The Problem With Buying A Good Scope

Forums Optics, Scopes, Rings, & Mounts The Problem With Buying A Good Scope

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    zebra
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    “JoeWayneRhea”Zebra I agree totally . What amazes me is when I’m shooting with my main shooting Buddy and we usually end up shooting mainly from 40-60 yards and his 6-24 or 8-32 power scope Isnt capable of seeing about half the holes . And almost never if its a piece of cardboard or any thing but solid white background.
    My scope is a fixed 12X and I can see just fine …The extra magnification is useless without good glass .

    
I bet your scope is a lot lighter and easier to range too.

    Unless you have Rain Man math skills, most of the power settings will be useless on an SFP when hunting. Every time I look at the manufacturers chart of how to adjust the holdover for different power settings it gives me a nose bleed. 

    When all of your shooting is inside 100 yards, you definitely don’t need 24 power options, especially if none of them are suitable for the distance you are shooting at. 

    I wish there was a store near me where I could try scopes before I buy. I see enough people telling everyone how great Hawke scopes are to know that I can’t rely on “the general consensus”. It’s just too subjective. I’ve been disappointed with the Hawke scopes I’ve tried. It’s partly because my expectations were set high due to their reputation. 

    I’ve just ordered a few lower cost 4-14×44 FFP scopes to try. For some reason I really have a bad feeling about what I ordered. I’m worried I put the extra money into features I don’t need instead of better glass but I had to try an FFP for myself. I hope I’m wrong. 

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    JoeWayneRhea
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    Zebra for me Hawke, Aeon ,Vortex , UTG, and a few more are scopes I won’t spend money on . I know I know guys don’t wanna hear that but at least to my eye. They are overpriced and lesser quality . Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

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    zebra
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    “JoeWayneRhea”Zebra for me Hawke, Aeon ,Vortex , UTG, and a few more are scopes I won’t spend money on . I know I know guys don’t wanna hear that but at least to my eye. They are overpriced and lesser quality . Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

    
I quite literally couldn’t agree more. 

    The saving grace for some of those brands is that many people don’t get the opportunity to compare their scope to one of the many better options out there. The first time I tried a UTG scope, I was comparing it to the one that came free with a $70 springer from Walmart. With that as my benchmark, the $90 UTG looked crystal clear in ideal lighting conditions. I cringe when I think about the review I gave it on the PA site. 

    Basically, it’s my own fault that I don’t trust reviews because I’m worried that other people might be like me….

     I know that nobody likes to be told that their baby is ugly but for people that don’t want to hear something negative about something they just purchased, the lesson is to read up on the brand before you buy instead of after. 

    With me, the scopes that didn’t hit the mark tend to get pushed down onto the rifles I don’t use very often. That old UTG is currently on my Career 707 25 as it’s too loud for garden. I usually use it at the range with iron sights which shows what I think of the scope. 

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    JoeWayneRhea
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    Air gun scopes are marketed like TV sets at Walmart . Same size , but that’s about it :).

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    zebra
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    “JoeWayneRhea”Air gun scopes are marketed like TV sets at Walmart . Same size , but that’s about it :).

    
You mean that they look the same on the outside because two brands use the manufacturer so you can’t tell that one has clear glass and the other uses milk bottles?

    It’s the same with buying cameras, projectors, tv’s and scopes. Crappy models have specs that look the same as ones 10x the price and you can’t find a difference until you see one in the flesh. 

    Luckily for Walmart, it seems to have escaped most people’s attention that it isn’t a saving if you are just paying less for lower quality. I.e. You haven’t necessarily got a good deal if you pay less for silver than you did for gold. 

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    JoeWayneRhea
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    Zebra that’s exactly right …If you have a budget of say 300$ and you get 35 color lighted reticles , side focus , free rings , Silver folding hard case , flip up scope caps , Extra heavy discount on next purchase from that dealer , 30mm tube , Resettable turrets , laminated mildot charts , and a free flashlight and folding knife .And ALL OF THIS FOR THE LOW LOW PRICE OF 300$ !!!!…Believe me they are selling you the sizzle , not the steak .
    The Money for all the extras has to come outta somewhere , odds are it came outta the glass and quality of construction.

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    sharroff
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    Dang it, and here I went and spent $1,000+ and all I got was a crystal clear scope at 50x with turrets that work and a side wheel good for ranging to only 55 yards.  And it even came in a cardboard box!  I’m definitely going to Wally Mart next time for my DeLux scope.

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    JoeWayneRhea
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    Dude yep they screwed you !!! Did you at LEAST get a free cap ? Or Coozie?

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    Marksman3006
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    This entire thread is funny……and 100% accurate. I look at it like this. My mounts and scope are my tires. Now…..when was the last time you saw a formula one racecar running bargain bin tires? The mounts are VERY important….and so is the scope!! Im not suggesting everyone needs a thousand dollar scope. However, and its been said already, dont ever look thru a badass scope unless you are prepared to be cursed. It plants a seed in you, that grows…..and grows……until one day you spend more than you ever thought you would on a scope. Guns come and go…….badass scopes tend to stay put and moved from rifle to rifle….whichever rifle is your fav for the time being.

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    sharroff
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    JoeWayneRhea,

    Nope, no free cap or coozie.  Just a catalog so I knew where to send more of my money.  I definitely messed up and shopped at the wrong place.

    Marksman3006,

    Wow, you got this figured out and narrowed it down to putting that scope on your favorite rifle!!  I messed up big time again!!  I put one on the favorite .177, one on the favorite .22 and one on the new favorite .30.  And I have a .25 on the way.  They better stop inventing calibers or I’m heading to the poorhouse for sure.  And if anyone gets within 50 yard of me with one of those top end Kahles K 1050’s I’m gonna run so fast the other way those Olympic runners are gonna seem slow.



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    Marksman3006
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    sharroffJoeWayneRhea,

    Nope, no free cap or coozie.  Just a catalog so I knew where to send more of my money.  I definitely messed up and shopped at the wrong place.

    Marksman3006,

    Wow, you got this figured out and narrowed it down to putting that scope on your favorite rifle!!  I messed up big time again!!  I put one on the favorite .177, one on the favorite .22 and one on the new favorite .30.  And I have a .25 on the way.  They better stop inventing calibers or I’m heading to the poorhouse for sure.  And if anyone gets within 50 yard of me with one of those top end Kahles K 1050’s I’m gonna run so fast the other way those Olympic runners are gonna seem slow.



    Alot of it boils down to my budget. No way could I afford that many scopes of that quality. I can however own whatever scope I want……but just one for now. That is why its going on my most accurate gun. My other guns are mere mortals and are not worthy. Now…..if I had two insanely accurate guns I would be in trouble. That will probably happen at some point too. Im beginning to believe I got a really good wolverine B. I was watching my pellets drop right into sparrows at 70 and 80 yards this morning. No spiraling. I have confidence with my wolverine. You know what Im talking about too. Not every rifle I own is like that. Its like……..if I grab the wolverine….its a done deal before I even squeeze the trigger. I truly want to put some good glass on this one. Im probably going to stick around the 1500 dollar mark for the scope. Im flexible to go above that point…..but at some point the law of diminishing returns starts to trump how much I want to spend.

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    sharroff
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    Marksmam3006,

    The Daystate  CR-X and Airwolf MCT are both 3/8 at 55 with sorted pellets and me doing my part.  They deserve their scopes.   I haven’t had a chance to walk the RAW 30 out there yet, but based on Jim’s (Precision Air) two proof targets it’s a one hole gun at 50 so it will get to keep it’s scope too.  

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    Marksman3006
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    sharroffMarksmam3006,

    The Daystate  CR-X and Airwolf MCT are both 3/8 at 55 with sorted pellets and me doing my part.  They deserve their scopes.   I haven’t had a chance to walk the RAW 30 out there yet, but based on Jim’s (Precision Air) two proof targets it’s a one hole gun at 50 so it will get to keep it’s scope too.  

    Im not saying they dont. All three of those rifles are awesome. Your raw 30 will probably/should be your most accurate too at long range. Give me enough time and I will probably accumulate more than one expensive scope as well.

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    sharroff
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    it’s a great feeling to have a gun like that Wolverine.  Do yourself a favor a put a “I will not sell this gun due to upgradeitis” sticker on it!

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    Pope_on_Dope
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    In my opinion, the new Optisan EVX scopes are great for their price. I have one and I am absolutely satisfied with it. Yeah, sure – it ain´t a Schmidt&Bender and is still far from Leupold, Zeiss and Swarovksi but… it is a really decent scope that will hold its zero, the turrets work and the crosshairs will reliably adjust as well as the parallax does. 

    I certainly can tell the difference between a 200 and a 400 dollar scope but from 400 upwards the law of diminishing returns grabs more and more. I honestly couldn´t  tell the difference of a 1.500 and a 3.000 dollar scope just by looking through it. Maybe some people have better eyes or they see things I don´t see but with regard to the fact that an airgun shooter will mostly keep within 150 yards I don´t see much use in buying more than a Optisan or possibly Hawke (I agree that the Hawkes are somewhat overpriced, though). 

    Having looked through a 5000 dollar Schmidt and Bender and some 1500 – 3000 Leupold, Zeiss and Swarovskis, I know that they are amazing and I´d love to own one of those. But certainly not for this kind of money. Its just my opinion and in no way any advice.

    I think that the parallax is one of the most important features besides a decent lens as parallax error can shift your POI really significantly. 

    Its a shame that FFP scopes are so expensive as this a superb feature to have…
     

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    JoeWayneRhea
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    just got this email this morning from Natchez …While these aren’t ” top” quality in the 1000$+ range. I’ve had some really nice Weavers in Las few years, but they are like a lot of companies, if you move up to their mid price range and over they’re nice .

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    zebra
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    “Pope_on_Dope”In my opinion, the new Optisan EVX scopes are great for their price. I have one and I am absolutely satisfied with it. Yeah, sure – it ain´t a Schmidt&Bender and is still far from Leupold, Zeiss and Swarovksi but… it is a really decent scope that will hold its zero, the turrets work and the crosshairs will reliably adjust as well as the parallax does. 

    I certainly can tell the difference between a 200 and a 400 dollar scope but from 400 upwards the law of diminishing returns grabs more and more. I honestly couldn´t  tell the difference of a 1.500 and a 3.000 dollar scope just by looking through it. Maybe some people have better eyes or they see things I don´t see but with regard to the fact that an airgun shooter will mostly keep within 150 yards I don´t see much use in buying more than a Optisan or possibly Hawke (I agree that the Hawkes are somewhat overpriced, though). 

    Having looked through a 5000 dollar Schmidt and Bender and some 1500 – 3000 Leupold, Zeiss and Swarovskis, I know that they are amazing and I´d love to own one of those. But certainly not for this kind of money. Its just my opinion and in no way any advice.

    I think that the parallax is one of the most important features besides a decent lens as parallax error can shift your POI really significantly. 

    Its a shame that FFP scopes are so expensive as this a superb feature to have…
     

    
The issue with trying to identify the difference between a $200 and a $400 scope is that there may be none. Scopes don’t get better just because the price increases. 

    For the scopes I have seen (which is limited like with most people), I can usually tell the difference between good and average glass. You can’t see it in every view though. I find it easier to see against backgrounds with fine detail – just like with hd and sd TV screens. You can tell things are HD when there are blades of grass or strands of hair on the image. It’s harder to tell with an all white screen. The more detail you can see, the more you can fine tune your aim. 

    Fundimentally, that is the difference between expensive glass and lower quality stuff – clarity and light transmission. It has nothing to do with features like high magnification or illuminated reticles. Those things are found on low quality scopes too. 

    The question I find harder to answer is how much benefit do you get from a $1,000 scope when shooting target at 30 or 50 yards with an air rifle. With precision shooting at 800 yards, it’s easier to explain. What can someone with a $1,000 scope see that I can’t at 30 yards if I can clearly see the target?

    I was comparing a $120 3-9×42 to a $350 3-9×32, a $200 6-24×50 and a new $230 4-14×44 today. I could see better with the 3-9×32 at 4x than I could with the 6-24×50 at any power setting. The 4-14×44 also wiped the floor with the 6-24, even though their price was similar. 

     

     

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    zebra
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    “sharroff”JoeWayneRhea,

    Nope, no free cap or coozie.  Just a catalog so I knew where to send more of my money.  I definitely messed up and shopped at the wrong place.

    Marksman3006,

    Wow, you got this figured out and narrowed it down to putting that scope on your favorite rifle!!  I messed up big time again!!  I put one on the favorite .177, one on the favorite .22 and one on the new favorite .30.  And I have a .25 on the way.  They better stop inventing calibers or I’m heading to the poorhouse for sure.  And if anyone gets within 50 yard of me with one of those top end Kahles K 1050’s I’m gonna run so fast the other way those Olympic runners are gonna seem slow.




    I was wondering who stole the hubcaps from my car. Now I see they are being sold off for scope  side-wheels…

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    sharroff
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    Zebra,
    I’ll bet you AJ’s  Mrods and BWalrons BT65’s will kill a chipmunk / bird / squirrel just as dead at 50 yards as an Impact that is twice the price.  And we know AJ and Bwalton have proven performance.  By the same logic why would anyone want an Impact at 2x cost?

     

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    Marksman3006
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    There is alot of engineering that goes into scopes. I believe, opinion only, a precision scope is harder to make than an entire air rifle. A really good optic has to have precision ground lenses throughout. The erector system and turrets have extremely tight tolerances and go together like a swiss watch. The tell tale sign of more expensive scopes is tracking. Being able to dial in your range and repeatedly return to zero every time. Having the turrets dial exactly what the reticle is telling you. Having a mil reticle with mil turrets match up perfectly…..like shoot one shot….measure both horizontal and verticle in the reticle…..dial in the adjustment…..next shot dead center. When you look at the lenses, the erector system, matching reticle and precision turrets……all crammed into a small package its no wonder precision engineered scopes cost so much. Thats my opinion/2 cents. Not trying to offend here.

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