The Amazing China airguns.

[357cal]

Very true OldVet! The Chinese can manufacture as good as anyone, you just have to pay the same cost as the top others lines as it's the same processes and materials. It's their affordable stuff that can't be matched like the U Zelos, Notos.....I luv my RAW and Vet2 and am very blessed to have been able to afford them, I hope someday you will own one or both.

I think there is an exception too ( AEA 357 Challenger big bore. It might not be a precision pcp, but as a hunter for $ 600 bucks, it has no equal, 340 fpe and easily hit targets 230 yards out and still flatten out 204 slugs, non HP. There is nothing cheap about the build, just over 8.5 lbs.

 

[Avator]

It wasn't a thought out plan as though I could see the future but a couple years ago I began to explore casting my own pellets/slugs. My goal at the time was to just save money as I have a buddy who owns a tire shop and I have unlimited access to free wheel weight lead. Another incentive was the cost and availability of .25 pellets to feed my one and only .25 gun. I also wanted to see if I could find the best .22 cast pellet to feed as many of those guns as I could. I have been quite successful reaching both goals.
With the current issues that turned out to be a pretty good move as the market is heading into unknown waters as far as cost and availability. I do own guns that I have yet to find the best mold for and if the bottom drops out they can either be put away or sold.
Let it rain.

 

[Contndr35BB]

I don't know about their current availability, but I've had good luck with both H&N FTT's and Norma Domes and both are very reasonably priced. The H&N's seem to be more accurate in most of my rifles, but the Normas aren't bad pellets by any means. Last summer Pyramyd was selling the variety packs of Normas for $10. In .177 in bulk it worked out to about 0.6 cents per pellet.

If you get them from Pyramyd then every fourth tin is free. Combine that with whatever promotion they happen to be running and free shipping and you can usually get decent pellets in .177 for under $0.02 per shot and under $0.03 per shot in .22.

What's going on with the CPHP's is likely due to Crosman being bought out by Gamo. Rumor has it that the old CPHP's are being replaced with Gamo hollow points. Supposedly they're keeping the Crosman Premier name but the pellets are now made in Spain and appear to be identical to Gamo pellets.

I don't know the details ,but I'm shooting Apolo 14.6 gr hp pellets the look like CPHP's and they shoot better than CHPH's ever did! I've tried several Apolos and they are darn good. Yes , buy what you can, when you can, ammo shortages of all kinds have plagued us many times over the last ten (?) years. The supplies
will return , just cost more like before.

 

[Ratzy]

I don't know the details ,but I'm shooting Apolo 14.6 gr hp pellets the look like CPHP's and they shoot better than CHPH's ever did! I've tried several Apolos and they are darn good. Yes , buy what you can, when you can, ammo shortages of all kinds have plagued us many times over the last ten (?) years. The supplies
will return , just cost more like before.

Hatsan has all the Apolo

HatsanUSA

This is where you can browse products in this store.

hatsanairgunsusa.com

 

[Sawney Bean]

I don't know the details ,but I'm shooting Apolo 14.6 gr hp pellets the look like CPHP's and they shoot better than CHPH's ever did! I've tried several Apolos and they are darn good. Yes , buy what you can, when you can, ammo shortages of all kinds have plagued us many times over the last ten (?) years. The supplies
will return , just cost more like before.

A word of warning regarding .30 Apolo pellets. They are oversized. I bought way too many because they were dirt cheap and I'm going to try resizing them and see how they do. They might still turn out to be a good deal. I paid about 6 cents apiece for them, which for .30 pellets is a very low price.

 

[Ratzy]

A word of warning regarding .30 Apolo pellets. They are oversized. I bought way too many because they were dirt cheap and I'm going to try resizing them and see how they do. They might still turn out to be a good deal. I paid about 6 cents apiece for them, which for .30 pellets is a very low price.

I have been using both JSB and Apolo .30. Only difference at 45 yards is less than 1/2 inch both in poi and accuracy. Jsb have a little better groupings and the Apolo hit a little left of the JSB (I just checked, had the Sniper on the tripod). That is 2 of 3 .30, the Gauntlet and the Evanix Sniper X2. The AEA Terminator I just use the Apolo and don't worry about groupings so much, that is more about the semiauto rock and roll.

 

[Ranchibi]

I think there is an exception too ( AEA 357 Challenger big bore. It might not be a precision pcp, but as a hunter for $ 600 bucks, it has no equal, 340 fpe and easily hit targets 230 yards out and still flatten out 204 slugs, non HP. There is nothing cheap about the build, just over 8.5 lbs.

View attachment 560846

And it's a slug slinging machine!

 

[357cal]

I’ve said this before, the Chinese are quite capable of producing good quality products. Some days they simply don’t. I have a Gauntlet and a Gauntlet 2. The 2 has shot well as long as I’ve had it. The other one leaked air and it took another $100 to find some sharp metal edges that simply hadn’t been properly finished. Works perfectly now.

Rick H.

Where do you think they learned how to build a decent pcp? From everyone who creates them, they caught on quickly.

 

[JimD]

In my opinion the biggest Chinese innovation in airguns is the Hueben. It has a unique firing mechanism without a hammer. They did not copy that from others.

 

[Ratzy]

Where do you think they learned how to build a decent pcp? From everyone who creates them, they caught on quickly.

I've been an engineer in and around Silicon Valley for 45 years. I have watched the nations that have absorbed our high tech manufacturing come up with competing products that are suspiciously similar to US products manufactured in their country.

It is not limited to China, they are the most common, but Malaysia, India, Thailand and several others have done the same.

After several iterations of similar products they have learned enough to build their own designs.

Huawei is a great example. They started out copying Cisco routers. Now they have a massive line of Telecom and Networking products.

 

[Treefrog]

^ That. By combining the theft of intellectal property with slave labor they have created a great business model. For their nomenklatura.

Cheers,

J~

 

[Ratzy]

Went to the Foxconn Plant in Shenzen several years ago. 400,000 employees at that plant. The scale is unbelievable. We never had anything even 1/20 that size here in the states.

Majority of the facility was dedicated to the fruit company's products.

Employees I interacted with seemed like normal techs and engineers. Can't say about the line workers.

A lot of the employees lived there too. The old coal mine company town model.

But Foxconn is one of the better employers, a lot of that is driven by the fruit company.

 

[bigHUN]

In a recent decade I've been to China on tourist trip, about five years apart. The difference I saw was very significant. No I don't speak or related to there anyhow.
The upscale China is f****in upscale, you cannot imagine what that means you need to see it.
And the production segment is following that upscale very well, serving their own domestic market only, from toothpicks to space station.
I don't think they would bother sending those products Worldwide or to US specifically.
Yes, if you know the language or have a friend to translate to you you may be lucky to locate where to buy, otherwise you're out from that market.
Comies or not I don't care, I like to shop from aliexxpress and similar, second, more comfortable for my wallet as well.
I have a full respect what they have done and how did they do it.

 

[Arzrover]

In my opinion the biggest Chinese innovation in airguns is the Hueben. It has a unique firing mechanism without a hammer. They did not copy that from others.

I just wanted to confirm this statement ...
In 2018, I went to the IWA in Germany with Robert of AoA... it was one of the highlights of the show to meet the owner/engineer of Huben. It was all through an interpreter but he showed us the rifle, which was designed as a slug shooter in 22. It's features and design were unique ... definitely nothing like it in existence.. and seemed to be very high quality ... Options at the time were the 5k psi pump and a beautifully machined set of slug dies to make your own matched slugs. I believe the complexity of the design, being made in China, and not being a pellet shooter were the reasons for it not being pursued , but seems that the pellet shooting and different calibers have been perfected and they seem reliable now.
LCS and later Western have copied the basic design, if not the exact mechanism.
While I agree that they CAN make very high quality products , trusting the metallurgy is difficult because of the obvious shortcuts on so many products and consistency just doesn't seem to be there. I suppose the consistency is a function of the acceptance process though...
Bob

 

[Asher]

Huben is a company that seems to defy the stereotypes. Not only are the K1 and GK1 extremely good, so are the Huben moderators and the Huben hand pumps. Their hand pump weighs less than half of any other pump on the market and pumps up to 5000 psi.

One thing that I found astonishing is that hubens and aea are made at the same place, had three seperate huben suppliers tell me so. Being a huge huben fan boy myself and loving their quality, while being pretty unimpressed by AEA, this kinda blew my mind. Well, unimpressed by their semi autos anyway. They have some others that are ok, I own a challenger bullpup that has been pretty good to me apart from a broken sear that I had to replace with a custom hardened steel one.

I enjoy it more than I did my western airguns Bushbuck, and the bushbuck also gave me issues that AOA weren't really able to fix, though I think I just got really unlucky.

 

[357cal]

I just wanted to confirm this statement ...
In 2018, I went to the IWA in Germany with Robert of AoA... it was one of the highlights of the show to meet the owner/engineer of Huben. It was all through an interpreter but he showed us the rifle, which was designed as a slug shooter in 22. It's features and design were unique ... definitely nothing like it in existence.. and seemed to be very high quality ... Options at the time were the 5k psi pump and a beautifully machined set of slug dies to make your own matched slugs. I believe the complexity of the design, being made in China, and not being a pellet shooter were the reasons for it not being pursued , but seems that the pellet shooting and different calibers have been perfected and they seem reliable now.
LCS and later Western have copied the basic design, if not the exact mechanism.
While I agree that they CAN make very high quality products , trusting the metallurgy is difficult because of the obvious shortcuts on so many products and consistency just doesn't seem to be there. I suppose the consistency is a function of the acceptance process though...
Bob

FX and Hatsan had their fair share of issues over the past couple of years. FX, despite its reputation for precision, saw complaints about regulator inconsistencies and durability in high-power setups. Some users had trouble with leaking air systems and occasional quality control hiccups. Hatsan, on the other hand, had reports of machining inconsistencies, especially in their barrels and threads, leading to accuracy and reliability. BSA and Daystate have strong reputations, there have been complaints about pellet sensitivity and regulator inconsistencies. Some users have had to replace factory regulators with aftermarket options to achieve better performance. The problem is widespread spread not just China or price.