I have a Daystate Red Wolf, and have recently discovered an apparent problem with magazine use. The rifle shoots great, but will occasionally shoot a really bad group, which I had previously attributed to a dirty barrel. It did this yesterday, cleaned the barrel, then began shooting with a loaded magazine, and the problem persisted. I went to the single shot tray, which appears to have resolved the problem, back to shooting like a laser. I had not previously suspected the magazine, because I always assumed that any issue caused by a magazine would be both consistent, and relatively subtle. But, this was neither, it occurs only intermittently, but the result is significant, maybe a 2" group at 25 yards! I haven't shot it enough yet with exclusive single-shot use to say this is for sure the issue, but it certainly appears so at this point. Anyway, just wondering if anyone else has had similar experience?
Daystate magazine issue
- Thread starter elh0102
- Start date
In my case, there is no indication of damage to either the probe or breech face. It appears to be an alignment issue, such that the pellet is slightly damaged when loaded. Of course, I'm still early in testing this, and I could be wrong about the whole thing, but the indication so far is compelling in pointing to a mag issue.
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If somebody is willing to work with me doing testig and send me a daystate MAG to pull dimensions from, I'm happy to try to design one that works better. The resultant design I will give away for free so anyone can make their own.
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Just shot a couple of groups in the back yard, same results. Flyers with the mag, one hole from the s/s tray. Here's my theory. The mag has to be wide enough to fill the loading port space. Which means, the pellet has a relatively long path to travel, through two parts of the mag, then into the breech, and a slight misalignment can easily exist. I had an FX Crown, and the performance from the magazine was perfect with it. In comparison, the Crown loading port is small, the mag is only one layer of material, and the pellet has a much shorter distance to travel into the chamber. It is also a much tighter fit than the Daystate. As an experiment, I might load a few pellets from the mag, then push each one out from the muzzle and examine it. Problem is, I need to take off the bottle and discharge all the pressure to avoid working with a loaded and charged rifle. Pushing it out might cause some damage too, so maybe not worth the effort. I'm not bashing Daystate, and frankly, I don't mind using them in single shot mode 90% of the time. But, I believe a better magazine can be designed.
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Also look a the video that Tomico put on his utube channel about how well the pellet feeds into the barrel of his Redwolf hp from inside of Barrel! Nice vid. Worth watching!, also I don’t think you would see much in pushing pellet thru mag into barrel and out the muzzle because of breach o-ring and choke at end of barrel IMO?
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I don't own a Red Wolf so I cannot comment on that particular rifle, but I do own a Pulsar HP and a Renegade. Both suffer from the same issue you describe and pellet probe damage as well. I have found with mine that groups with the first 5-6 shots using the magazines are pretty tight, then they open up on shots 6-10. Sometimes dramatically, I mean inches at 25 yards.The pellet probes on both guns are scarred, actually AOA replaced the Renegade probe because the magazine actually made a hole in it. I also got a new magazine but it's exactly the same as the old one. Perhaps as the magazine unwinds the spring tension isn't sufficient to align the pellet properly for shots 6-10?? I don't know, but as it stands I always try to top off the magazine after I take 5 shots, or just use the SST.
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I have always thought that a good design would not necessarily be self-indexing, thus skipping any spring tension issue. Seems the rotating cylinder could be slightly above the mag body and textured so the shooter could cock the side lever, then reach and rotate to the next position. Assuming a snug fit in the loading port, that could eliminate virtually all slop.
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I was thinking of pushing it back out the chamber from the muzzle end. But, there are several problems with doing that, and not sure it would be worthwhile.
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I made completely different design, self indexing and very gentle to the pellets, great reports from end users. Caliber 177,22 and 30 tested, still have to check for some minor changes on 25 cal. 
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Interesting! What's their price and how do they "self index"? (Or do you, the shooter index it yourself?)
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They are spring loaded and for the price please contact me in PM because this is not Classifieds section
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Strangely I did some testing at my club tonight, fired 200 shots to record the ES and did it with the mag to save time, however when I repeated the test with the single shot loader I found the ES to be a lot higher 16 VS 26, to say I was surprised was an understatement!
I will repeat the test at 100 yards as from my experience the groups are pretty much identical at only 25 yards with mag or tray, the higher ES may highlight something else though.
I will repeat the test at 100 yards as from my experience the groups are pretty much identical at only 25 yards with mag or tray, the higher ES may highlight something else though.
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The ES could be an anomaly, and unrelated to any magazine issue. Pellet deformation in loading would be much more detrimental to accuracy than a difference of 10 fps of ES.
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This would be a fairly simple mechanism to design, but not terribly different from the two shot trays in function no? Each shot would require reaching a hand up to fiddle with the breech area.
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I guess it gets down to a preference. I'd much rather rotate a wheel than fumble with a pellet. I'm thinking of field use, granted, it makes little difference at the bench. And maybe others are more adept at handling pellets.
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I tend to agree on the benefits of a drum for field use. I literally can't bring myself to use the mag knowing it's less accurate, despite having got it to within 'workable' limits for some short to mid range pesting. So I find myself fumbling away in some situations such as gold course pest control where we commonly cruise around on a cart, hitting bumps etc.
The drum idea is very similar to the Rowan engineering universal magazines and could be useful as a sort of fumble free loader sitting above the sst.
https://rowanengineering.com/products20.htm
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Try the pneumatic ballistics 20 shot magazines. They are awesome, no loss of accuracy and no marks on the probe.
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I like it!, nice tip, hate to see conversion to US dollars( looks like $90.00+ @ today’s exchange rate? )plus shipping to get it state side?
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