FX liner system, what's the point?
- Thread starter Harold999
- Start date
We’re all chasing the perfect air rifle. The good news for the manufacturers is we don’t agree on what that is. AND once we find THE perfect gun something better comes out. Whether you like that ( which I do) or whether you think you’re being taken advantage of it’s good for the economy. My wish today is for a crown or a daystate that can do what the impact can do. I’d just rather shoot a rifle.
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My point with this topic was, if FX would have made it possible to fit all the different caliber liners in one and the same sleeve, then they would have had the perfect system.
But what they have done now, also needing a different sleeve when changing calibers, i'm not really getting that. It costs more than a barrel swap normally costs with other manufacturers.
Maybe the Impact MK3 will get a "universal" sleeve.
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I know where you are heading to. You can change caliber with only the liner, when you're going from a bigger caliber Impact to smaller.
But ofcourse i bought myself the .22 so a no go for me, have to buy a new sleeve also if i want a .25 or .30.
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My point with this topic was, if FX would have made it possible to fit all the different caliber liners in one and the same sleeve, then they would have had the perfect system.
But what they have done now, also needing a different sleeve when changing calibers, i'm not really getting that. It costs more than a barrel swap normally costs with other manufacturers.
Maybe the Impact MK3 will get a "universal" sleeve.
The thing is the liner needs to be a certain wall size to be able to press the rifling on from the outside regardlessof caliber. OD of the assembly needs to be the same to fit in the same block. So the differing OD of the liner creates a situation where caliber specific parts are needed to hold the liner centered.
Bagnall and Kirkwood airgun spares sell this part
As well as the liner lock that are caliber specific. So if you had a 700mm .22 and wanted it to shoot .25 all youd need is the part pictured in .25, a liner lock in .25, probe, liner and brass barrel inlet. You can save some money by going this route.
What they could do in the future is make the liner lock and pictured piece in .35. Then offer caliber specific delrin bushes that make these parts work with any caliber.
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those CNC machines ...and they have many aren't cheap in their FX factory
barrel change liner probe and magazine...$500 very fair.
barrel change liner probe and magazine...$500 very fair.
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Wanna spend some big and useless money? Buy a Harley and ask for a P&A catalog to take home with you.
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Been there done that. Now your talking $$$. Rode home a brand new Wide Glide and 18 months latter had spent the same $$$ in P&A as the bike. I rode me most of my life and can't now for health reasons.
Know what? I would go buy one today and redo the whole thing again if I could. I guess it's that if you have to ask, I can't explain.
Eamon
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I rode a Sportster for 3 yrs. Bought new as 883 Hugger. Converted it to 1200 myself the first winter, Screaming Eagle kit. 3 different exhaust systems before I found the one I liked. Mustang seat, chrome, etc.
Got into ATVs after that....same story.
Flew radio controlled helicopters for 6 years.....one good crash cost $600.00. Just a blade strike was $150.00.
Air rifles are "cheap" compared to other hobbies.
Got into ATVs after that....same story.
Flew radio controlled helicopters for 6 years.....one good crash cost $600.00. Just a blade strike was $150.00.
Air rifles are "cheap" compared to other hobbies.
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True. I know a guy who bought a 35,000 bass boat. Pays $500 a month, every month. (Even when it is in storage during winter, (the storage is like $180 s month))
Then he had to buy a bigger truck to pull his boat, another 500 a month. Then insurance for both of his truck and boat.
And I still catch more bass with my kayak than him.
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If you only shoot one gun with one ammo then don’t bother look at FX, I bought into it because Of the flexibility. I got the slug liner and now I can sling slugs down range @ close to 1000 FPS then A few turn of Allen wrench and knobs later I’m down to Shooting hades at 680fps in my back yard. Then one day I might decide I want to shoot the JSB heavies, or something else. So with 100 bucks extra I got 2 guns essentially without having to buy scopes and stuff. I have 5 different ammo in .25 and only need one gun and one scope to shoot it.
sure, you can get a 80fpe rifle for medium games, then one for slugs for longer shots, one for back yard, One for small game and of course the scopes to go on them, moderators, magazines....nothing wrong with that and plenty of fun doing it. It sure won’t be cheaper if you ask me.
Im hoping one day California would open air rifle to pig hunting then I might just spring for the .30 barrel or even .35. Although .25 slugs at 1000fps is more than capable taking down some a good size pig.
the down side of the FX barrel system is that I really want the Dreamline compact but can’t justify for it besides it’s a little lighter.
sure, you can get a 80fpe rifle for medium games, then one for slugs for longer shots, one for back yard, One for small game and of course the scopes to go on them, moderators, magazines....nothing wrong with that and plenty of fun doing it. It sure won’t be cheaper if you ask me.
Im hoping one day California would open air rifle to pig hunting then I might just spring for the .30 barrel or even .35. Although .25 slugs at 1000fps is more than capable taking down some a good size pig.
the down side of the FX barrel system is that I really want the Dreamline compact but can’t justify for it besides it’s a little lighter.
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Funny and true, my son has a pedal kayak he takes off shore and catches more fish than me in my 24ft Chris craft.
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So I certainly could be accused of being an FX "fanboy" as I own two and love them, however I also have the unpopular opinion of not really loving the Impact specifically all that much. Why? From an engineering standpoint, you want everything to be as simple as it can be, but not one bit simpler. I feel the Crown, my favorite, already rides the edge of that line of too mechanically complicated. The Impact I feel crosses it, and we see that is one of its more common failure points, all the plumbing surrounding that plenum and transfer bar. And all that complexity does what? Puts the same barrel just a little further back so you get 6-8" more barrel length for the same overall length as compared to a more "traditional" rifle setup. Simply not my cup of tea.
However I think you're a little off-base for your disparagement of FX's barrel liner system. Glem above me hit the nail on the head regarding why you can't have all the same outer barrel parts for a given inner barrel; inner barrel wall thickness must be maintained in order to press in the rifling, so necessarily the OD can not be maintained as you go up through the calibers.
Let me give you a slightly different perspective on it though. When you're into high-end airguns, which lets be clear this forum is in a BIG way, there is a bit of a constant churn of trying to have the "best" which often translates to "latest and greatest." When you pay the premiums for airguns we do, it is very reasonable to want something which you feel is really as good as it can be. After all, nothing quite takes the shine off your new toy like seeing someone else's bigger shinier slightly newer toy. The important thing to remember though is that, just because FX rolled out some shiny new whizz-bang, doesn't mean your rifle now shoots any worse than it did yesterday. It is still just as great, and taking a step back to appreciate that can really help.
From an engineering and manufacturing perspective, I actually really appreciate what FX does. It is actually really really expensive and challenging to be constantly tweaking, modifying, and upgrading your designs. It means your back end parts support and logistics quickly become insane. Keeping track of all the different parts, and what works with what, is a real problem. A company which is committed to doing that is a real asset. Very few of FX's updates are a singular revolution, but taken on the whole they have built out multiple platforms now which are some of the most capable on the market. And that is fantastic! Selling all those parts as assemblies only...... a little more frustrating, but I understand it as it can reduce the total number of parts a given dealer has to stock. And that is also something to keep in mind, I bet FX is gets pushback from their dealers for doing this too, because they likely are also unhappy at the sheer volume of parts and model variants to stock, and when the latest and greatest rolls in, last year's model doesn't sell as easily either.
And there is one final thing about the FX STX barrel system I see people so frequently skip over: externally they're not special. If you think some other barrel is better, get it machined and fit it to your FX. How they attach and fit is all pretty standard stuff, so from Lothar Walther to BHW to Bartlein if you think someone else can make a better barrel or better price, you can just call FX USA and pick up the new caliber probe on its own, and put any barrel you want on your rifle. And I for one really appreciate that. Right now FX is, best I can tell, top dog when it comes to barrel technology. Their substantial investment seems to have paid off, in no small part because it allows relatively inexpensive and rapid iteration of new barrel designs. But this doesn't always have to be the case. Tomorrow someone could figure out a way to make a gain twist cut rifled barrel shoot some new ammo better than anything else, and because FX didn't make their barrel mounting system some form of eclectic proprietary voodoo you can just get that machined and drop it in.
Whew. Long post. Just my 2c, or perhaps with this long a post it'll have to be a whole 5c.
However I think you're a little off-base for your disparagement of FX's barrel liner system. Glem above me hit the nail on the head regarding why you can't have all the same outer barrel parts for a given inner barrel; inner barrel wall thickness must be maintained in order to press in the rifling, so necessarily the OD can not be maintained as you go up through the calibers.
Let me give you a slightly different perspective on it though. When you're into high-end airguns, which lets be clear this forum is in a BIG way, there is a bit of a constant churn of trying to have the "best" which often translates to "latest and greatest." When you pay the premiums for airguns we do, it is very reasonable to want something which you feel is really as good as it can be. After all, nothing quite takes the shine off your new toy like seeing someone else's bigger shinier slightly newer toy. The important thing to remember though is that, just because FX rolled out some shiny new whizz-bang, doesn't mean your rifle now shoots any worse than it did yesterday. It is still just as great, and taking a step back to appreciate that can really help.
From an engineering and manufacturing perspective, I actually really appreciate what FX does. It is actually really really expensive and challenging to be constantly tweaking, modifying, and upgrading your designs. It means your back end parts support and logistics quickly become insane. Keeping track of all the different parts, and what works with what, is a real problem. A company which is committed to doing that is a real asset. Very few of FX's updates are a singular revolution, but taken on the whole they have built out multiple platforms now which are some of the most capable on the market. And that is fantastic! Selling all those parts as assemblies only...... a little more frustrating, but I understand it as it can reduce the total number of parts a given dealer has to stock. And that is also something to keep in mind, I bet FX is gets pushback from their dealers for doing this too, because they likely are also unhappy at the sheer volume of parts and model variants to stock, and when the latest and greatest rolls in, last year's model doesn't sell as easily either.
And there is one final thing about the FX STX barrel system I see people so frequently skip over: externally they're not special. If you think some other barrel is better, get it machined and fit it to your FX. How they attach and fit is all pretty standard stuff, so from Lothar Walther to BHW to Bartlein if you think someone else can make a better barrel or better price, you can just call FX USA and pick up the new caliber probe on its own, and put any barrel you want on your rifle. And I for one really appreciate that. Right now FX is, best I can tell, top dog when it comes to barrel technology. Their substantial investment seems to have paid off, in no small part because it allows relatively inexpensive and rapid iteration of new barrel designs. But this doesn't always have to be the case. Tomorrow someone could figure out a way to make a gain twist cut rifled barrel shoot some new ammo better than anything else, and because FX didn't make their barrel mounting system some form of eclectic proprietary voodoo you can just get that machined and drop it in.
Whew. Long post. Just my 2c, or perhaps with this long a post it'll have to be a whole 5c.
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