Huma Regulator installed in the s510

Forums PCP Airguns Huma Regulator installed in the s510

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    LDP
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    You may have to set it to 140 – 145 bar but maybe not. My carbine is at 28 fpe @ 135 bar. Before I lightened my hammer I was at 30 fpe but just wasting air so thats the reason I dropped the hammer weight and velocity slightly. Since you have the full size with the longer barrel you might be able to squeeze out 30 fpe @ 135 bar with the light weight hammer so try it first and see. I would say if you dont want to do valve mods then 30 fpe with just a light weight hammer and the higher fill should be a good compromise and be at least as much as you wanted if not more shots.

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    james.dean
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    That seems fine to me =) only gotta find the perfect way to lighten the hammer now =) and hopefully it’ll bring my rifle where I want it to be with a one digit ES

    Now, if I wanna go a bit further and do the valve mod, what do I have to do exactly (I read it on the other forum but it was too technical for my English level ^^)
    Is it difficult? Do I need loads of tools etc etc.. =)

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    chiro972b
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    Who told you to fill to 250 bar? The max that Air Arms wants in there is 190 bar I believe. I fill mine to about 210-220, but even at that I feel like I am pushing it. Anyone know what the rating on that cylinder is?

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    NMshooter
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    Matt Dubber talks about increasing the air pressure above 200 bar after he installed a regulator on his Ultimate Hunter. He has several videos on the installation and performance. He does state the maximum rating but I don’t remember off hand. His videos are not a drudgery to watch. 
    Hope this helps,

    Doc

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    LDP
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    According to Robert Lane the AA cylinder is designed to flare open at the end of the cylinder to keep from having a violent explosion. He states they are designed to fail open at 4800 psi or 330 bar. He has tested the cylinders and found that they do fail as designed at 4800 psi. Air Arms has this info some where also. The cylinders have a burst rating of 20,000 psi. 

     Robert Lane also answers the question as to why the 200 bar fill listed by AA if the cylinders are designed to take much higher psi. He says that the limiting factor is the design of the valve and hammer. So once you regulate the S510 or S410 you dont have to worry about the higher pressure effecting the valve. So you can safely use the higher fill. 

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    james.dean
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    You were faster than me to answer the question LDC mate =)
    Now, what you’ve told me, seems fine to me =) only gotta find the perfect way to lighten the hammer now =) and hopefully it’ll bring my rifle where I want it to be with a one digit ES

    Still, if I wanna go a bit further and do the valve mod, what do I have to do exactly (I read it on the other forum but it was too technical for my English level ^^)
    Is it difficult? Do I need loads of tools etc etc.. =) And which weight would you recommand for the hammer.. 34 like yours or heavier? Lighter? =)

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    jking
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    James, I didn’t mod the valve in mine at all. I don’t guess I even know what they are, lol.  I’d just try to lighten the hammer and I think you’ll get some nice results or at least it would get you in the ball park of something that might only need tweaked.
    jimmy

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    LDP
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    “jking”James, I didn’t mod the valve in mine at all. I don’t guess I even know what they are, lol.  I’d just try to lighten the hammer and I think you’ll get some nice results or at least it would get you in the ball park of something that might only need tweaked.
    jimmy

    
I agree especially since you are willing to tune to 30 fpe. As far as lightening the hammer its really hard to say if you need to get it as low as it can be. It really depends on where you end up setting the regulator. I believe motorhead lowered his hammer weight around the 10 grams I did and used a fill of 140 bar maybe 145 bar. Based on what you want to tune for I would say you will end up somewhere around that 10 grams.

    When you tune a regulated pcp you want to be on the knee not the plateau. If you tune to be on the plateau the rifle will be less efficient. The knee is where you are just opening the valve enough to get the required air for the least amount of dwell needed for the velocity you want. So basically a partial valve lock for the shot cycle and exactly what happens on the first shots of an unregulated pcp bell curve tune. The hammer has just enough force to sip the perfect amount of air from the regulated chamber.

    Heres a break down of how I tuned mine:
    After installing the regulator I shot 3 shots over the chrono. I then added a small shim to my hammer spring and shot 3 more shots over the chrony. The first 3 shots are to establish a base line. You add hammer spring pre load by adding a shim and the purpose of that is to tell you if you are on the knee or the plateau of the regulator setting. The plateau is exactly what it sounds like and is the point where you dont gain any velocity by adding hammer force.

    example of what you get if you are on the plateau:
    regulated with stock hammer pre load – 890 fps
    after installing shim – 890 fps

    example of what being on the knee will look like:
    regulated stock hammer pre load – 890 fps
    after installing shim – 910 fps

    You will most likely be on the plateau with the reg set at 135 bar and everything else stock but it doesnt hurt to check it and saves you guessing. Mine was on the plateau at that reg setting and everything stock. I had to lighten the hammer about 6 grams before I seen any drop in velocity. So it was pretty high on the plateau and a huge air hog. Mine only needed the 10 gram weight reduction and the stock hammer spring to be on the knee. The only way to know for sure is to get it shot over the chrony and do the shim test and adjust from there. If you post your chrono results we can help guide you thru the tune. Hopefully that all made sense and wasnt to long winded;)
     

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    james.dean
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    Thanks a lot mate =)
    That’s not too long, I prefer when someone is precise when explaining this king of thing to me, and you were =)
    Even of I didn’t fully understand the thing, I guess it’s just because it lacks of practical data (chrony results) but I’m receiving the combro mk4 tomorrow.. It’s not THE chrony but I’ve read many good things about it so hopefully it’ll be enough =)
    Now, talking about the knee / plateau.. Basically, what I need is to obtain the velocity max with the stock version? And this is obtained by compressing the spring as much as it can be compressed, hence the use of the shim.. This way, I’ll have the max velocity and I could starrd working on lightening the hammer and see when I’m starting to loose FPS which will basically tell me that the valve is opening at a perfect amount of time, letting just enough air to reach the 910 fps for example, but with the most efficient setting in terms of air consumption.
    Am I getting this right ?? ^^

    Still, before asking anything on the forum, I tried to put a washer, maybe 1.5 mm in front of the spring, around the hammer part that comes in the spring (dunno if I’m clear here ^^ ) but then it won’t let me cock the rifle, as if the spring’s coils were touching here others, nor allowing me to put more tension onto it.. I REALLY hope I’m clear ^^
    So maybe I’d try a 1mm or 0.5mm washer?

    Again, thank you very very much for your time and help.. I know forum are made for this but here, you are really great mate =)

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    james.dean
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    And when you look at that… Matt has made absolutely NO other upgrades / mods… That’s really impressive…

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    LDP
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    Yes you are understanding it correctly. The AA doesnt have much room before it coil binds so you must put the shim in the correct way. I should have been clear but I forgot that part. When you add a shim you must use a shim that slides over the hammers tail where the spring slides over. Just be sure the outside diameter of the shim isnt larger than the hammer. And the inside diameter is close to the size of the hammers tail. The shim I used was about 1mm and no more than 1.5mm. 

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    james.dean
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    All right, I’ll test as soon as I can.. =) And I’ll give you the results here.
    But only for the noise it’s making now, I’ll have to reduce the hammer weight ^^

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    LDP
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    James you are correct in assuming you need to drop the hammer weight. One of the easiest ways to do it would be to buy the non fac hammer. Going that rout allows you to keep the original and also not hassle with lightening it your self. I believe airgun spares has them in stock. 

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    spysir
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    Might someone have the weights of both the FAC and sub 12fpe hammer/striker ?

    TIA

    John

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    LDP
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    “spysir”Might someone have the weights of both the FAC and sub 12fpe hammer/striker ?

    TIA

    John

    
My FAC hammer was 49 grams and I lightened it to 34.5 grams. I have no idea what the non FAC hammer weighs but it looks very similar to the trimmed down FAC hammers so my guess is its around the same weight or lighter than my lightened hammer.

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    james.dean
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    Ok guys now… i’m IMPRESSED with the results..
    It’s an ES of 11 fps and an average of 935 fps out of 40 shots if you take the crap ones (my fault I’ll explain) out.
    Here are the results with a fill of 250 bars:
    #1 940 – 936 – 937 – 939 – 934 – 933 –
    937 – 937 – 936 – 933

    #2 934 – 935 – 933 – 934 – 936 – 934 –
    933 – 937 – 935 – 935

    #3 / – / – 847 – 850 – 858 – 939 – 853 –
    936 – 935 – 939

    #4 851 – 842 – 844 – 864 – 929 – 846 –
    937 – 858 – 851 – 870

    #5 853 – 855 – *falls off the reg* 929
    – 926 – 919 – 916 – 921 – 915 – 910

    Now the explanation of the 8..
    Everything was absolutely fine till the 21st shot that I fired with the rifle cocked obviously but with the lever unlocked (it was forming an angle of 90 degrees with the rifle).
    So what happened ?
    I cocked, I didn’t lock the lever back, I shot and that brought the lever to its locked position but no pellet exit from the barrel, I re-cocked the rifle, Squeezed the trigger to fire the pellet that was stuck in the Barrel and I started to obtain shitty results.
    Do you have any idea why this would be??
    I hope it’ll be fixed by the refill.. I’d be so mad of I fucked the thing up after seeing what it was capable of =(

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    BigTinBoat
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    “james.dean”Ok guys now… i’m IMPRESSED with the results..
    It’s an ES of 11 fps and an average of 935 fps out of 50 shots if you take the crap ones (my fault I’ll explain) out.
    Here are the results with a fill of 250 bars:
    #1 940 – 936 – 937 – 939 – 934 – 933 –
    937 – 937 – 936 – 933

    #2 934 – 935 – 933 – 934 – 936 – 934 –
    933 – 937 – 935 – 935

    #3 / – / – 847 – 850 – 858 – 939 – 853 –
    936 – 935 – 939

    #4 851 – 842 – 844 – 864 – 929 – 846 –
    937 – 858 – 851 – 870

    #5 853 – 855 – *falls off the reg* 929
    – 926 – 919 – 916 – 921 – 915 – 910

    Now the explanation of the 8..
    Everything was absolutely fine till the 21st shot that I fired with the rifle cocked obviously but with the lever unlocked (it was forming an angle of 90 degrees with the rifle).
    So what happened ?
    I cocked, I didn’t lock the lever back, I shot and that brought the lever to its locked position but no pellet exit from the barrel, I re-cocked the rifle, Squeezed the trigger to fire the pellet that was stuck in the Barrel and I started to obtain shitty results.
    Do you have any idea why this would be??
    I hope it’ll be fixed by the refill.. I’d be so mad of I fucked the thing up after seeing what it was capable of =(
     

    
You were “double loaded”….firing 2 pellets at once.

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    james.dean
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    No mate.. Not on so many shots !!

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    james.dean
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    New string =]
    Filled to 240 bars, using jsb 15.89 grains and shim added on the hammer tail. Great results again with an ES of 11 fps but definitely too loud and air hog, only 35 shots regulated =] so I’ll buy the standard hammer and keep the FAC one intact. =]

    #1 946 – 941 – 939 – 939 – 940 – 946 –
    939 – 940 – 940 – 936

    #2 936 – 935 – 935 – 941 – 934 – 876
    (reg breaking in??) – 934 – 935 –
    943 – 934

    #3 934 – 936 – 938 – 939 – 944 – 940 –
    941 – 938 – 937 – 934

    #4 936 – 934 – 937 – 933 – (fall off the reg) – 930 – 927 – 927 – 923 – 922

    I feel this is not bad at all =)

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    james.dean
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    WellI couldn’t wait so The hammer has been under my file =)
    It weighed 49 grams now it’s at 40 grams…
    The rifle is much more silent and I assume I’ve gained 7-10 regulated shots at 935 fps that means now, I have 45 regulated shots =) with a 250 fill =)

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