How I went 54 years completely unaware blows my mind .
Especially for the price, I love this rifle. I really enjoy learning it all. The only problem is now I've only just broken this in and I'm already thinking what I want next.

 

[PEP3]

My understanding is that magnification change doesn't create any more/less parallax error but whatever error there is becomes more obvious. This definitely means sense as I was siting with minimal and when I went to my max of 10 is where I noticed it.

You have a larger range of focus at lower magnification, so you don't notice it that much. It gets much smaller at 10x

 

[MongooseV8]

My understanding is that magnification change doesn't create any more/less parallax error but whatever error there is becomes more obvious. This definitely means sense as I was siting with minimal and when I went to my max of 10 is where I noticed it.

On a well made more expensive scope that is the case. On something like the CVLife scopes, they are best to set and forget. They will never be able to really dial everything for each shot or distance. You might also start to notice a poa/poi shift when dialing through the zoom range. Basically if you adjust something there is a good chance it will shimee another parameter just a little.

I would figure out what ammo you like, and the most common distance you will use your pcp at and set the scope up for that scenario. Then leave it alone. This might mean using the scope on 2x or 3x forever. If you want to start dialing in shots or changing ammo a lot, a better scope might be of interest to you. But for backyard pesting at known distances, I dont think there is currently anything on the market as good of a deal as the CVLife scopes.

I actually use my Leupold in a similar manner on my current main pester. I have a Wildcat 177 with a 1-4x Leupold that doesnt even have a parallax adjustment. I zeroed at 25yds on 4x and it will stay there for the foreseeable future.

 

[JimD]

The way to set your diopter (the lens closest to your eye) is to look at a target and move your head. If the reticle moves, adjust the diopter until it does not. Some just adjust until they can see the reticle clearly. I don't think that is close to good enough.

Do that first. Then you can check the parallax. It would not be surprising if the scale on the scope is off, especially an inexpensive scope. The parallax is correct when the image is the most clear. The parallax setting should not affect whether the reticle moves when you move your head. If it does I think there may be a design issue with the scope. For your situation, however, you could reset the diopter with the best parallax setting but you might be chasing yourself around (i.e. will that affect the best parallax?). On my scopes the parallax setting does not affect whether the reticle moves when I move my head. The least expensive scope I use on an airgun is the Hawke Vantage 2-7 on my Prod. The most expensive is the Arken EPL-4 on my Caiman. Most are around $200.

 

[Gerry52]

I hunt & mostly use holdover/under on 2 of my 3 guns. I use side focus now but AO in the past. Never paid attention to the yardage numbers on either type other than to quickly get me in the ballpark. I always leave the magnification on those 2 scopes at 12x & adjust focus for comfort & clearest eyebox. I've rarely seen sub $500 scopes (my budget range) that are dead nuts on the money with the AO or side focus numbers, close, but no cigar. Again, for me it's all about comfort with a good view. I just ignore those numbers.

 

[Jalan]

The way to set your diopter (the lens closest to your eye) is to look at a target and move your head. If the reticle moves, adjust the diopter until it does not. Some just adjust until they can see the reticle clearly. I don't think that is close to good enough.

Do that first. Then you can check the parallax. It would not be surprising if the scale on the scope is off, especially an inexpensive scope. The parallax is correct when the image is the most clear. The parallax setting should not affect whether the reticle moves when you move your head. If it does I think there may be a design issue with the scope. For your situation, however, you could reset the diopter with the best parallax setting but you might be chasing yourself around (i.e. will that affect the best parallax?). On my scopes the parallax setting does not affect whether the reticle moves when I move my head. The least expensive scope I use on an airgun is the Hawke Vantage 2-7 on my Prod. The most expensive is the Arken EPL-4 on my Caiman. Most are around $200.

Thanks for the info, just not sure I understand. My understanding of "Paralax" by definition is when the reticle and target image are not on the same final plane. So, if they're in different planes moving your head/vision changes the angle you're looking thru the 2 separate points/planes causing a shift in the alignment of the 2 (dot moves around). Right?
Adjusting the diopter I can get razer sharp focus but I'm not clear how that effects the focal plane of the reticle and target?
I tried making sure my diopter is on and wildly adjusted the Paralax (objective adjustment) and it's definitely floating, once I sharpen it up and move again it's glued down.
I understand what you're saying just unclear how the eye focus can adjust parallax?
Thanks.... I'm still learning all this, all info is welcome....

 

[Berserkeley Mike]

The way to set your diopter (the lens closest to your eye) is to look at a target and move your head. If the reticle moves, adjust the diopter until it does not. Some just adjust until they can see the reticle clearly. I don't think that is close to good enough.

Do that first. Then you can check the parallax. It would not be surprising if the scale on the scope is off, especially an inexpensive scope. The parallax is correct when the image is the most clear. The parallax setting should not affect whether the reticle moves when you move your head. If it does I think there may be a design issue with the scope. For your situation, however, you could reset the diopter with the best parallax setting but you might be chasing yourself around (i.e. will that affect the best parallax?). On my scopes the parallax setting does not affect whether the reticle moves when I move my head. The least expensive scope I use on an airgun is the Hawke Vantage 2-7 on my Prod. The most expensive is the Arken EPL-4 on my Caiman. Most are around $200.

Jim, what you wrote is backwards to most of what I've read, but as I lack your experience I beg to reconfirm.
To keep the terms standard, I'm using this NSSF page:

Understanding the Parts of a Rifle Scope

Enhance your long-range shooting and hunting skills by understanding the parts of a rifle scope and how to use them effectively.

www.letsgoshooting.org

As I understand their standard canon, one adjusts the ocular (the lens closest to the eye that you call diopter), to focus the reticle, and then adjusts the parallax, not so that just the target is in focus, but that it doesn't move when you move your head.

What is Parallax Error on Rifle Scopes and How to Avoid It?

Learn how to avoid parallax error on rifle scopes with tips from Ryan Cleckner, a former Army Ranger sniper team leader.

www.letsgoshooting.org

Now as I understand the lenses and light path, your method may get to the same place in the end: crisp reticle and target with no parallax movement (and thus no error). But does your method have advantages, or is it just an alternative? Or am I missing something?
Thanks.

 

[Berserkeley Mike]

Thanks for the info, just not sure I understand. My understanding of "Paralax" by definition is when the reticle and target image are not on the same final plane. So, if they're in different planes moving your head/vision changes the angle you're looking thru the 2 separate points/planes causing a shift in the alignment of the 2 (dot moves around). Right?
Adjusting the diopter I can get razer sharp focus but I'm not clear how that effects the focal plane of the reticle and target?
I tried making sure my diopter is on and wildly adjusted the Paralax (objective adjustment) and it's definitely floating, once I sharpen it up and move again it's glued down.
I understand what you're saying just unclear how the eye focus can adjust parallax?
Thanks.... I'm still learning all this, all info is welcome....

I'm interested in what Jim replies, because like you I've noticed that on some scopes the marks on the parallax adjustment bell or side-focus were quite a bit off from what actually nulled parallax, as seen by no reticle movement on target while bobbing my head around like the Butabi brothers. I just thought it was because my scopes were cheap.

 

[JimD]

It's been awhile since I last reviewed which lens does what in a scope so I am not in a position to explain why setting the ocular so the reticle does not move works best but I did a little test this morning to make sure what I am saying is correct. The ocular on all my scopes is set so that I can put the gun on my benchrest setup with a rest in the front and back fully supporting the scope, point it at a 30 yard challenge target which has an 1/8th inch 10 ring, and move my head around and the point of aim does not move. Either I cannot see through the scope or my point of aim is correct. The parallax is set at 30 yards because I am normally shooting 30 yard challenge or masters targets. But I put a pellet trap at 35 yards (the limit of my backyard) and at 20 yards. Same target in each trap. I then set up two rifles, one with a 2nd focal plane scope and another with a first focal plane scope (one at a time) and tried the same test of the point of aim moving. It did not. The view through the scope at the 35 yard target was pretty good as you might expect, a 5 yard parallax error is not huge, but the view of the 20 yard target was pretty blurry. But I could still see the lines on the target and I sighted at the intersection of two lines. I'll include a picture of the setup, hopefully you will be able to see both pellet traps but they are along the same line from my shooting bench so the 20 yard one will block some of the 35 yard one.

The big benefit of doing things this way is not for target shooting. I have time to reset the parallax before shooting when shooting targets from a bench (or otherwise). The big benefit is pesting/hunting which I also use my airguns for when squirrels are in season (starts October 1st here). Squirrels do not stay in the same position long and I would not want to have to adjust my parallax to have my point of aim to be good hoping the squirrel will not run off as I do so. If the target is within 5 yards I don't need to move the parallax to see it clearly and even if it's 10 yards away it will be blurry but my shot will still go where my cross hairs are. I killed my first one last season at 37 yards. It was laying flat on a limb and 37 yards away. I do not range them until afterwards for the same reason as I do not mess with the parallax but I do afterwards for a little notebook I keep. One shot with my P35-177 dropped it. My parallax was not perfect but it did not need to be.

To me setting the ocular so the point of aim does not move is just the right way to set up the scope. I've seen others recommend setting it so you can see the reticle clearly or looking up in the sky or other things. But if you set it so your point of aim does not move it will be in focus and you can see it clearly. My ability to see the reticle position on the 10 ring or the center X dot requires more detailed setting of the ocular than just looking through the scope to see if the reticle is in focus. I do not know of any advantage it would provide you to have the ocular from my point of view focused incorrectly.

I only looked at one of the attachments briefly but I did notice it says that the parallax is to focus on the target. It did not say the reticle and the target. That is a much more brief way of saying what I am trying to say. The ocular adjustment is the reticle focus, the parallax is the target focus.

 

[Joes41]

Thanks for the info, just not sure I understand. My understanding of "Paralax" by definition is when the reticle and target image are not on the same final plane. So, if they're in different planes moving your head/vision changes the angle you're looking thru the 2 separate points/planes causing a shift in the alignment of the 2 (dot moves around). Right?
Adjusting the diopter I can get razer sharp focus but I'm not clear how that effects the focal plane of the reticle and target?
I tried making sure my diopter is on and wildly adjusted the Paralax (objective adjustment) and it's definitely floating, once I sharpen it up and move again it's glued down.
I understand what you're saying just unclear how the eye focus can adjust parallax?
Thanks.... I'm still learning all this, all info is welcome....

Bingo!