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Fas 6004 and SIG ASP Super target discontinued?

Good luck. The "virus" has everything "F"ed up. Manufacturing, shipping, everything.

They may still be available, just not in stock. On the surface, Airguns of America "appears" to have the FAS6004 with the custom grip in stock. Not sure that I'd spend an extra $150 for the fancy grip, but then again, it depends on how bad you want one... I just got done modifying the standard grip on mine to fit my hand. Much better now.

With the Sig Sauer, some places have them on wait, one says "discontinued". No idea. 

No favorites here, I like both of mine.

Good luck finding one or both.

Mike
 
Beware many have complained theirs shot extra slow like in the low 300fps.

Bad enough a Daisy 7x7s don't quite punch clean holes through targets shooting at 360fps.

Air Venturi V10 would be worth taking a look at. It's the former Gamo Compact. Accurate quiet and easy to pump compared to most others in its class especially superior in accuracy and ease of pumping compared to the P17 and a hell of a lot quieter too.

What the FAS has going for it is that it's pretty much all metal and no repair support that I am aware of just so you know. I have one that I don't shoot and only because I collect airguns.


 
The issue with the FAS 6004 is the breech seal when it changed from the 604 ...going from a hand built cottage industry to a full mass production enterprise, cutting a few costs. They tried to use off the shelf O rings for the barrel seal to reduce the cost of the thick moulded barrel seal of the former 604 model....it has not paid off....and they have not listened.

This O ring, Sitting lower in the breech groove than the former seal, causes the lower steel lip of the barrel to touch the base of the angled TP housing before the O ring seals down, leaking 50 fps worth of velocity out through the tiny gap.😤🤔

Customers then try to do up the barrel ever more closer to the housing in an attempt to get the thing to seal, until eventually the barrel starts scoring into the housing...wrecking the gun😞

To rectify this beyond words, stupid problem, the O ring requires a shim washer below it to raise it out of its groove a bit higher. I have found that 0.3mm thickness works perfectly. Once sealing correctly, the gun rises in M.V by approx 40 to 50fps..and the barrel base remains clear of scoring into the TP housing.

Once you have rectified this problem (although you should not have to on such an expensive gun) you will have a far better gun than the V10. I have never liked the slight flexing you can get in the Top strap of the V10, or the plastic sights and trigger guard. The grip options with the FAS allowing you to achieve a much better fit than you will ever do with the V10....The plastic of the V10 is not as nice and solid as the plastic on the HW40/P17.

Trigger?....No comparison...even the HW40 is better than the V10.
 
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Your FAS 6004 barrel sealing options. ...Replace the O ring with the rubber seal above, or purchase the shim washer so that you can use the intended O ring without issue....

I did contact Chiappa to show them where they are going wrong but they not listening to a better engineer..
 
I still say that the V10 is easier to pump and quieter than the rest of the mentioned pistols. Yea I don't like the plastic either.

That modification likely won't increase velocity past the factory spec. It probably brings it closer to what's advertised.

You should see how many owners sold off their new 6004s years ago due to slower than advertised velocities.
 
I still say that the V10 is easier to pump and quieter than the rest of the mentioned pistols. Yea I don't like the plastic either.

That modification likely won't increase velocity past the factory spec. It probably brings it closer to what's advertised.

You should see how many owners sold off their new 6004s years ago due to slower than advertised velocities.

I worked on shooting my new v10, and I love it! I developed a cocked method, where I put the base of the grip against my hip, and push the lever down with the flats of my fingers. It results in:
1. Steady and firm base to cock against (hip)
2. 0 fatigue on my shooting hand (it's just loosely holding the grip against my hip)

I did notice that, per Tom Gaylords comments on the izh-64, that "warming the pump" with a few quick strokes will reliably increase velocity from 343 to 365 (8gr rsw meisters) but I don't do that. it keeps a 6 fps ES across 10 shots with a normal cock and shoot, no warmup.
 
There is nothing wrong with the cocking effort of a V10 guys, its about average for this type of gun.

For the record, the original stock figures for the 6004 from the manufacturer were 400 fps. The reality prior to the modification shown above, is approx 300-330 fps, moving to approx 380 fps post modification. There is a little more from piston packing but this simply puts the cocking effort up to what a P17 is due to piston head almost dead heading, but doing so will give you manufacturers figures....

For the record, do not try to piston pack a V10, the top strap will give...its only something i would recommend with metal top straps....

Finally, the Daisy in its 747 form, was very underrated, easy cocking with the long lever, quiet due to the long barrel, accurate due to the long sight base...A little muzzle heavy due to the lever....plastic loading bolt not so great but functional....365 fps..

Recent experiments of mine (on any of these gun types) concluded that tandem O rings, duel sealing on the main piston gets more velocity. My suspicion is that some blow by occurs from a single O ring due to compressing a large volume of air down to a tiny valve pressure too quickly, some of the pressure slipping past the single O ring, but shored up by a second O ring, the pressure to wall of the first O ring is better retained...

It surprises me that a manufacturer like Crosman did not explore this system more. A pistol of say Baikal 46M proportions should give approx 500 fps and would not be that expensive to produce using their 1377 sort of layout, with barrel over cylinder. It is so much more convenient and consistent without all the pumping....
 
Yes....it was me that first came up with the X ring idea over on Target Talk 12 months back ....maybe we got a bit of parallel technology going on here...but this sort of X ring above is very good, made of a very tough rubber. The other steel washer option allows you to carry on using the stock O ring....but no problem with X rings for this job....glad you got it sealed similarly ...
 
Sounds like, if there is an issue with the FAS, then the fix is pretty cheap and straight forward. The relatively low power and quietness was part of the appeal as I would be shooting indoors. Sounds like trigger and accuracy are still excellent in both guns, and I find them both quite handsome.

I would appreciate the correct part number for replacement X ring if people can find it. 
 
Sounds like, if there is an issue with the FAS, then the fix is pretty cheap and straight forward. The relatively low power and quietness was part of the appeal as I would be shooting indoors. Sounds like trigger and accuracy are still excellent in both guns, and I find them both quite handsome.

I would appreciate the correct part number for replacement X ring if people can find it.

You could try the Quad seal I showed you above....its stood the test of time with a number of shooters over on Target talk....could do a lot worse anyway..
 
The issue with the FAS 6004 is the breech seal when it changed from the 604 ...going from a hand built cottage industry to a full mass production enterprise, cutting a few costs. They tried to use off the shelf O rings for the barrel seal to reduce the cost of the thick moulded barrel seal of the former 604 model....it has not paid off....and they have not listened.

Thank you for clearing that up, I was wondering why the 6004 would be slower than the 604 and was thinking in the direction of difference in piston headspace and why they would do that - my two version of the org. FAS604 goes 367 and 371 fps with standard JSB Exact 8,44 grain