Is there any point in getting a First Focal Plane scope for an air gun?

Forums Optics, Scopes, Rings, & Mounts Is there any point in getting a First Focal Plane scope for an air gun?

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    Daxx
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    First Focal Plane scopes are for long range, right?  Why would anyone need an FFP scope on an air gun that shoots out to approximately 100 yards accurately?  What benefit would there be for us in hunting or competition?

    Daxx

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    pretbek
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    FFP scopes do not change the relation of the mil dot reticle to the target when you change the magnification. 

    So at ANY magnification “2 mil dots down for 85 yards” (for example) is true.

    On a SFP scope this would be true at 20x, but if you had dialed down to 10x it is now “1 mil for down for 85 yards”.

    So so on a FFP scope you never have to keep track of which magnification you are at, the mil dot relation is always correct. 

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    frambonian
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    “pretbek”FFP scopes do not change the relation of the mil dot reticle to the target when you change the magnification. 

    So at ANY magnification “2 mil dots down for 85 yards” (for example) is true.

    On a SFP scope this would be true at 20x, but if you had dialed down to 10x it is now “1 mil for down for 85 yards”.

    So so on a FFP scope you never have to keep track of which magnification you are at, the mil dot relation is always correct. 

    
Correct.  While pricey, they do make shooting easier!  I have one on my wish list  8)

    Here’s a video from Vortex that explains it:  http://www.vortexoptics.com/video/first_vs_second_focal_plane

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    30cal
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    I have 1st focal plane mil/mil scopes on all my rifles. I won’t go back. They are just so simple to use with hold over type reticles. They are most useful if you are using any type of hold over reticle where you are actually holding over rather than using the turrets. Like pretbek said the mil dots are the same at any magnification. It doesn’t mater what your zoom setting is you just hold over the same number of mil spacings for a given distance and shoot. Yes the reticle gets larger as you zoom in, some people don’t like that, but hey, so does the target. The reticle stays the same size on the target as you zoom in or out as if it were painted on the target.
    Second focal plane scopes are fine for conventional cross hair type reticles because you use the turrets to adjust for elevation and windage. First focal plane scopes with hold over reticles are just faster to aquire a target and shoot. No wasted time dailing or calculating zoom setting for holdover. Now for dedicated bench rest second focal plane scopes can have an edge in ultimate accuracy with high mag and a very fine cross hair reticle.

    And yes there is a lot of hold over when shooting air guns over 30-40 yards. 

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    30cal
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    They do tend to cost more but there are a couple good ones that work well for a reasonable price. I have a Primary Arms 4-14×44 FFP on a Marauder. Here’s a link. https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_4_14X44_FFP_Scope_with_308_p/pa4-14xffp308.htm
    They also have this one which has a standard mil dot reticle and no illumination. https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_4_14X44_FFP_Scope_p/pa4-14xffp.htm
    They are excellent scopes for the price. Also I believe BSA sell a version of this scope through Midway.

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    Daxx
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    30calThey do tend to cost more but there are a couple good ones that work well for a reasonable price. I have a Primary Arms 4-14×44 FFP on a Marauder. Here’s a link. https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_4_14X44_FFP_Scope_with_308_p/pa4-14xffp308.htm
    They also have this one which has a standard mil dot reticle and no illumination. https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_4_14X44_FFP_Scope_p/pa4-14xffp.htm
    They are excellent scopes for the price. Also I believe BSA sell a version of this scope through Midway.

    That scope says it’s made for a .223 round.

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    30cal
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    Daxx that’s true and also the 308 round but the reticle also incorporates the mil scale into it. Watch the videos. It just give you even more hold over points to chose from.

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    jgburks
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    I keep trying to convince myself that I need a quality lightweight FFP scope for my FX Royale, but there just isn’t one for airgunners that I can find. I tried the BSA and it just didn’t agree with me. There are other variants of that one like the Primary Arms, but I expect they’re similar to the BSA so I’m not motivated to try those. Right now I have a Bushnell Elite 6500 2.5-16×42 with the mildot reticle, and when shooting pests under 50 yards I just can’t seem to miss. The glass is fantastic, eye relief fits me great, the zoom range is insane, and it only weighs just over a pound. March makes one that’s crazy expensive, so I wouldn’t (actually can’t) go that route. Bushnell has one in their tactical line, but it’s about 7 ounces heavier. I think the problem is I’m not shooting enough, because when I’m dropping starlings and sparrows and squirrels I’m never thinking about a new scope, it’s only when I’m not shooting! Now if I could just get that FX Impact off of my mind…

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    Beach-gunner
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    Personally I use my elevation turret to adjust for yardage and hold off for wind, seems to me tobe easier than holding over for elevation and wind at the same time.  Just my thoughts and preference.  I like the SFP Hawke sindwinder that I have.

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    Cookie
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    If you care to search this forum alone you’ll see this topic has come up more than once, and so there is plenty of reference material for you.

    Presently I have 7 Falcon FFP scopes, mainly 4-14×44, and are used without problem on high powered airguns. Others I know use them on everything up to .308 centrefire without issue. My last tracking test with some Falcons showed a possible one tenth error on one scope, which was also the possible error on a S&B on that day, though the former is certainly not in the same league as the latter.

    I have inspected two other commonly available FFP scopes to the Falcon, one from Vector in China and the other a BSA but neither came up to the Falcon’s standard of build in terms of turret structure; and I doubt have passed the same testing/quality control. Even though in pictures they are superficially similar and they may have been built in the same factory, with similar specs, the scopes I’ve seen are different and in any case-the actual lens prescription is different for Falcons. I am aware that a few years ago BSA marketed some scopes under their name, the quality of which has not (to my knowledge, as I’ve heard the complaints) been reproduced in subsequent batches. It may be the case that, presently, cheaper Chinese FFP scopes may well be fine on PCP’s with limited requirement for tracking adjustment but last year our testing with BSA and Vector showed they weren’t.

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    Daxx
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    This FFP scope seems to get good reviews and isn’t crazy high priced.  It just seems like when purchasing a scope, if you don’t buy an expensive one from a reputable company, then you mind as well be playing craps in Vegas.  Luck of the draw when ordering budget scopes online.

    http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-15×42-Tactical-Rifle-Scope-P62238.aspx

    But I digress…  Is anyone using FFP for FT and other competitions and preferring that over SFP?

     

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    TonyT
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    I have used the BSA 4-14×40 FFP scope purchased from Midway for ca $250. The highest magnification is only 14x but it does have a very nice half mildot reticle which is great for holdover and hold under situations.

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    30cal
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    I’m looking to get a Falcon 5.5x25x50 ffp for my RAW if it ever gets here. Also have the SWFA 3-9 ffp on a PB. Very solid scope.

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    spysir
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    “But I digress…  Is anyone using FFP for FT and other competitions and preferring that over SFP?”

    “Anyone” likely, but, NOT common. 99% of the FT shooters I see use the second plane scopes as the have a sharper depth of field and you use your A/O – sidewheel to range find.  FFP “might” be better for hunting “if” that is your style. I greatly prefer range finding with my scopes
    A/O.

    Get to a match! It would be well worth driving a couple of hours one way if you can get to one. For most of us it is a lot easier to find a match than a shop that actually will let you look at things (airgun) where as if you can attend a ,atch most everyone will be more than happy to explain everything about their rig, and, let you give it a try.

    FFP  in FT is popular in the UK because their rules do NOT allow you to touch your scope a/o during a match, in that case the extremely huge depth is a benefit but not in the US.

    John 

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    TheJazzman3
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    • July 23, 2015 at 9:08 amEDIT | REPLY | QUOTE | FLAG | LINKTheJazzman3 Hello Guys 
    • I have so far 10 various scopes, from Hawke sidewinder Sports HD, Mamba, Nikko Stirling, Artic Fox and  the last few vortex  scopes too! My humble opinion is,  the vortex scopes are no good at all for Air rifle shooters, they are no good for night shooting e.g with Nite Site you cant see nothing, for short distance shooting  also no good, while you increase your zoom you can t see nothing with 40 or 44 reticle, please you try and be my guess. Especially the viper range minimum parallax at 50 meters, then what you do if your aiming point is on the 15 meters? The glass fair enough is clear, very clear but what is the use if you cant use it with an air rifle?
      My shooting range is, from 12 meters to 60 meters, I do mainly nighttime shooting with Nite Site Viper bye shooting rats and rabbits.
      The two scopes that i love are Artic Fox the range starts from 5 yards to infinity, absolutely sharp and  clear.The price isn’t like vortex viper over $ 1.000 either! 
      http://www.arcticfoxoptics.com.au/shop-category/riflescopes
       

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    penchetta
    Dealer
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    I have a SWFA 3 x 15 FFP on my Wolverine hi lite .22 being able to drop down to 3x for hunting without having to do any calibration is great. The clicks work and the glass is crystal clear, paralex down to 10 yrds.  I can see my long range targets better on a clear 15x than my other Hawke scopes on 20 or 24x where the glass is good but not nearly as crisp as the SS. For a good quality FFP scope, price is not to bad in the 700.00 range. 

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    Saltlake58
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    I have the BSA Version.  From the looks of the scope, it’s identical to the primary arms version
    http://www.midwayusa.com/product/456482/bsa-tactical-mil-mil-rifle-scope-30mm-tube-4-14x-44mm-side-focus-1-10-mil-adjustments-first-focal-mrad-reticle-matte

    Love the scope.  Be aware it is NOT air rifle rated, so only put it on a PCP.

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