Why do Scope manufacturers have MOA turrets with MRAD reticles?

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Because the scopes you're looking at are SFP scopes. They are not meant to be used in a tactical/hunting situation. They are meant to be used in a precision, target shooting environment. The MOA adjustments are usually smaller than the MIL adjustments, so the crosshairs move less, AKA easier to zero the scope more precicesly. That's really important in a target shooting situation,to have the poi as close to the bullseye as possible. Now, obviously you can avoid this by having 0.05 MIL clicks instead of 0.1... But I guess they are not that smart.
 
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That explanation leaves me very confused. Really doesn't make sense to me. Got a feeling I'm not understanding.

​Stating SFP isn't meant for hunting really doesn't make sense. every scope out there that I know of should be usable for hunting and as 99.9% of scopes are SFP, saying that they aren't intended for hunting seems off.

​I understand that MOA turrets move a bit less than mil-dot, but that still makes no sense to mix the two measurement systems. Seems like they should also have an MOA reticle to go with MOA turrets.

I wonder if it's more of a "We started with MOA and Mil-Dot got popular, but we don't want to re-engineer the turrets" type situation?

Any thoughts?
 
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I think it is a math issue. We are raising a generation of math challenged people. It is a lot easier to tell someone one click equals one quarter inch at 100 yards (one eighth at 50 yards, one sixteenth at 25 yards), than explaining 3.6 inches at 100 yards is a MRAD, and the fraction of the MRADs per click then is 3.6/fraction per 100 yards, and then divided further if you are shooting 25/50 yards. I work in engineering, so math is not scary to me; I am okay with either method. I use Mildots for holdover/drop calculations, and whatever the turrets use (MOA/fractional-mildots) for zeroing. I don't play with the turrets for drop correction, as not all scopes are equally repeatable. 
 
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Interesting thought - my wife used to teach middle school math. Challenged is an understatement.

I do believe it would be easier to tell the scope user that 10 clicks = 1 dot on the reticle though. No math at all. To try to convert MOA, 1/4 inch at 100 yards, to how many dots is that on the reticle seems more challenging.

Let's see in a couple years how the manufacturers do. I have a feeling more and more MRAD turrets will be coming out to go with the Mil-dot scopes. I'm still confused as to why unless it truly is that they just don't want to redesign the turrets from MOA to MRAD.

Maybe I'll just contact Zeiss customer support or Vortex and see what they've got to say. If I get an answer, I'll post it.
 
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mrad for people using metric system is much more easier : 1 mrad = 10cm at 100m or 5cm à 50m and so on....

I have bought a FFP scope with mrad turrets and reticles and it saves a lot of my time. I will never go backward. It becomes so easy to set up the scope when I change my distance.

But it is true that the 0.1mrad (10mm at 100m) is less accurate than the 0.25 MOA (7mm at 100m).
 
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Ask 100 people what 0.1 of an MRAD is and you'll get blank stares.
Probably correct in the United States, but I'd be willing to bet that Europe and other metric countries would do much better with that question.

That's what I can't figure out, scopes must be sold globally, so in many countries, MRAD being Metric would be much more natural. Seems that MOA would be harder for the Metric types.
 
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Erik - You are probably correct about the United States, but there's lots of "American's" that get offended when everyone gets lumped into the US. Most of them are in South America and Central America, and to my understanding, most use Metric so would be light years ahead of us Yanks on this question.

Someone pointed out that the MRAD = 10Cm at 100 meters. As one educated in the Imperial system, I had no idea that was the case. Metric is so much easier in so many aspects, it's just something I've got to learn.
 
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Saltlake - I believe you hit the answer correctly here (IMO),
“We started with MOA and Mil-Dot got popular, but we don’t want to re-engineer the turrets”

To the best of my knowledge Rifle Scopes (a variation of Field Scopes) were first used during the US Civil War, perfected by the long range Ground Hog 'snipers' in the early part of the last century (basically 'our' century, for most of us) and made popular by Bench rest shooters (and 'varmint loaders') - ALL, you'll notice, based in the USA.

Really, Rifle Scopes originated in the USA - hence the 'MOA' hangover. I prefer Mil / Mil scopes (& FFP) but I'm in Europe (and BTW most Mil/Mil scope's turret adjustment is 1/2 or 1/4 Mil).
 
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"We started with MOA and Mil-Dot got popular, but we don’t want to re-engineer the turrets"

That really sounds more logical to me. If that's the history of rifle scopes, it sounds reasonable.

I personally don't care if it's an MOA-MOA system or a Mil-Mil system, as long as when I hear a click in the turret, I know exactly how many clicks move me up one mark on the reticle or down. For me it's just a consistency thing. The thought of converting MOA clicks to Mildot's in the scope is way too complex.

Must admit that it was interesting going to the Vortex site and looking at higher end scopes. Most of the Vortex scopes seem to be MOA-MOA. Didn't look very close, but didn't see any MOA-Mil combinations. Maybe it's time for me to do a bit of historical research and validate the history of MOA scopes. That ought to be interesting.
 
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Always learning something new in this hobby.

While less expensive scope manufacturers provide MOA - Mil combination scopes, Vortex is interesting in that they allow you to pick the reticle (MOA or MRAD) then ensure the turrets match, or the other way round. Consider this scope:

http://vortexoptics.com/product/razor-hd-gen-2-45-27x56-riflescope-with-ebr-1c-mrad-reticle/reticle

If you choose one of the two MRAD reticles, then click on the specifications tab, you'll see that the turrets are .1 MRAD.
Now, click on the MOA reticle in the middle. Click back on the specifications tab, and the turrets change to MOA.

Perhaps that's why I couldn't find any "Mixed" scopes on the Vortex site. They don't sell any.

Granted this scope is $3,400, but this one does the same thing (It's only $1200):
http://vortexoptics.com/product/vortex-viper-pst-6-24x50-ffp-riflescope-with-ebr-1-mrad-reticle/reticle

I guess the higher end makers are in tune with the better way to sell a scope. Either MOA-MOA or MIL-MIL, never mixing the two on the same scope.

It's more expensive to offer the same scope in full MOA or full MIL, but sure makes more sense.

I suspect this practice will trickle down to the less expensive makers over the next few years, but for now, it seems to be a high end practice.

On the other hand, Hawke (this is a paltry $1000 scope) http://www.hawkeoptics.com/sidewinder-ed-10-50x60-tmx.html comes with a Mil reticle, but MOA turrets. For a paltry $100 you can purchase replacement Mil turrets if you get the TMX reticle. That thing is complex, using both MOA and MIL in the same reticle if I read it correctly.

 
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