Three gun battle at 28 yds….Dirty Barrels vs Clean Barrels etc

Forums General Airgunning Three gun battle at 28 yds….Dirty Barrels vs Clean Barrels etc

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    CampFussell
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    I decided to pit my three .177 Caliber rifles against each other today. Also shooting each one over the Chrony for every shot in case there's a consistency problem with the velocities.

    My Cricket Rifle prefers the 10.3 gr JSB's and it was a job fighting the 6 & 7 mph winds at 28 yds today. I like to do five (5 shot) groups for comparison. Groups were ok, but I've seen better. I had cleaned the barrel the other day when groups opened up and indeed it was dirty and in need of a clean. Also when I get groups that aren't just what I think they should be, I always like to grab another rifle for comparison.

    Then I grabbed the FX Logun Solo and since she likes the 13.4 gr Jsb monsters, I figured she would fight the wind better? It wasn't much better, so I stepped up to the Thomas FT rifle and clicked off another five (5 shot) groups. It was a tad better overall, but had a crazy flyer on the third group that let me know the barrel was dirty.

    I couldn't let that flyer go, so I decided to clean the barrel and try it again. Groups tightened a microgasm and no flyer this time.

    Then I get to thinking, "well this isn't fair", I need to clean the barrel on the Logun and shoot another set of groups with it? It was even more dirty than the Thomas barrel. Those groups barely edged out the first groups.

    Here's the shot string results

    Cricket w/CZbarrel 200 bar fill to 160 bar for 25 shots..ES 15…SD 4.45…Avg Vel 902 fps…..power 18.6 FPE

    Logun Solo w/LW barrel 180 bar fill to 140 bar….ES 12….SD 2.88…Avg Vel 832 fps…power 20.6 FPE

    Cleaned Logun barrel and ES went up to 19….SD went up to 4.54..Avg vel fell to 829 fps and power barely dropped to 20.5 FPE

    Thomas w/Polygonal barrel ….200 bar fill to 170 bar ….ES 9….SD 2.42……Avg vel 827 fps ……power 20.4 FPE

    Cleaned Thomas barrel and ES went up to 13….SD went up to 3.14…..Avg vel fell to 812 fps and power dropped to 19.6 FPE

    Here's the groups in the order they were shot. Cricket Top row and so forth…

    All pellets shot straight from the tin with no sorting or weighing.

    Maybe someone will find this interesting? Does anyone else like to pit their rifles against each other like this when you think winds might be affecting groups? I know wind doesn't affect as bad at 28 yds vs the further yardages, but still enough to drive me insane when trying to stack pellets.

    Peace and Patch Worm grease

    Fuss

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    zx10wall
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    Awesome Fuss. I like to do the same but you are more in depth than me. Nice work and thank you for sharing. 

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    CampFussell
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    Thanks Derrick, now it's your turn to share your fantastic day at the Silhouette Match. And that awesome 0.84" 100 yd group you shot with your FX Boss! I want to view it on the big screen…… My 32" inch desktop monitor 😉 LOL

    Fuss

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    CampFussell
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    I drug out the calipers today and measured those groups best I could.

    I kicked out the worst group of each five sets and took the average of the best 4 groups.

    Cricket shooting the 10.5 grain battling the wind ………0.36 Center to center

    Logun dirty barrel and 13.4 gr Monster…………………….0.31 CC

    Logun clean barrel ……………………………………………….0.26 CC

    Thomas dirty barrel w/ 13.4 gr Monster……………………0.23 CC

    Thomas clean barrel …………………………………………….0.19 CC

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    intenseaty22
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    Great data Fuss, it’s been a gorgeous day here for shooting, but have lots of busy work going. Looks like great tight groups all around, minute of squirrel, no? 

    I did manage to get a squirrel, and have some data of my own, but that’s for the hunting section. 

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    CampFussell
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    intenseaty22

    Great data Fuss, it’s been a gorgeous day here for shooting, but have lots of busy work going. Looks like great tight groups all around, minute of squirrel, no? 

    I did manage to get a squirrel, and have some data of my own, but that’s for the hunting section. 

    I know I miss a lotta good stuff by not checking in on you hunters, but I like my squirrels to still be breathing and healthy when their photos are taken! LOL

    I'm just trying to find a way to compare my guns against each other. I really should do this indoors to take the wind out of the mix? It threw me for a loop when that crazy flyer came out of the barrel of my Thomas. I hadn't seen one like that in a long time.

    So when I cleaned the barrel and went for another round, I was really surprised at the decrease in velocity but it still shot better after I kicked out the worst group of each set?

    This is the first time I've done it like this. But I think I'll do the 5 groups at 5 shots each and kick out the worst group for my results from now on.

    The Cricket was struggling with those light pellets and it's putting a damper on things when I try to sell it. It's still accurate as all get out, just can't hang with the 13 gr bangers in the wind. I'm gonna try to sell it local and recoup some of my money I spent on the Wolverine. I hate shipping guns because I've had such bad luck with things getting damaged in shipping.

    Fuss

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    intenseaty22
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    Oh, I totally understand on both ends: Squirrels and Cricket. I like my plants and yard more than I like what the squirrels to to them, so….. I hear you on the Cricket and not shipping it. So, the 13gr don't shoot well out of the Cricket in the wind? 

     

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    CampFussell
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    Yeah, where I live the squirrels have so much forest to play in, they just come by for the free deer corn. If I live where you live I'd be wanting a bag limit on neighbors! LOL

    I don't know why, but the 10.3's out group the 13's? The gun is 5 years old and probably needs a reseal and a tune up? Who knows? I just haven't shot it enough!

     

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    functor
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    That's good data. You should save it. Whenever anyone asks "Do I need to clean my barrel?" — this happens frequently on all airgun forums– you can whip out the data and say if you do clean your barrel you'll get an improvement of 0.1-0.125 moa  in group sizes and no fliers. It's good to have numbers and you have collected good data there.

    Statistically it will make more sense to include all your groups OR drop your best and worst group and take the average of the rest. If the worst group is a statistical outlier, the best group is just as likely to be so. 

    I think the best thing is to collect all group data– fliers and everything– for a long period of time. Then find the standard deviation and that gives you the true range of your rifle's performance.

     

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    CampFussell
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    Thanks functor

    I took your advise and kicked out the high and the low and avg the other three shots of each group

    Cricket shooting the 10.5 grain battling the wind ………0.39" Center to center

    Logun dirty barrel and 13.4 gr Monster…………………….0.36" CC

    Logun clean barrel ……………………………………………….0.29" CC

    Thomas dirty barrel w/ 13.4 gr Monster……………………0.26" CC

    Thomas clean barrel …………………………………………….0.193" CC

    But the wind in my back yard is a big factor. It comes in from the north and swirls around in my back yard from all different directions.

    I really need to do this indoors to take that factor out of the mix. That's why a lot of Hunter and Open class FT shooters are going to the heavier 13.4 gr pellets to battle the wind better. My Cricket just doesn't like them for some reason?

    Kind regards

    Fuss

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    Centercut
    Participant
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    Fuss, maybe you're trying to shoot the Monsters too fast in your Cricket? I know in my Bantam, shooting the Monsters at 825 to 830 FPS got poor results, but lowering the speed to around 795 to 805 FPS tightened the groups up considerably to the point they were "almost" as good as the 10.3s at 915 to 920 FPS.  Give it a shot, who knows? Also, not sure if you've tried the H&N Barracuda Match 10.65s on your Cricket, but the Bantam liked them just as much as the JSB 10.3s.

    FYI, I'm a bit surprised by the ES on your Cricket, since I'm used to an ES of 5 or 6 on all the Crickets that I have owned using the stock reg. (.22 and .25 caliber). However, I haven't had a .177 Cricket, so maybe that has something to do with it.

    Mike 

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    CampFussell
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    Thanks Mike, I'm gonna pm ya about that bad boy.

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    Centercut
    Participant
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    Anytime…

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    Smok3y
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    Enjoyed it as usual. Now, I see the point of keeping multiple airguns. Take them out and have fun comparing them.

    PS – my rings came today!!

    Might have to jump out of work a little early tomorrow to take advantage of this warm weather we got this week. Glad you got to take advantage this weekend.

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    CampFussell
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    Thanks Russ, yeah it's fun to have matches with myself! LOL Don't know what I'll do if the Thomas ever loses? LOL

    Congrats and look forward to hear how you like your Red Wolfie 😉

    Fuss

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    southerngrl
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    holy moly Mr. Fuss…

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    CampFussell
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    southerngrl

    holy moly Mr. Fuss…

    Hey Nikki, did you decide on an airgun yet?

     

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