Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence Wants to Curtail Your Rights

Forums General Discussion Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence Wants to Curtail Your Rights

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    Nueces
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    Non-Powder Guns

    KEY LEGISLATIVE ELEMENTSThe features listed below are intended to provide a framework from which policy options may be considered. A jurisdiction considering new legislation should consult with counsel.• Strict limits are imposed on the possession and sale of non-powder guns within the jurisdiction (New York City)
    • If the sale and possession of non-powder guns are permitted within the jurisdiction, the most comprehensive approach is to define all non-powder guns as firearms, so that restrictions on purchase and possession by minors, felons and other prohibited purchasers will apply (New Jersey, Rhode Island)
    • Alternatively, with respect to high-power and large caliber non-powder guns only:o all high-power and large caliber non-powder guns are defined as firearms, so that restrictions on purchase and possession by minors, felons and other prohibited persons will apply (Illinois, Michigan)o all transfers of high-power and large caliber non-powder guns are required to be made through a licensed firearms dealer, and the dealer is required to report all transfers to law enforcemento there is a registration mechanism for owners of high-power and large caliber non-powder guns• Minors are prohibited from possessing non-powder guns unless under direct adult supervision

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    We might want to think about this as we go to the polls in November.

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    Dcorvino
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    Wow 
    that’s not good 

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    Smaug
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    That kind of legislation has largely killed airgun sales other than the cheap Walmart stuff in my home state. (IL) If you have to go through a gun shop and have documents and a special place to shoot it, lots of the advantages of it being an airgun are gone.

    It sounds like they just became aware that airguns are not just Red Ryder BB guns any more, and they’re afraid someone’s going to go postal with a big bore PCP airgun.

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    gamyrick
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    zebra
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    New York City doesn’t allow any guns for private citizens. It’s not just airguns. Stores won’t even ship BB guns there. I can kinda see their point on that in Manhattan. They can’t have people firing air rifles out the window of their 50th floor apartments and there is nowhere safe to shoot anywhere in the city. 

    They are allowed outside the 5 boroughs though (apart from Yonkers). 

    I couldn’t get the link to work so please can you tell us what it relates to? I.e. Is someone trying to introduce federal legislation to restrict air gun sales? 

    If so, was there an event that prompted the sudden interest? I don’t watch the news that often but I can’t recall seeing anything about criminals using air guns to commit murders in large numbers. My PCP guns all seem entirely unsuitable for drive-by shootings and given the easy availability of powder burners across the country, it’s hard to believe air guns have become a gang-bangers tool of choice.

    When I saw the new Evanix Rex pistol in 9mm and 45 cal, my first thought was that the anti-gun people will use that as “exhibit A” one day. “Exhibit B” would be the 9mm Max in semi or full auto. 

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    gamyrick
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    According to a report by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention 235,000 people each year are taken to the emergency room because of injuries suffered in the bathroom. The bathroom is without question the most dangerous room in your house. Obviously, we need to protect ourselves and ban bathrooms. It amazes me, how personal responsibility has died in this country. Most of the deaths and serious injuries relating to air guns were the result of minors who were not properly supervised. 

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    Nueces
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    zebra,

    It is smartgunlaws dot org

    An organization dedicated to eventually overturning the second amendment.

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    zebra
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    I wouldn’t worry. They aren’t anywhere close to changing the 2nd amendment and even by their numbers, airguns cause an “average of 4 deaths per year”. It’s hard to imagine it getting significant air time at a federal level given how many more dangerous things they have to talk about. 

    The only thing I think might change that is if one is used in a school massacre. Then the fact that air guns are not covered by the 2nd amendment might make them a soft target and failing organizations like that would love an easy win to justify their existence. 

    Some people are too stupid to realize that they wouldn’t want to live in the world they are asking for – where everything that might be dangerous is banned. Cars cause a lot of deaths and I bet most of those people don’t like walking!

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    Nueces
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    Zebra,

    I accept your optimism but I can’t really share in it.  The banners love to ban.  Not just guns.  Eventually they will ban fun in general.  It’s part and parcel of a controlling mentality.   They never know when to stop.  The enemies of liberty grow more powerful each generation.

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    T3PRanch
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    @zebra  

    Airguns ARE covered by the second amendment which states “…….keep and bear arms…” which is construed to mean ANY weapon that can be used for defense.

    Thurmond 

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    Dan25
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    Zebra

    You couldn’t be further from correct.  We currently have a 4/4 split on the Supreme Ct. with one opening.  The court determines the meaning of the constitution and law.  If Clinton wins it will be 5/4 Anti Gun.  With the age of the justices she would no doubt get to appoint one or more.  It is just as simple as the Court redefining what the militia is and its Game Over no more private gun rights.

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    Smaug
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    “T3PRanch”@zebra  

    Airguns ARE covered by the second amendment which states “…….keep and bear arms…” which is construed to mean ANY weapon that can be used for defense.

    Thurmond 

    
It’s not just defense, Thurmond. The original intent was for the citizens to have the means to overthrow an oppressive government. 

    These days, it’s impossible here to overthrow the gov’t. An attempt these days would be labeled as terrorism. 

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    zebra
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    “T3PRanch”@zebra  

    Airguns ARE covered by the second amendment which states “…….keep and bear arms…” which is construed to mean ANY weapon that can be used for defense.

    Thurmond 

    
I know what it says but the actual wording has, for the most part, been interpreted as a right to own firearms. So far, air guns have been specifically excluded from federal firearms laws and they don’t fall under the ATF. As far as I know, organizations that lobby to protect the right to own firearms under the 2nd Amendment have shown no interest in protecting air guns. 

    I guess the larger potential problem is how they choose to interpret the 2nd Amendment moving forward. They don’t have to eliminate it to cause problems. A lot of people think of it almost like a god-given right for Americans to own guns. When you see the courts debating if it’s an “individual or collective right”, you can tell that they can choose to interpret it however they want (if they have enough support). The actual wording hasn’t been taken literally for a long time. They have already excluded certain groups and it has been ruled legal to exclude certain types of weapons in various States. 

    I think that our position should be that air guns are not covered under the 2nd because they are not weapons. They are sporting and recreation equipment that is not designed for use on humans. While they could kill people, so could kitchen knives or golf clubs but they aren’t an efficient tool for mass murder. 

    I can’t say I have researched murder weapons but, looking at how few airgun deaths there are in America, I would put money on there being more murders using baseball bats and kitchen knives. 

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    unionrdr
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    But those other objects aren’t easy targets for eliminating them from everyday life of the average human & still maintain some quality of life. They need their golf clubs, cars, baseball bats, kitchen knives, etc. Stupid humans need to start thinking things through & not blindly believing. Like this stupid video I stumbled onto today;

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    Verve
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    Maybe heading towards sub-12lbs power across the pond too ..

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    T3PRanch
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    Actually 1 entity has the RIGHT to determine the meaning of constitutional law. The Free Citizen of the Republic. The so called government is operating on “Privilege” issued to it BY the Free Citizens of the Republic. Is it out of control? Of course because too many stand by and play with their I-Gods and let the entire world go to hell with the attitude “it is not my problem”!

    A few statements from the founding Fathers:

    ” Any law that is NOT constitutional is not a law” James Madison

    I have sworn on the altar of GOD eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.
    Thomas Jefferson

    “To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” – Thomas Jefferson

    John Adams:  “Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. 
    It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other people.”

    The words of Patrick Henry are apropos:  “Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery?  Forbid it, Almighty God!  I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death!”  —–

    Thurmond    ​Make no mistake about it Democracy IS MOB Rule! The MOB of foreign peoples within our borders that have no interest in the principals this country was founded upon (or the many men and women that fought bled and died for) are growing to outnumber us rapidly. When they do outnumber us all IS lost! 

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    Bobbed06
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    “unionrdr”But those other objects aren’t easy targets for eliminating them from everyday life of the average human & still maintain some quality of life. They need their golf clubs, cars, baseball bats, kitchen knives, etc. Stupid humans need to start thinking things through & not blindly believing. Like this stupid video I stumbled onto today;

    
For cryin out loud, I hoped, just hoped that at least one person would have a clue…….

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    unionrdr
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    I know…I felt the same way watching it. waited for him to give the punch line,…but none was to be had. He should be prosecuted for this one. Besides, it looks like he’s holding an air rifle?…

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    zebra
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    “unionrdr”But those other objects aren’t easy targets for eliminating them from everyday life of the average human & still maintain some quality of life. They need their golf clubs, cars, baseball bats, kitchen knives, etc. Stupid humans need to start thinking things through & not blindly believing. Like this stupid video I stumbled onto today;

    
That’s the point. Part of the education for these people needs to be that it’s not a good idea to set the precedent of banning things that have the potential for danger just because they have no personal interest or, one day, another group will use that principle to ban something they are interested in. 
     

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    T3PRanch
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    Surely these people are NOT for real. How dumb can you be animal? Give me a break “Killed a Saber Tooth Tiger………….”!

    Thurmond

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