All this happened on a Taipan Vetern .25 shorty shooting same unsorted pelletts out of same tin. I thought, even though The Veeran is fairly quiet, I wanted it quieter as I had seen critters startled and take off where my moderated WC II didn't scare them. Note:: When I placed the order with the distributor he said "Do Not put a moderator on that rifle. That's when accuracy problems begin." I ordered a Ronin and installed it. All I Could hear was the trigger slap. Great! But...I couldn't cover a group with a fat silver dollar at 50 yds. Can't be the Ronin. Tried another magazine with the same results. Since I had a Koi I wasn't using I replaced the Ronin with the Koi. The groups got much better but not like it was pre-moderator. Went back stock and except for an occasional flyer a quarter would cover the group. I guess now I"ll have a Ronin and a Koi I am not using. I'll just have to buy my next rifle making sure it is compatible with both moderators. This is NOT a reflection of Donny FL's moderators. For some weird reason they just don't seem to fit my Taipan, and maybe others (Why did the dealer warn me about accuracy problems) have found a solution.
Moderators...May anger some
- Thread starter Jim81
- Start date
Why "moderator" ? Just a new cool title ? A moderator is a person that keeps meetings in line..!
Why not what it actually is, silencer, suppressor, hell, by its action, it's can even be called a muffler.
I'm going to be modifying the "can" on a new rifle I just bought. When done, it will be very much like an automotive...muffler.
Mike
Why not what it actually is, silencer, suppressor, hell, by its action, it's can even be called a muffler.
I'm going to be modifying the "can" on a new rifle I just bought. When done, it will be very much like an automotive...muffler.
Mike
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Try a .30 caliber moderator for extra clearance. I have a Veteran .22 shorty with a .22 Donny FL moderator and no problems at all one year going strong.
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If the thread on the barrel is not plumb centre to the bore it can cause the mod to sit on the wonk, this could cause clipping, throwing pellets all over the place. Envelope if it doesn’t clip, not passing through the centre of the baffle or endcap can cause uneven pressure on the pellet pushing it off line.
Bb
Bb
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Is it a .25 DonnyFL? I had issues with my .25 DonnyFL Sumo on my .25 Vulcan Tactic. 50 yard groups about an 1.25" with Sumo, less than 1/2 inch without. Had the Sumo drilled out to same size as used on .30 Sumo (9.5mm) and now there is no difference with or without it. Didn't change the perceived loudness at all. FYI, don't try and do this by hand, or even with a drill press. You need to do it on a lathe where its perfectly centered...
PS., I always buy moderators one size up from the gun's bore. So for a .22, I get a .25 moderator. Lessens the chances of clipping or accuracy issues. The way I look at moderators is if they affect my POI, then something isn't right. The moderator is affecting the flight of your pellet (or slug) since without it the POI is different. I personally want the best accuracy that I can get, so if anything affects the pellet as it come out of the muzzle, you're affecting the flight of the projectile...Also, if it doesn't affect your POI, you can remove and install the moderator as many times as you want, since it does nothing to your accuracy or POI.
I know you've probably read on here that its normal for a moderator to affect POI, but IMHO that's total BS. Maybe your POI changes with the moderator, but you think that the group size is unaffected? I think maybe you haven't shot numerous groups with and without, and compared them. If it affects the POI, its affecting your overall precision and accuracy. PERIOD. Might only be a quarter inch at 50 yards, but it is affected. The only exception to that that I have seen is with a very heavy moderator like the DonnyFL Ronin, at the end of a flimsy barrel, like the 700mm STX on an FX Crown... In that case the POI might be affected, but in a strictly downward direction, without affecting accuracy and precision.
I have moderators on five of my guns, and NONE of them affect the POI in any way. If they do, I take them off or fix them (ream them out) so that they don't. Reaming out the bore of the moderator a mm or two doesn't adversely affect the perceived volume output of the gun.
PS., I always buy moderators one size up from the gun's bore. So for a .22, I get a .25 moderator. Lessens the chances of clipping or accuracy issues. The way I look at moderators is if they affect my POI, then something isn't right. The moderator is affecting the flight of your pellet (or slug) since without it the POI is different. I personally want the best accuracy that I can get, so if anything affects the pellet as it come out of the muzzle, you're affecting the flight of the projectile...Also, if it doesn't affect your POI, you can remove and install the moderator as many times as you want, since it does nothing to your accuracy or POI.
I know you've probably read on here that its normal for a moderator to affect POI, but IMHO that's total BS. Maybe your POI changes with the moderator, but you think that the group size is unaffected? I think maybe you haven't shot numerous groups with and without, and compared them. If it affects the POI, its affecting your overall precision and accuracy. PERIOD. Might only be a quarter inch at 50 yards, but it is affected. The only exception to that that I have seen is with a very heavy moderator like the DonnyFL Ronin, at the end of a flimsy barrel, like the 700mm STX on an FX Crown... In that case the POI might be affected, but in a strictly downward direction, without affecting accuracy and precision.
I have moderators on five of my guns, and NONE of them affect the POI in any way. If they do, I take them off or fix them (ream them out) so that they don't. Reaming out the bore of the moderator a mm or two doesn't adversely affect the perceived volume output of the gun.
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what CC said. I had same issue on a gun and did just that. Cleared right up. Now I have A veteran.22 with a Tatsu on it and it works perfect. Accuracy is not a problem.
My buddy recently had his Cricket modded by Charlie Frear and wanted a Sumo installed. Charlie said he fits several different ones to find one that works with that particular gun just because of the small variances in machining.
My buddy recently had his Cricket modded by Charlie Frear and wanted a Sumo installed. Charlie said he fits several different ones to find one that works with that particular gun just because of the small variances in machining.
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I have always been advised to buy a size up in the moderator from the projectile. .177 buy .22 mod. .22 buy .25 mod. .25 buy .30 mod.....
Following that advice I haven’t experienced any issues yet.
Following that advice I haven’t experienced any issues yet.
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Funny, I bought a DonnyFl moderator for my son’s Brocock Bantam in .22 a while back. Centercut told me buy the .25 cal. moderator. I thought, no, I’ll buy the .22 moderator, it’ll be fine. What do you know, the pellets clipped on about every third shot. Should have listened! I bored it out and it solved our problems. POI does change frequently with the use of a moderator but accuracy being ruined is uncommon and is almost always because of pellets clipping.
Stoti
Stoti
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Moderator is not a cool new title. It’s just one of many terms used to describe a device used to reduce the sound of a gun as it is fired.
https://www.google.com/search?safe=active&client=safari&channel=ipad_bm&source=hp&ei=b9QTXd7rDrLP0PEPgNaToAI&q=what+is+an+air+rifle+moderator&oq=what+is+an+airgun+mo&gs_l=mobile-gws-wiz-hp.1.0.0i22i30j33i22i29i30l2j33i299l2j33i160l3.3814.9558..11327...1.0..0.81.1106.20......0....1.......8..35i39j0i131j0j46i131j46j0i10j0i22i10i30.FSF9DDZpBS0#sbfbu=1&pi=what%20is%20an%20air%20rifle%20moderator
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chuck the baffle up in a lathe and drill it out to next size up 
randy_68 I think, I drilled your baffle out one drill size bigger than the original size. I did the same to the Tatsu on my Kozak. Donny says OK on bigger bore hole
randy_68 I think, I drilled your baffle out one drill size bigger than the original size. I did the same to the Tatsu on my Kozak. Donny says OK on bigger bore hole
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I make my own moderators, the only way a mod can clip is if there is a misalignment of the baffles to the bore. This is mostly cause by incorrect threading of the barrel, occasionally incorrect threading of the mod itself. If both the barrel and mod are machined correctly then the clearance between the pellet and bore of the baffles can be very tight without an issue . Typically I make the bore of the baffles 0.5mm bigger than the pellet.
Bb
Bb
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+1 to what BB said. I run personally .025" - .05" or ~1mm bigger than bore OD baffle (bigger the further out the baffles are from muzzle) on my .25 cal and experience no issues even with home made moderators that I self align with very primitive tooling...I've even shot a few double loads through my plastic moderators and they're still in one piece without any sign of clipping.
-Matt
-Matt
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Sent an email to Donny FL explained my situation. The guy must always work. He called me within about 3 hours of my mail and helped me sort it out. Here's the learning for me at least. By the way, it works perfectly so far. Grouping like it was before the Ronin.
One has to remove the stock end cap to put in the adapter for the 'silencer' (to appease at least one poster). The end cap did not want to come off using the steel dowels. I suspected lock tight so I removed the stock barrel shroud/silencer and heated the shroud around the endcap. Mistake #1. After a little bit the end cap came off. When I put the shroud back on it would thread into the end of the barell but would go beyond the end of the threads inside the shroud and then slide back and forth. The correct distance to the threads is determined by the placement of the baffles and spacers with the end cap in place. There's a compression effect of the end cap, baffles, spacers, pusing against the threaded part where the barrel screws into. Get that distance correct ( don't take off the shroud if you can) and it should be straightforward. There is a 2mm hex screw on the shroud that needs to be lossened if you have to take off the shroud.
Only put about20 shots through it with the readjused shroud and Ronin but they were all in a tight group. Can only hear the hammer strike now. And the Veteran Shorty looks bad a-- with that Ronin on it.
One has to remove the stock end cap to put in the adapter for the 'silencer' (to appease at least one poster). The end cap did not want to come off using the steel dowels. I suspected lock tight so I removed the stock barrel shroud/silencer and heated the shroud around the endcap. Mistake #1. After a little bit the end cap came off. When I put the shroud back on it would thread into the end of the barell but would go beyond the end of the threads inside the shroud and then slide back and forth. The correct distance to the threads is determined by the placement of the baffles and spacers with the end cap in place. There's a compression effect of the end cap, baffles, spacers, pusing against the threaded part where the barrel screws into. Get that distance correct ( don't take off the shroud if you can) and it should be straightforward. There is a 2mm hex screw on the shroud that needs to be lossened if you have to take off the shroud.
Only put about20 shots through it with the readjused shroud and Ronin but they were all in a tight group. Can only hear the hammer strike now. And the Veteran Shorty looks bad a-- with that Ronin on it.
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