New Version of the FWB 124

This question just came up on another forum, so I am just copying my response I posted there.



I had one,and the ones I have seen and herd about have massive barrel droop. 

The bluing is also different on many parts, it's nice but not the same on many parts of the gun. Like they came from different suppliers. 

I never could get the gun to shoot better than 3 inches at 50 yds.

I have two 124's and a 127, all are much better guns than the new sport that I "had" !

good luck with yours, they are a elegant rifle. 

Hairsmith

that's not a sale at AOA but this is

http://www.champchoice.com/store/Main.aspx?p=ItemDetailOptions&item=32998

this was posted on Sunday and they had 55 listed in stock and today they have 55 list in stock

if they really do have 55 it will give time to think about if not you might have past up a great price but after these sell what are those 800.00 rifles worth

how they shoot, I don't know but they are made by FWB

I bought one used, right after they were introduced. It had some barrel droop so I bent the barrel for scope use. It may well be the best factory trigger I’ve ever shot on a sporter springer. I love the way it comes to the shoulder off hand.

I did a side-by-side shoot off. My original 124 purchased in 1980, vs the new sporter. The accuracy was virtually identical. The new sport is easier to shoot, as the trigger is slightly better. My old 124 was tuned by David Slade. 

Attached is 



a picture of groups shot with the new sporters few years ago. The smaller group was shot at 46 yards and measures under a quarter inch center to center. The larger group was shot at 100 yards, very difficult with any Springer. It was well under a inch and a half.

Some people don’t like it, because it’s very different. That’s OK, we all don’t need to like every rifle. In my opinion at $500 it’s an absolute steal. Especially if you use it to shoot with open sights.

Mike

... so I bent the barrel for scope use.

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You did WHAT?! 
Some folks...

Next time, try shimming your scope mounts. A lot safer procedure that won't potentially result in a FUBAR rifle.

I bought one last year. Very nice stock, nice bluing, very nice trigger, overall quality feel. It only did about 8.5fpe. No matter what pellets I tried, low, low fpe. I figured I had a lemon, so I returned it for an exchange. The replacement produced...........9fpe. 

I live at 5600feet above sea level but I was seeing much greater reduction in energy than I see in my other springers. 

The shot cycle on both guns was absolutely abysmal. Least enjoyable shot cycle I've ever felt in a springer (Chinese cheapos, HW77k, RX2, HW50s/50/35/80, Diana 34, TX200, FWB300, LGU, Mendoza Diana 52/54, FWB124, etc .) Seriously bad shot cycle. Id rather go shoot two boxes of ammo through my 30.06 than 40 shots through the two new Sports I tried. Harsh, loud, jumpy, bad, bad, bad. 

So two big gripes: both specimens only produced about 60-65% of advertised energy, AND THE GOSH AWFUL SHOT CYCLE!!!

Of the guns I have tried and decided weren't for me, I was the most disappointed with the Sport. It remains the gun that I really wanted to love, but just couldn't. 

The argument can be made that a tune could have helped some of that out...... the initial price point, coupled with the fact that the gun supposedly had some design flaws, made me rule out starting the sometimes long journey of tuning a springer. I understand the spring is very thick diameter wire and very large in general. Beautiful gun, but in my opinion, a swing and a miss by the FWB engineers. 

.............dude...yall leave me an one unopened one the3re in tennysee ........... they're said to be really pellet fussy , bu8t after that's overcome - long range groups.... really out there on no wind days..

 If someone challenged me to a contest on who could shoot a smaller 75 or hundred yard group with a 17 caliber break barrel airgun, I would be very tempted to grab the FWB sport. I realize those are fairly narrow constraints, but that’s why we have more than one airgun. 

And as far as the comments above go on bending the barrel...It was way too much of a difference to shim. Which is why I very carefully bent the barrel, Apparently with great success based on the groups it shoots.

Not my first rodeo. 

Mike

Correcting "barrel angle" for the purpose of using a receiver sight is nothing new, companies and smiths have been bending barrels for a long time.

Correcting "barrel angle" for the purpose of using a receiver sight is nothing new, companies and smiths have been bending barrels for a long time.

Click to expand...

I'm an international competition shooter, gunsmith and have been playing around in the marvellous world of guns for over 34 years now, but I've never ever heard this kind of nonsense before. You don't ever bend barrels for the sole purpose of changing the sight line. For one, canting will become a HUGE issue if you do. Second, you have to have very special measuring and bending tools in order to do this without changing the inner diameter of your barrel which will result in inevitable loss of accuracy. And last but not least, bending just doesn't make sense in any way, because changing the sights by using risers, scope mount shims, MOA rails or adjustable scope mounts, is cheaper and safer.

Ask any gun smith or gun manufacturer of bending a barrel makes sense in any possible way, and the answer will be either be "are you serious?" or "have you completely lost your marbles?". 

Mr. Jonnes,

I’ve always believed there is more than one opinion for any discussion, let alone the discussion of accurate shooting and rifles. 

A good friend of mine, and one of the most renowned air gun gunsmiths in the world, is Allen Zasadny. He is known as AZ. He mechanically and optically centers all of the rifles he tunes. He does this by bending the barrels. This is very important. If you’re off side to side, a small deviation close up becomes a huge deviation further out. Rifles AZ has tuned, have won thousands of Airgun matches. There are no issues with “cant” (i’m not sure how you could create “cant” issues when bending to change point of impact up and down anyway. Which is what I adjusted on the FWB. Would like to hear from the engineers out there on that topic). Ideally, on a target rifle, you want to be in the optical center of your scope. This is extremely important in field target, because you’re using the scope as a rangefinder. For instance if you buy a $4000 March scope, and you’re not optical centered, it won’t be crisp and clean at the distances you need to range accurately. You may as well put a $300 scope on your $3000 FT rifle. I just spoke with AZ. He said he bent about a dozen barrels in the last week, and has bent thousands in his career.

I also discussed this years ago, with John Whiscombe (JW). He bent barrels all the time. This was because he was designing and building the most expensive air rifles ever manufactured, and he wanted them mechanically centered to the action. A high-condition used JW today, brings more than it’s original sale price. He must know something (he’s a genius). 

The FWB rifle we are discussing in this post, is called a spring piston air gun. The propulsion is delivered, by a piston, driven by a powerful spring, which is released and flies quickly down a chamber on the rifle. Attached to the end of the chamber is a rifle bore (barrel). This piston action is magnificently violent. Even if the rifle is tuned for smoothness, it creates huge vibrations. These vibrations are well known to destroy scopes and mounts. I can’t imagine using adjustable scope rings on a springer. I do use them on PCP’s all the time (but not on my competition rifles, those are all optically and mechanically centered). There have been thousands of posts online over the years, discussing the vibration caused in spring piston air guns. In my mind, it is what makes them so much fun to shoot accurately. It is much more challenging than shooting a PCP. That said, this vibration causes consternation. Both in the form of equipment failure, and just plain making it difficult to paint small groups at long range. You absolutely want the least number of moving and adjustable parts in your mounting apparatus on a springer, period. 

This discussion would not apply to firearms... but of course this is an air gun forum. 

Mike

Correcting "barrel angle" for the purpose of using a receiver sight is nothing new, companies and smiths have been bending barrels for a long time.

Click to expand...

I'm an international competition shooter, gunsmith and have been playing around in the marvellous world of guns for over 34 years now, but I've never ever heard this kind of nonsense before. You don't ever bend barrels for the sole purpose of changing the sight line. For one, canting will become a HUGE issue if you do. Second, you have to have very special measuring and bending tools in order to do this without changing the inner diameter of your barrel which will result in inevitable loss of accuracy. And last but not least, bending just doesn't make sense in any way, because changing the sights by using risers, scope mount shims, MOA rails or adjustable scope mounts, is cheaper and safer.

Ask any gun smith or gun manufacturer of bending a barrel makes sense in any possible way, and the answer will be either be "are you serious?" or "have you completely lost your marbles?".

Click to expand...

Nice shooting background. Now welcome to the world of airguns where you will learn new things. That's a fact. Hang in there.



John

This discussion would not apply to firearms... but of course this is an air gun forum.

Click to expand...

I am quite aware of the fact that we're talking about an (piston-driven) airgun. The rules (of physics) apply to any kind of technology that pushes a projectile down a barrel regardless of the power source, being it gunpowder or air. Canting on a bent barrel will be a problem, it's physics mate, just simple physics. 

It's something I wouldn't do, that's for sure.

but I've never ever heard this kind of nonsense before. You don't ever bend barrels

Click to expand...

Maybe someone should tell the Godfather of airgun tuning Randy Brimrose about this. His email address is "Barrel-bender". He has been around since the beginning of the spring gun era in the US.

Personally, I have had at least 2 barrels bent back to proper center after buying them bent upward. Yes bent upward! This happens when the rifle slams shut from spring release while open. It's a dangerous event and can cause bodily harm. The barrel afterwards is usually bent up and will shoot high no matter how much shimming is done. The only solution is to bend the barrel back. 

Flintstack is no amateur or crazy eyed mad scientist. His efforts and results speak for themselves. I'm not sure what all the fuss is about. But Mike....keep the faith!! There's always a doubter in the crowd. 

JC

Additional information about barrel bending can be found in a 5 part series in Tom Gaylords Blog. Very informative and interesting reading.

Thanks kingfisher.

I am certainly done responding to this thread. When you lay all the facts in front of someone, and they refuse to look at the other side of the coin, there’s nothing you can do. I also scratch my head when someone modifies their replies after the fact.

I get on these forums to have fun, share knowledge, and learn.

And my apologies to Flintstone ... for having his post hijacked. btw, great airgun forum handle!!!

thanks

mike

I really do like my FWB sport. They are not very popular, But mine shoots great!