Is the new Gamo Swarm gas spring repeater really a game changer?

Forums General Discussion Is the new Gamo Swarm gas spring repeater really a game changer?

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    zebra
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    Do you guys think the Gamo Swarm changes anything with it being a relatively quiet 10 shot repeating 22 cal gas spring gun with enough power for small game hunting / pest control?

    The review I just saw on YouTube described it as a “game changer”. I can understand why he would say that. The main reason I got into PCP initially was because I wanted a repeater with hunting power. The ability to get that now without the cost of a pump or tank certainly sounds game-changey. 

    I think the concept has always had game changing potential but this one falls short for me. It’s still a break-barrel… the accuracy test in the review was done at 20 yards and it wasn’t exactly printing single hole groups or even clover-leafs at that distance. It shots like the cheap $200 air gun it is.

    If I could talk to Gamo about it, I would say that I’d like to see this concept done right with a quality barrel and a separate cocking lever instead of a break-barrel design.

    If I sent any other type of gun to a gunsmith and he came back telling me he’d installed the barrel on a hinge that moves up and down, I’d literally be inconsolable. It doesn’t sound like a good idea at all. Barrels don’t move on accurate guns that hold zero. Especially not heavy recoil guns like this.

    I think, if they made an accurate version that cocked in a civilized manner, then it would be an actual game changer. I could see something like that tempting some people away from cheaper PCP guns. It’s the first springer review I have been interested enough to watch in a while. 

    What do you guys think?

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    blackdiesel
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    It seems like everytime Rick Eutsler does one of his infomercial reviews he claims it’s a game changer.  I don’t put any stock in his “all fluff” reviews.  

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    Deja
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    “blackdiesel”It seems like everytime Rick Eutsler does one of his infomercial reviews he claims it’s a game changer.  I don’t put any stock in his “all fluff” reviews.  

    
what he said.

    Its just a normal gamo. Really decent up to 30 meters. Good stock good power, a bit rough internally and a lacking trigger. The scope mount looks retarded. 
    In the end its is really cool looking and at just 200?€$ +- it could be fun thing to try.

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    JoeWayneRhea
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    +2 on the reviews . I have looked at the review. Two things that jump out at me about the gun is that only a very short scope is gonna work , and the way its made just looks like something that is gonna be trouble on down the line .. I think my shooing buddy has ordered one . If so I’ll let y’all know what its like first hand without the ” fluff”

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    Alan
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    I’ve owned two break barrels—both in .177. They were both junk, and the only way you could hit the broad side of a barn with either one, was to be inside with the door closed! 

    Others seemingly have good luck with them, and use what is commonly referred to as the military hold. May be, but it never helped me. 

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    blueflax
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    Repeating springers have been tried before. Hanel had one in the 1920s. Both Theoben and BSA built high quality repeaters 20 years ago. Other less expensive rifles come up from time to time.

    They don’t seem to fit the springer market.  

    I shot FT with a fellow who used a Theoben and it was very accurate.  

    Interestingly, The magazines from the Theoben and the BSA are still with us.  

    Ron 

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    coop709
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    I just see this gun as a gimmick and an easy way to dry fire your springer. It wouldn’t be much of a loss on this gun, but that was the big problem with the Theoben. You lose count, dry fire, then damage the gun. As for zebra’s comment on a pivoting barrel, try a well made break barrel like the Weihrauch guns I have and it will change your mind. I have a 30 year old R1 that will still shoot groups to be proud of at 50 yards, no barrel slop. You have to look at Gamo for what it is, big-box store gun that sells off inflated velocity numbers. The only part of the “game” that they have changed is that now everyone that doesn’t know thinks your quality gun is inferior because it shoots at 850 fps.

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    zebra
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    What really got me thinking about it is the last video Joe posted on the difference in performance between heavy and lighter pellets. The springer he was using looked awesome. I don’t just mean the accuracy. I mean the way it was loaded and cocked. 

    I have little interest in springers usually. Like others said, my first few experiences with them (bad ones) were enough to put me off.

    If someone made a high quality one like the one Joe was using that could function as both single shot and a repeater but with enough power for small game at close range (but not too much to ruin them), and be quiet enough to use at home, I think I might be prepared to give them another chance. 

    I know now very little about good springers but I am curious why some people think the idea of a repeater is not compatible with a gas spring air rifle? Other than the potential to cause issues with dry firing, were there other problems with previous attempts?

    The problems with that Gamo, for me, did not seem to be related to the repeater function. I would just want to be able to cock it without moving position and to be able to stack pellets like Joe did. They probably should add add a feature to warm the user when the mag is empty so they don’t break the thing though. 

    Coop709, I take your point on how a break barrel can be done well like on your Weihrauch. I would like to try a real quality springer like you described. It sounds awesome. Let me ask you though, if a company was designing your ideal springer (or gas spring) just for you to your specs, would you ask for it to be a break-barrel design instead of having a separate lever (either side or under)?

    Also, how do they prevent a poi shift on your R1? Does it have some type of locking mechanism? The break-barrels I owned opened by applying force to the end of the barrel. There was nothing to unlock etc. 

     

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    Volatile
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    blackdieselIt seems like everytime Rick Eutsler does one of his infomercial reviews he claims it’s a game changer.  I don’t put any stock in his “all fluff” reviews.  

    
 I agree. I give little to no credence to YouTube reviews done by people who are obviously promoting products supplied by a big box manufacturer or internet retailer, no matter how well done.

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    Smaug
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    Well, I was about to grab my torch and go after Ol’ Rick, but you know what? He DOES comment on some of the cons. You just have to listen carefully as he doesn’t like to dwell on them or really call a lot of attention to them.

    When he says something like: “It’s not a competition rifle…” it means you have to carefully look at his groups, and assume they are the best that gun can put out after break-in and cherry-picking the best one of the day.

    When he says: “It’s a little on the heavy side, but ….” Look at the weight spec, and compare it to guns you have; think about how they feel to hold up.

    Despite all that, production quality seems to trump a lot of more genuine content on YouTube: the fancier it looks and sounds, the more views.

    Now, back to the original question. Time will tell, but I don’t think so. It might be a fad that is popular for a few years, then disappear. (again)  To me, in 90% of the cases, for a repeater to be genuinely useful for follow-up shots, it has to be semi-automatic. Otherwise, they’re just not going to be fast or unobtrusive enough, except on really distant unwary game. For any other type of shooting, a slow repeater that requires a lot of arm-waving doesn’t buy us much.

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    Deja
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    “zebra”. They probably should add add a feature to warm the user when the mag is empty so they don’t break the thing though. 
     

    
It has a shot counter

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    Goodtogo
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    Its made to sell to people that will think its a good thing to have? I’m more interested in seeing what Crosman has with the new barrels they are making in house. Who knows maybe they are going to copy CZ? ;)

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    zebra
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    “Deja”

    “zebra”. They probably should add add a feature to warm the user when the mag is empty so they don’t break the thing though. 
     

    
It has a shot counter


    A shot counter only works if you remember to look at it. Knowing what I’m like, there will be occasions where I would forget that as I see a squirrel escaping. I couldn’t get used to the auto safety on Hatsan guns for the same reason.

    I think a linear magazine (like Baikal use on their repeaters) is a better idea for guns that get damaged from dry firing. With a linear mag you could make it almost impossible to dry fire by accident by making it so you physically can’t push the probe in once you run out of pellets. I.e. you fill in the last hole so it blocks the probe instead of going back to the first (empty) hole like it would on a revolver mag 

    I like Baikal’s take on the repeating springer with their old IZH61. It’s side-lever, easy to cock, accurate, they don’t have the problem of accidental dry firing, it looks interesting and the free-float forearm design is smart. If anyone made something like that in 22 cal with enough power for small game and quiet enough for a backyard, I believe that would be a game changer.

    To qualify that statement, I think for it to be a “game changer”, it would have to be something that gets people into springers who previously had no interest. Whether it appeals to existing springer fans is less relevant because, if people who already use springers like it, then nothing has changed. Current springer fans are obviously ok with single shot guns.

    There is a lot of people, myself included, who just don’t like single shot guns for hunting. Even if they are super accurate, there are multiple reasons why I might need a follow-up shot. The squirrel might move, the wind, there might be two squirrels, a damaged pellet skirt causing a flyer, me losing concentration and missing my shot etc. 

    Single shot and the break-barrel design are the two primary reasons I don’t like springers currently. I guess it’s just typical that when someone finally makes a repeating quiet hunting springer, they make it a break barrel and they forgot to make it accurate.

     

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    joek
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    I had, and sold a Diana 300R , the repeat mechanism imho was too fragile. I still have a BSA Gold Star spinger  that I love/hate after all these years. I see no advantage to multi shots in a springer, too much time to follow up. Gamo’s design and build quality imho have really gone down in recent years. I second the vote to look around Krale’s site. The HW50S is a little bit higher than your budget along with the HW35 and HW85.   
    https://www.krale-schietsport.nl/en/guns/air-rifles.html?manufacturer=262&powersource=324

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    oldspook
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    No.  It is a gimmick to sell guns to new buyers.  It’s GAMO, enough said about the vendor’s commitment to quality right there.  GAMO didn’t build BSA, they bought them and one can only hope that the engineering influence flows from east to west rather than the other direction.  It IS going to be dry fired, a lot.  It is going to have failure to feed issues which will get worse every time the mechanism is broken on a half-fed pellet.  It is ugly.

    Don’t ask me what I really think.  :)

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    Volatile
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    oldspookNo.  It is a gimmick to sell guns to new buyers.  It’s GAMO, enough said about the vendor’s commitment to quality right there.  GAMO didn’t build BSA, they bought them and one can only hope that the engineering influence flows from east to west rather than the other direction.  It IS going to be dry fired, a lot.  It is going to have failure to feed issues which will get worse every time the mechanism is broken on a half-fed pellet.  It is ugly.

    Don’t ask me what I really think.  :)

    
 I agree. I don’t trust Gamo, Crosman, Hatsan, any of the Chinese brands, or ANY other company that sells $200 airguns. Having said that, I have a Crosman 1720t that I really like. The rumor about Crosman making their own barrels may be true. And it may not.

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    zebra
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    It’s a shame when good ideas are poorly implemented. It makes it hard to separate the quality of the idea from the poor results that one or two companies achieved with it. 

    The accuracy (or lack there of) would put me off that particular Gamo gun whether it was a repeater or not. Every idea could be seen as a gimmick if there is an absence of accuracy. Accuracy is a basic requirement for all air guns. IMO, it shouldn’t be compromised even to save money. 

    With  that said, I don’t see a repeater function as a gimmick. If done right it is something that could offer real benefit. Maybe not to everyone but it is definitely a good and desirable thing to have on a hunting rifle. I’d never give up my PCP guns for a springer while they are single shot

    Making mags that prevent you from accidentally dry firing is totally possible. The other issues have already been solved elsewhere (I.e. there are accurate, quiet and well made springers). I think we need someone to bring all those things together on one gun to be able to really judge the concept. 

    So far I haven’t heard anything that makes me think that it isn’t possible to make a good repeating springer. It just seems like it’s always the wrong companies who try. I can understand why people are skeptical. It’s clearly not something that can work on a bargain basement shelf-filler air rifle….

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    Alan
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    Hey! My Benjamin 397 is a repeater too! All you have to do is reload it each time!

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    hokieben
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    I wouldn’t say that it’s a game changer… a $200 Gamo that has real-world accuracy on par with the nicer European springers would be a game changer. However, compared to other widely available $200 springers, it does offer a feature that doesn’t currently exist in that genre and it will probably grab a decent share of that market as a result. I think that marketing it as a hunting rifle that allows fast follow-up shots on game is misleading. As others have pointed out, even though it’s faster than a single shot break barrel, it’s unlikely to give you a second shot on a missed squirrel. Now if the “game” that they are trying to change is the entry level casual plinking game, they may be on to something. If I had a row of cans lined up 15 yards away in my back yard and I could choose between the Gamo Swarm and some other cheap gas piston break barrel, I’d probably grab the Swarm for the added fun factor of faster shooting. Good on Gamo for making the magazines affordable too ($15).

    Also, if they are trying to compete for the honor of being the ugliest break barrel on the market, I think they hit a home run.

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    Salticon
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    At the end of the day it’s still a Gamo….

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