I'll bet that if the target distances were marked were marked the scores wouldn't change much!
Target range in FT match
- Thread starter Skip-in-WV
- Start date
It really is a bit more complex issue than it would seem however for a couple of years Delaware County Field and Stream made all of the target distances known. I did not clean the course however it made it a lot easier and most of us did better. I don't want to do it but it sure speeds things up!
Rick B.
Rick B.
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It would make a difference ... especially in the Hunter divisions where Scope X maximum is 16 and ranging gets soft for most past 40 yards.
I only wish Shooting FT at a high level was just knowing ranges !!! ..... Nope a WHOLE lot more going on !
I only wish Shooting FT at a high level was just knowing ranges !!! ..... Nope a WHOLE lot more going on !
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If the top shooters relied on the marked distances, then their scores would likely drop a little bit.
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Could you elaborate on this ? I am thinking of going known distance at my events to reduce scope costs.
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If ranges were posted at FT events...I would not use them.
If you already have a following of shooters at your club, how will posting ranges reduce any costs?
Changing the rules of the game will probably guarantee that serious competitors won’t come to your matches, though.
Mike
If you already have a following of shooters at your club, how will posting ranges reduce any costs?
Changing the rules of the game will probably guarantee that serious competitors won’t come to your matches, though.
Mike
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Definitely change in hunter getting higher scores but also in every division except Freestyle which is technically not a division.
I absolutely hated not knowing what the actual distance was in hunter! Hated using 12x, but at least it's 16x now, both of which are stupid rules anyway.
I shoot Freestyle and use a laser range finder, I know exactly how far each target is. So if I miss it's that I somehow screwed up the shot, or mistook what the wind was doing, or maybe both.
Often it's only a point between 1st and 2nd place, and it could be that a target was 52Y vs 55Y, and the distance was miss ranged?? Along the same line is maybe someones scope is more sensitive to temps which then gives them a miss read. Or in my case having type 2 diabetes, my eyes fluctuate so ranging with a scope gets funky at times.
I absolutely hated not knowing what the actual distance was in hunter! Hated using 12x, but at least it's 16x now, both of which are stupid rules anyway.
I shoot Freestyle and use a laser range finder, I know exactly how far each target is. So if I miss it's that I somehow screwed up the shot, or mistook what the wind was doing, or maybe both.
Often it's only a point between 1st and 2nd place, and it could be that a target was 52Y vs 55Y, and the distance was miss ranged?? Along the same line is maybe someones scope is more sensitive to temps which then gives them a miss read. Or in my case having type 2 diabetes, my eyes fluctuate so ranging with a scope gets funky at times.
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Our Canada friends have tried posting yardages. Maybe Tim McSwain or someone could give their insights. It seemed to work for them.
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I personally would rather see AFFTA change their scoring system to 5 points when hitting the target vs. the ZIP everyone gets right now. This most likely won't change the top scorers much but it would allow everyone to shoot higher scores and maybe hook the newbies long enough to give them time to mature in the game. The way the game is stacked now we tend to drive away new shooters that are embarrassed by their ability.
I will be holding a Field Target orientation for some new shooters in a Rod & Gun Club I just joined. Out of the 4 to 8 shooters I expect or hope to attend that is the way I will teach them to score each other.(10 for a knock down, 5 for a face plate hit, and zero for a complete miss.) If their interest is good maybe we'll get together and shoot twice a month. Back in my 3-D bowhunter days this was the same way we scored and it kept newbies coming back.
By the way about five years ago I held a AFFTA shoot where the shooter had the opportunity to pick up a card on a clip board hanging on a nearby post and read the distance to the targets on each lane. I don't think anyone even used them.
I will be holding a Field Target orientation for some new shooters in a Rod & Gun Club I just joined. Out of the 4 to 8 shooters I expect or hope to attend that is the way I will teach them to score each other.(10 for a knock down, 5 for a face plate hit, and zero for a complete miss.) If their interest is good maybe we'll get together and shoot twice a month. Back in my 3-D bowhunter days this was the same way we scored and it kept newbies coming back.
By the way about five years ago I held a AFFTA shoot where the shooter had the opportunity to pick up a card on a clip board hanging on a nearby post and read the distance to the targets on each lane. I don't think anyone even used them.
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There is something to what you are saying Bill.
If the goal is to make people feel better about their shooting...why not just make it 10 points for a hit and 9 points for a faceplate hit? Since the difference between a hit and a miss is still just one point...nothing should change within divisions. The top guys will still be within a point or so of each other and the newbies can hit half the targets and still shoot a 570/600.
In reality it bothers me that we should need to fool people into believing they are closer to the top than they are, but it probably would help some stay in the game.
I would say just leave wftf alone and let them do the normal scoring ...after all, it is a world game and that should be preserved.
Mike
If the goal is to make people feel better about their shooting...why not just make it 10 points for a hit and 9 points for a faceplate hit? Since the difference between a hit and a miss is still just one point...nothing should change within divisions. The top guys will still be within a point or so of each other and the newbies can hit half the targets and still shoot a 570/600.
In reality it bothers me that we should need to fool people into believing they are closer to the top than they are, but it probably would help some stay in the game.
I would say just leave wftf alone and let them do the normal scoring ...after all, it is a world game and that should be preserved.
Mike
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No I dont. Open class. There are so many things that come into play to make a shot. Wind, light, temperature, wobbles, trigger control, incorrect holdover, mental status, bad pellets, etc.
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I guess the Unlimited Class are dominating the events with top score and frequently cleaned courses?
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"There are so many things that come into play to make a shot. Wind, light, temperature, wobbles, trigger control, incorrect holdover, mental status, bad pellets, etc." Agreed.
However the handicap of virtually guessing distances beyond 40-45 yards due to 16X ranging shortcomings is the reason I disagree with your original statement, "if the target distances were marked were marked the scores wouldn't change much" Skip. BTW, my disagreement only applies to Hunter shooters. Otherwise I agree with you.
However the handicap of virtually guessing distances beyond 40-45 yards due to 16X ranging shortcomings is the reason I disagree with your original statement, "if the target distances were marked were marked the scores wouldn't change much" Skip. BTW, my disagreement only applies to Hunter shooters. Otherwise I agree with you.
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Boy ... some activity on the subject today !!
Knowing or having a good grasp on wind dynamics plays a HUGE roll in higher success level FT ... this directly tied to the caliber and speed / weight of pellet shot.
Gun hold CONSISTENCY doing the same damn thing best you can on EACH & EVERY shot taken. This includes FOLLOW THREW & a Natural point of aim every time.
Knowing HOW TOO shoot well when outside your comfort zone be it Angles, Odd seating position, small shooter box etc ...
Holding STILL in spite wind buffeting and the tricks ( pending position you typically shoot ) that apply to said position and still staying within the rules.
Tho more .... being keen enough to read the target face !!! See where others are hitting / missing while noting whom and there @ skill level in general noted .... Understand they know what there doing too and what some or many may or may not be doing for correction could be Too much or Too little ?
Now as too the 12X in hunter being a handicap .... Thats debatable to a point being there are many many instances where a hunter class shooter hangs with or beats the open or WFTF shooters. Even more so in recent years sense we went to 16X
If the GAME of Field Target was easy and if we shot lasers, scores would be a lot higher ... But we shoot pellets that fall in gravity, move in the wind and only go in the direction operator of rifle sends them. All the rest is an acquired skill set to do that effectively.
Scott S
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Hey Don
In Canada, we have never posted distances for matches. In hunter, we do give two for a knockdown and one for a target hit. However, in hunter your yardage markings must be covered and you cannot click. So ranging is by eye or bracketing and almost 100% up here just range by eye. We have had a few US shooters come up who use bracketing.
We believe that ranging, whether it is by eye, bracketing or using your scope is a skill that you can continually improve on. Scopes that shift with temperature changes can be figured out and compensated for and the shooter who does the best job gets the extra hit or two.
Tim
In Canada, we have never posted distances for matches. In hunter, we do give two for a knockdown and one for a target hit. However, in hunter your yardage markings must be covered and you cannot click. So ranging is by eye or bracketing and almost 100% up here just range by eye. We have had a few US shooters come up who use bracketing.
We believe that ranging, whether it is by eye, bracketing or using your scope is a skill that you can continually improve on. Scopes that shift with temperature changes can be figured out and compensated for and the shooter who does the best job gets the extra hit or two.
Tim
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Even at 16x, focus range finding is still a fairly simple/affective method of ranging FT distances, so that's what AAFTA Hunter Division shooters do these days. And these days, 80% of the Hunter Division shooters are sporting scopes of 24x or higher. Higher magnification scopes continue to get more common/popular among airgun shooters in general. So if the limit is based on common scopes, AAFTA should probably raise the Hunter Division magnification limit again. They raised it from 12x to 16x a few years ago. At some point Hunter Division shooters are going to have to quit complaining about the magnification limit being a huge disadvantage..
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I think the time to quit complaining has arrived. I lobbied for 24x hunter scopes during the last huge debate about Hunter Division and we were given 16x. As it turns out this was probably the best compromise as it has leveled the playing for AAFTA field target competitions. At any given match the odds of the top score for the day coming from Hunter, Open or WFTF are about equal, so we can now all equally complain about how the other division has some type of competitive advantage based upon equipment, rules etc.
I am always intrigued by how we try to entice new shooters into joining us by figuring out ways to inflate their scores. I'm pretty sure that no matter how you count it a shooter knows that he hit 5 out of 50 targets in a match and that is not good. They will either be inspired to learn how to improve or they will decide this game is not for them. This is why I have all the respect in the world for piston shooters, you talk about having no ego
.The skills you need to develop to be successful in field target are universal shooting skills that will apply to all shooting sports, tinkering with the rules doesn't change this. At the end of the day the hardest working, most talented shooters will be at the top of the pile.
Jim in Sacramento
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