Piston seal lube, what to use?

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Dang. And I just bought these on Amazon yesterday...
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30w silicone oil;
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I rolled the dice and tried a product that I have never read being used in spring gun and much less behind the piston seal. I had a can of Synthetic brake caliper lube in my garage and figured what the heck. It is synthetic and designed for "high-temperatures". I had taken the d48 apart so many times recently that the thought of doing it one more time wasn't a big deal if the grease didn't perform well.

So far I have been very pleased with how the Permatex 24110 worked for me. Disclaimer - I am not a pro-tuner and I have maybe 150 pellets through the gun now so this is not a long-term evaluation. I applied a moderate amount to the spring, guide tube, the outside of the d48 compression tube, and a very small amount to the area behind the seal on the piston. I have not smelled any dieseling nor has there been any detonation. 

Here are the chrony numbers with CPHPs; 56 shots over the chrony:

High = 816
Low = 800
Average = 810
ES = 16
SD = 3
FPE = 21.4

Note: I had my chrony pretty far away to allow it enough light to read so add 10 fps to the numbers above to show the speed at a normal (3-feet) chrony distance.
 
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When using Krytox, you should remove all traces of petroleum lubricants. Not that things will explode, but the characteristics of Krytox will be compromised if contaminated with a petroleum product.

Sometimes it is hard to keep them separated. For instance, if you use Krytox on the seal and a tar on the spring, who knows what will happen in a few hundred shots with the movement that takes place in a spring gun? There just may be a crossover of sorts.
 
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mcoulter said:
I rolled the dice and tried a product that I have never read being used in spring gun and much less behind the piston seal. I had a can of Synthetic brake caliper lube in my garage and figured what the heck. It is synthetic and designed for "high-temperatures". I had taken the d48 apart so many times recently that the thought of doing it one more time wasn't a big deal if the grease didn't perform well.

So far I have been very pleased with how the Permatex 24110 worked for me. Disclaimer - I am not a pro-tuner and I have maybe 150 pellets through the gun now so this is not a long-term evaluation. I applied a moderate amount to the spring, guide tube, the outside of the d48 compression tube, and a very small amount to the area behind the seal on the piston. I have not smelled any dieseling nor has there been any detonation.

Here are the chrony numbers with CPHPs; 56 shots over the chrony:

High = 816
Low = 800
Average = 810
ES = 16
SD = 3
FPE = 21.4

Note: I had my chrony pretty far away to allow it enough light to read so add 10 fps to the numbers above to show the speed at a normal (3-feet) chrony distance.
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seems fast, must be dieseling!
 
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I have used Ultimox 226, Krytox 224 and Krytox 223 and they all work well and no detonation or dieseling. These all have a anti
corrosion additive, but the 205 will work just as good. as said above strip all old grease off and out of everything, even then usually the first time it’s used it will still find and leech out the old grease, you’ll know this because it will turn the white Krytox grease dark. Over time when the rifle is taken apart and cleaned out again it will stay white once all the old lubes have been completely Stripped away.
Krytox works in cold and heat and it stays on the metal parts requiring a special remover to completely strip it off of the metal (according to dupont website) I would think brake cleaner would work though. It only requires a really thin coating, no need to glob it on everything.
If your spring is twangy then you need a tighter fitting guide, not globed on grease or tar.
 
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bustachip said:
I have used Ultimox 226, Krytox 224 and Krytox 223 and they all work well and no detonation or dieseling. These all have a anti
corrosion additive, but the 205 will work just as good. as said above strip all old grease off and out of everything, even then usually the first time it’s used it will still find and leech out the old grease, you’ll know this because it will turn the white Krytox grease dark. Over time when the rifle is taken apart and cleaned out again it will stay white once all the old lubes have been completely Stripped away.
Krytox works in cold and heat and it stays on the metal parts requiring a special remover to completely strip it off of the metal (according to dupont website) I would think brake cleaner would work though. It only requires a really thin coating, no need to glob it on everything.
If your spring is twangy then you need a tighter fitting guide, not globed on grease or tar.
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This is excellent information. I've used Krytox professionally on trains for 15 years and personally on airguns. I have converted several guns back and forth between Krytox and petroleum based lubes.

I just wanted to add that brake parts cleaner is sufficient to remove Krytox if you ever want to revert to petroleum lubes. I've done it several times without any problems.
 
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bustachip said:
I have used Ultimox 226, Krytox 224 and Krytox 223 and they all work well and no detonation or dieseling. These all have a anti
corrosion additive, but the 205 will work just as good. as said above strip all old grease off and out of everything, even then usually the first time it’s used it will still find and leech out the old grease, you’ll know this because it will turn the white Krytox grease dark. Over time when the rifle is taken apart and cleaned out again it will stay white once all the old lubes have been completely Stripped away.
Krytox works in cold and heat and it stays on the metal parts requiring a special remover to completely strip it off of the metal (according to dupont website) I would think brake cleaner would work though. It only requires a really thin coating, no need to glob it on everything.
If your spring is twangy then you need a tighter fitting guide, not globed on grease or tar.
Click to expand...
Would that actually be best for a hand pump + pcp too, for the hand pump; assuming some of it will end up going through the tank and so on of the pcp?
 
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JDGriz said:
Would that actually be best for a hand pump + pcp too, for the hand pump; assuming some of it will end up going through the tank and so on of the pcp?
Click to expand...
I don’t own any PCP’s or hand pumps so I can’t comment on that equipment. Krytox does work well on o-rings and other stuff. I would do the research online about the various uses of krytox
concerning your application. Dupont has a lot of information available concerning there products and applications.
 
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One thing I'll add about Krytox that I found out the hard way. Krytox isn't supposed to burn or diesel but if you can't get sloppy with it in a piston gun. You will get something similar to the smoke you'll see from traditional dieseling. I'm not sure what that's from. It may just be vaporized excess Krytox. Just be sure to use minimal amounts and use the same traditional precautions about getting it front of the piston seal. Very little is required on a piston.

As good as Krytox is I still prefer traditional moly paste on break barrel pivots and chisel detents. I have more faith in Moly staying put in these high load non temperature sensitive applications.
 
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