Effort to shoot slugs accurately in an air rifle

The down side of FX guns is that they are impossible to leaved good enough alone! I only have 3 FX guns(sold 3) and 2x 177, 3x .22, 2x .25 and 1x .30 barrels, mostly interchangeable between the 3 guns and then many weight, size and caliber slugs...........they aren’t going to tune themselves you know.  

Edit: dobble post

Apparently, according to the reviews on Pyramydair, there's a rifle called "Eagle Claw" made by Seneca, that shots both slugs and JSB's MKII very accurately at very long distance (170 yards).

I have never have one of those in my hands.

wow , I read all the post and my brain hurts., So I think the 177 caliber benefits from the slug more than all the other calibers , OK case closed I know all the answers now, LOL. Thanks guys.

Mike 

I've tried 5 types of pellets in my 25 Avenger and 3 types of slugs. Every single pellet I've tried shot better than the best slug. I have not had a slug 3 shot group smaller than an inch at 33 yards. The best pellets will routinely shoot into 1/4 inch groups at that distance. The only slug that might be worth some tuning is the JSB knockout. The vertical dispersion was good on them but they strung out horizontally. I may try small hammer spring changes to see what it does. But I don't really want to have to change the tune for the projectile, I'd like to have one tune that did both. If I have to give up a projectile it will definitely be slugs. I don't need bigger holes in small animals to put them down where they stand. Drop of slugs is not really that much different. Wind drift is but it has to be allowed for either way.

My bottom line is getting slugs to work is not high on my list of things to do. I'm not sure it is worth the trip. But pellets were definitely MUCH easier to get to work in my gun.

I've tried 5 types of pellets in my 25 Avenger and 3 types of slugs. Every single pellet I've tried shot better than the best slug. I have not had a slug 3 shot group smaller than an inch at 33 yards. The best pellets will routinely shoot into 1/4 inch groups at that distance. The only slug that might be worth some tuning is the JSB knockout. The vertical dispersion was good on them but they strung out horizontally. I may try small hammer spring changes to see what it does. But I don't really want to have to change the tune for the projectile, I'd like to have one tune that did both. If I have to give up a projectile it will definitely be slugs. I don't need bigger holes in small animals to put them down where they stand. Drop of slugs is not really that much different. Wind drift is but it has to be allowed for either way.

My bottom line is getting slugs to work is not high on my list of things to do. I'm not sure it is worth the trip. But pellets were definitely MUCH easier to get to work in my gun.

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Perfectly relevant. But the topic was never about "getting slugs to work"-tuning for slugs was never mentioned, at least not by me. It was about SOME guns shooting slugs as accurately as pellets AS THEY ARE. YOURS obviously didn't so shooting slugs in it would make no sense in that case. Others have seen different results with different guns. I'm predominantly a pellet shooter as well, but slugs have certain advantages and SOME might find them useful IF their gun shoots them well enough. JMO certainly.

Perfectly relevant. But the topic was never about "getting slugs to work"-tuning for slugs was never mentioned, at least not by me. It was about SOME guns shooting slugs as accurately as pellets AS THEY ARE. YOURS obviously didn't so shooting slugs in it would make no sense in that case. Others have seen different results with different guns. I'm predominantly a pellet shooter as well, but slugs have certain advantages and SOME might find them useful IF their gun shoots them well enough. JMO certainly.

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Actually that's EXACTLY what this topic is about. Putting in the work and tuning to get slugs to shoot as good as pellets out of air rifles. The EFFORT in getting slugs to shoot as good as pellets. Not sure where that point got missed but that's what the OP was about.

Perfectly relevant. But the topic was never about "getting slugs to work"-tuning for slugs was never mentioned, at least not by me. It was about SOME guns shooting slugs as accurately as pellets AS THEY ARE. YOURS obviously didn't so shooting slugs in it would make no sense in that case. Others have seen different results with different guns. I'm predominantly a pellet shooter as well, but slugs have certain advantages and SOME might find them useful IF their gun shoots them well enough. JMO certainly.

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Actually that's EXACTLY what this topic is about. Putting in the work and tuning to get slugs to shoot as good as pellets out of air rifles. The EFFORT in getting slugs to shoot as good as pellets. Not sure where that point got missed but that's what the OP was about.

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I disagree. I was referring to the ORIGINAL topic, where OP asked whether people expected their "pellet guns" to shoot slugs, and asked "Just wondering what others think about this topic?" Very little was mentioned about "effort" in that original thread first post and then this thread evolved from that one ADDING the "effort" part. So while I do see what you are saying, I'll simply refer back to the original post and question. But for those who absolutely want to shoot slugs and are willing to work at it, YES, more effort would almost certainly be required to shoot slugs accurately in relation to pellets. But SOME shooters seem to have acceptable results with BOTH in THEIR RIFLES. I guess that is the "luck" thing that was mentioned.

Perfectly relevant. But the topic was never about "getting slugs to work"-tuning for slugs was never mentioned, at least not by me. It was about SOME guns shooting slugs as accurately as pellets AS THEY ARE. YOURS obviously didn't so shooting slugs in it would make no sense in that case. Others have seen different results with different guns. I'm predominantly a pellet shooter as well, but slugs have certain advantages and SOME might find them useful IF their gun shoots them well enough. JMO certainly.

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Actually that's EXACTLY what this topic is about. Putting in the work and tuning to get slugs to shoot as good as pellets out of air rifles. The EFFORT in getting slugs to shoot as good as pellets. Not sure where that point got missed but that's what the OP was about.

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I disagree. I was referring to the ORIGINAL topic, where OP asked whether people expected their "pellet guns" to shoot slugs, and asked "Just wondering what others think about this topic?" Very little was mentioned about "effort" in that original thread first post and then this thread evolved from that one ADDING the "effort" part. So while I do see what you are saying, I'll simply refer back to the original post and question. But for those who absolutely want to shoot slugs and are willing to work at it, YES, more effort would almost certainly be required to shoot slugs accurately in relation to pellets. But SOME shooters seem to have acceptable results with BOTH in THEIR RIFLES. I guess that is the "luck" thing that was mentioned.

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Yeah because calling it pellet guns implies they were only designed to shoot pellets. Sure theres many of those and yeah they would probably not shoot well.

However times have changed and many guns are designed with this in mind. Gauntlets, avengers, edguns, daystate, fx etc. Calling them air rifles opens up to a more honest response more reflective of current state of air guns. All IMO of course.

My error here. I made my views clear in the ORIGINAL thread and OP took the effort to rephrase. So yes, more effort is probably universally necessary to TUNE for slugs in most any airgun. I shouldn't have posted in THIS thread.

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Yeah because calling it pellet guns implies they were only designed to shoot pellets. Sure theres many of those and yeah they would probably not shoot well.

However times have changed and many guns are designed with this in mind. Gauntlets, avengers, edguns, daystate, fx etc. Calling them air rifles opens up to a more honest response more reflective of current state of air guns. All IMO of course.

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I don't think I can agree with that. Lol if people are really swayed to answering honestly if someone says pellet gun vs air rifle then those people likely have other issues to deal with and how do you know if there answering honestly at all either way? I'd also venture to say still the majority of airguns are designed to shoot pellets first with some recently also for slugs being possible and also very much capable of shooting them very well. But calling them a pellet rifle is now a wrong way to call them?

I think what Centercut is talking about are the pellet guns so to speak. People buying whatever brand of gun and thinking they'll shoot airgun slugs. I don't think FX or Daystate could fall under those as I know they've tested slugs in there guns alot. Matt Dubber and slug barrels and FXs Hybrids. Daystate with the ART team with ART barrels and now the Howler slugs. But say Taipans, Crickets, Vulcans, Uragans, and other brands (not sure why only bullpups are in my head at the moment but I'm blanking lol) I'm sure are designed as pellet guns. Barrels are optimized for pellets. 

Just cause my crappie jig catches bass and bluegill with regularity doesn't mean it can't be called a crappie jig anymore.

I could be way off in my thinking though. I mean no offense or disrespect at all towards you just trying to explain my thinking. 

Same towards you @bandg no offense or disrespect meant. Just explaining my thinking was all.

@dairyboy many states are beginning to differentiate high-power "pre-charged pneumatic" airguns from BB / pellet / pump rifles. I noticed this in my own state of WA, where they modified the target shooting laws to include that specific language - bundling PCPs with firearm regulations.

Digressing, I really don't know if it's worth reasoning with some of the folks that haven't had any luck shooting slugs from their airguns, knowing that I can pick up my Vet, Leshiy, EVOL, and dare I say this Maverick with the short .30 TJ and shoot slugs accurately anytime in conditions that are unfavorable for pellets. Anyone with the proper motivation and the attentiveness to detail should be able to figure out the recipe sooner or later. I'd even invite some to send me their rifles when I have more time available, and I could most likely tell you what the problems are that need to be addressed (without shame, I wouldn't out anyone asking for help).

@dairyboy many states are beginning to differentiate high-power "pre-charged pneumatic" airguns from BB / pellet / pump rifles. I noticed this in my own state of WA, where they modified the target shooting laws to include that specific language - bundling PCPs with firearm regulations.

Digressing, I really don't know if it's worth reasoning with some of the folks that haven't had any luck shooting slugs from their airguns, knowing that I can pick up my Vet, Leshiy, EVOL, and dare I say this Maverick with the short .30 TJ and shoot slugs accurately anytime in conditions that are unfavorable for pellets. Anyone with the proper motivation and the attentiveness to detail should be able to figure out the recipe sooner or later. I'd even invite some to send me their rifles when I have more time available, and I could most likely tell you what the problems are that need to be addressed (without shame, I wouldn't out anyone asking for help).

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I've seen your posts and it seems that nearly all of your guns are HIGHLY modified. I respect and admire and dare say even covet your abilities and machining know-how, but to be fair to the topic, you've put considerable effort into getting those guns where they are. 

Yes slugs can be shot well in conditions unfavorable for pellets, but the average airgun (even the average high-end airgun) is not likely to shoot slugs as well as pellets. At least not without some clever and knowledgeable machining. 

The only gun I’ve owned that will shoot slugs accurately (not competitive accurate) is my evol .22 it is all stock not modified at all, interestingly it has a LW 12 groove (land & groove) barrel.

I’m not a slug shooter but found it interesting anyway.

One more thing a little off topic, I’m starting to believe the land & groove barrels are more accurate and shoot a wider range of pellets accurately, I’ve had several of each and losing a little confidence in the poly barrels?

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Yeah because calling it pellet guns implies they were only designed to shoot pellets. Sure theres many of those and yeah they would probably not shoot well.

However times have changed and many guns are designed with this in mind. Gauntlets, avengers, edguns, daystate, fx etc. Calling them air rifles opens up to a more honest response more reflective of current state of air guns. All IMO of course.

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I don't think I can agree with that. Lol if people are really swayed to answering honestly if someone says pellet gun vs air rifle then those people likely have other issues to deal with and how do you know if there answering honestly at all either way? I'd also venture to say still the majority of airguns are designed to shoot pellets first with some recently also for slugs being possible and also very much capable of shooting them very well. But calling them a pellet rifle is now a wrong way to call them?

I think what Centercut is talking about are the pellet guns so to speak. People buying whatever brand of gun and thinking they'll shoot airgun slugs. I don't think FX or Daystate could fall under those as I know they've tested slugs in there guns alot. Matt Dubber and slug barrels and FXs Hybrids. Daystate with the ART team with ART barrels and now the Howler slugs. But say Taipans, Crickets, Vulcans, Uragans, and other brands (not sure why only bullpups are in my head at the moment but I'm blanking lol) I'm sure are designed as pellet guns. Barrels are optimized for pellets. 

Just cause my crappie jig catches bass and bluegill with regularity doesn't mean it can't be called a crappie jig anymore.

I could be way off in my thinking though. I mean no offense or disrespect at all towards you just trying to explain my thinking. 

Same towards you @bandg no offense or disrespect meant. Just explaining my thinking was all.

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I don't care what you call it or anyone calls it. You're missing the point. If you make a thread about slugs in a pellet gun vs slugs in an air rifle you might get different responses.

If i was so way off the title of the thread wouldn't have changed.

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Yeah because calling it pellet guns implies they were only designed to shoot pellets. Sure theres many of those and yeah they would probably not shoot well.

However times have changed and many guns are designed with this in mind. Gauntlets, avengers, edguns, daystate, fx etc. Calling them air rifles opens up to a more honest response more reflective of current state of air guns. All IMO of course.

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I don't think I can agree with that. Lol if people are really swayed to answering honestly if someone says pellet gun vs air rifle then those people likely have other issues to deal with and how do you know if there answering honestly at all either way? I'd also venture to say still the majority of airguns are designed to shoot pellets first with some recently also for slugs being possible and also very much capable of shooting them very well. But calling them a pellet rifle is now a wrong way to call them?

I think what Centercut is talking about are the pellet guns so to speak. People buying whatever brand of gun and thinking they'll shoot airgun slugs. I don't think FX or Daystate could fall under those as I know they've tested slugs in there guns alot. Matt Dubber and slug barrels and FXs Hybrids. Daystate with the ART team with ART barrels and now the Howler slugs. But say Taipans, Crickets, Vulcans, Uragans, and other brands (not sure why only bullpups are in my head at the moment but I'm blanking lol) I'm sure are designed as pellet guns. Barrels are optimized for pellets. 

Just cause my crappie jig catches bass and bluegill with regularity doesn't mean it can't be called a crappie jig anymore.

I could be way off in my thinking though. I mean no offense or disrespect at all towards you just trying to explain my thinking. 

Same towards you @bandg no offense or disrespect meant. Just explaining my thinking was all.

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I don't care what you call it or anyone calls it. You're missing the point. If you make a thread about slugs in a pellet gun vs slugs in an air rifle you might get different responses.

If i was so way off the title of the thread wouldn't have changed.

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I wasn't aware of the title being changed. I only saw the title as air rifle.

@dairyboy many states are beginning to differentiate high-power "pre-charged pneumatic" airguns from BB / pellet / pump rifles. I noticed this in my own state of WA, where they modified the target shooting laws to include that specific language - bundling PCPs with firearm regulations.

Digressing, I really don't know if it's worth reasoning with some of the folks that haven't had any luck shooting slugs from their airguns, knowing that I can pick up my Vet, Leshiy, EVOL, and dare I say this Maverick with the short .30 TJ and shoot slugs accurately anytime in conditions that are unfavorable for pellets. Anyone with the proper motivation and the attentiveness to detail should be able to figure out the recipe sooner or later. I'd even invite some to send me their rifles when I have more time available, and I could most likely tell you what the problems are that need to be addressed (without shame, I wouldn't out anyone asking for help).

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Interesting! I wasn't aware of WA modifying rules. My home state as well. 

And I'm not sure if your saying that I'm against thinking you can shoot slugs out of airguns as I know it's possible and have had luck with multiple like my Leshiy, R5M Standard and Long all in .22 and R5 Super Long .30, Uragan .22 and .30. My EVOL did well but not with the precision of pellets I came to enjoy. Im just saying the effort involved to do so the majority of the time is more than if trying to shoot pellets. I've seen the work you do which is amazing and seen the conditions you shoot in. I agree if you want to shoot in those conditions pellets are definitely not the way. Especially when you need to drive so far to shoot and are at the mercy of whatever the weather might be when you get to shoot. I'm blessed where I get to choose the conditions I want to shoot in. 

Interesting! I wasn't aware of WA modifying rules. My home state as well. 

And I'm not sure if your saying that I'm against thinking you can shoot slugs out of airguns as I know it's possible and have had luck with multiple like my Leshiy, R5M Standard and Long all in .22 and R5 Super Long .30, Uragan .22 and .30. My EVOL did well but not with the precision of pellets I came to enjoy. Im just saying the effort involved to do so the majority of the time is more than if trying to shoot pellets. I've seen the work you do which is amazing and seen the conditions you shoot in. I agree if you want to shoot in those conditions pellets are definitely not the way. Especially when you need to drive so far to shoot and are at the mercy of whatever the weather might be when you get to shoot. I'm blessed where I get to choose the conditions I want to shoot in.

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Yeah man, they updated it on Jan 18th 2021, check out (3)c. on this document (it's actually more verbose than what I said): https://wdfw.wa.gov/about/wdfw-lands/recreation-planning/rule-development/target-shooting# 
If there's anything positive coming out of state regulations, we will soon be able to legally hunt grouse, turkeys, and some fur bearers with airguns finally (I had lots of feedback and input to the state on their regulation change proposal).

Digressing, I really don't know if it's worth reasoning with some of the folks that haven't had any luck shooting slugs from their airguns, knowing that I can pick up my Vet, Leshiy, EVOL, and dare I say this Maverick with the short .30 TJ and shoot slugs accurately anytime in conditions that are unfavorable for pellets. Anyone with the proper motivation and the attentiveness to detail should be able to figure out the recipe sooner or later. I'd even invite some to send me their rifles when I have more time available, and I could most likely tell you what the problems are that need to be addressed (without shame, I wouldn't out anyone asking for help).

Click to expand...

I've seen your posts and it seems that nearly all of your guns are HIGHLY modified. I respect and admire and dare say even covet your abilities and machining know-how, but to be fair to the topic, you've put considerable effort into getting those guns where they are. 

Yes slugs can be shot well in conditions unfavorable for pellets, but the average airgun (even the average high-end airgun) is not likely to shoot slugs as well as pellets. At least not without some clever and knowledgeable machining.

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Good points Cole. 
Gino, you do great work on your guns, but that alone proves my point regarding effort to shoot slugs as accurately (or more so) than pellets. Your Taipan Vet and other Air Rifles are about as “stock” as Dale Earnhardt Jr’s Chevrolet Camaro...

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@centercut @franklink LOL!! That cracked me up Mike!  Ok, that's a fair analogy for these Supervet builds and I appreciate the kind words!

That said, there is at least one common denominator to all of the rifles that I have setup to shoot slugs accurately (including the stock/stock'ish rifles) - and that is they have been properly chambered to shoot the given slug chosen for each of them. I use good reamers with optimal specs for each caliber / slug that I shoot.

Another important detail that I discovered is that you have to be sure the rifle is loading the projectiles properly! Loosey goosey loading mechanisms and/or some of these "slug probes" can really damage a projectile, causing them to shoot inconsistently. I won't call out specific rifle manufacturers, but there are some that are not great with their chamber / "leade in" machining, and that has been the difference between +MOA and -MOA.

I could go on and on, but everything else that I would have to say about what I have learned revolves around the fact that there are numerous things that play into accuracy and consistency. Living in an area that has regular wind and varying weather, I just wanted to build rifles that would shoot anywhere, anytime that only required micro (hammer) adjustments to adapt for the conditions of that day, and not every rifle / platform has been compatible with those requirements.

Why to overcomplicate these things according to these forums there is million sub moa impacts. Just buy impact and shoot sub moa allday everyday and with anything you wish! Its rare breed tho everyone seems to have one but to this day I havent seen one.. Its like this legendary natzi gold filled train. Everyone speaks about it, everyone wants it but no one has seen it.