Barrel design and ammo type

Forums Big Bore Airguns Barrel design and ammo type

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    Joe Shooter
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    The Benjamin Bulldog and Benjamin Rogue are said to be engineered around the Benjamin Nosler bullet. During the time of the Benjamin Rogue .357, Crosman even sold rebranded Air Venturi cast bullets for use in this gun. As such, is it safe to say that the barrel in the Bulldog and Rogue are similar to the FX smooth twist X barrel, in that they are designed for cast and swagged ammo as opposed to diabolo style pellets? Both guns shoot diabolo style pellets very well also, but I am question the specific engineering or design of their barrels. Thanks for all constructive responses in advance!

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    tsmith
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    The FX smooth twist barrel was designed around and to work with the JSB diabolo pellets.  I don’t think they shoot slugs well.  “From what I’ve read”.

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    Joe Shooter
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    I actually meant the FX smooth twist X barrel…IT is designed for slugs, and I would think cast and swagged bullets would be in that category as well.

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    Skip-in-WV
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    What, exactly, is the differences between the barrel types?

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    starlingassn
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    the x barrel system has both pellet and slug liners that you can get.

     

     

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    Joe Shooter
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    My question is specifically regarding the Benjamin Bulldog .357 and the Benjamin Rogue .357. If anyone has any knowledge of those barrels, please reply.

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    Kinetic45
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    Well, I designed this bullet just for the Bulldog / Pitbull & Slayer because the Benjamin Nosler shoots so poorly

    https://www.airgunnation.com/topic/new-357-air-rifle-bullet-at-noe/

     

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    Joe Shooter
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    How many Benjamin Bulldog owners did you poll regarding how well or bad the Nosler bullets shoot…because Nosler's shoot pretty damn well in MY Bulldog .357 AND Rogue .357. They aren't match quality if that is your idea of "shooting so poorly"; but I get pretty consistant 2-3" groups with Noslers @ 40yds.

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    T3PRanch
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    I get consistent 2" groups (minute of cottontail  rabbit head) with my cast bullets at 100 yards. I generally do not shoot paper or off a bench except when sighting in a gun!

    Loosely speaking bullets usually require a faster twist than pellets since they are spin stabilized and not drag stabilized like a diabolo pellet! 

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    Kinetic45
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    Joe Shooter

    How many Benjamin Bulldog owners did you poll regarding how well or bad the Nosler bullets shoot…because Nosler's shoot pretty damn well in MY Bulldog .357 AND Rogue .357. They aren't match quality if that is your idea of "shooting so poorly"; but I get pretty consistant 2-3" groups with Noslers @ 40yds.

    That TERRIBLE accuracy. My Pitbull Mega (plus JSAR SS valve) with NSA 142 BTHP will do right around 1/2" all day long at 50 yards.  https://nielsenspecialtyammo.com/collections/357-cal  A lot of Bulldog owners also get good performance with the 110gr NSA too.

    With my custom NOE 358-152-HP I mentioned in my previous post I get one hole groups at 50 yards and 1 MOA OR LESS at 100 yards.

    Like I said the Noslers are junk. It's a mystery why, I sure can't say.  It's well known on the airgun forums how disappointing they have been, I bought a box and ended up melting down over half of them to add to my scrap lead.

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    Joe Shooter
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    So your comparing a custom Pitbull, with an over the counter Bulldog…fair comparison 😕. I understand you are trying to market a product here; but after 8 years in the United States Marine Corps, I stand on the notion that a gun is only as accurate as the person shooting it. And to be honest, I didn't give the Bulldog it's proper due earlier. My groups are typically better than I presented, more like 1.5" groups 40 yds. Not taking anything away from your bullets however; they look great and I'm sure they shoot great also.

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    Kinetic45
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    I don't get a cent for the NOE molds, I'm not trying to market a product!  I just designed the bullet based on 45 years of benchrest and hunting shooting experience and got it produced to benefit other airgun shooters. In fact I spent over $700 on several prototype designs, all two cavity (first one from https://www.mountainmolds.com/  cost $100; then the Accurate 36-168J version http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=36-168J-D.png, then it got sent for HP at http://www.hollowpointmold.com/ combined cost for mold n HP was $240) then finally the $300 per cherry cost for the NOE improved version one… OUT OF MY POCKET!

    And I also do not have any financial ties to NSA air rifle bullets, just pointing out a good choice for stock Bulldog shooters.

     

    And FYI another good Bulldog 152gr to 154gr depending on alloy bullet is the http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/product_info.php?cPath=35_578&products_id=5488

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    spysir
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    Some people say the was a barrel change, poor accuracy being the reason they closed out the first run at $550, had crosman normal shortage period then re-appeared grouping better and a couple hundred more.     Maybe.

     1st run bulldog ( if there really is such a thing) well under 2" at 50 w/nosler, never tried the others.

     

    John

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    Joe Shooter
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    I'm not sure about that barrel change/first run Bulldog story either. While the Bulldog MAY be engineered aound the Nosler  bullet, and mine does shot Noslers very well; my Bulldog shoots JSB and PolyMags best…consistant single hole groups @ 65yds with each.

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    knifemaker
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    Sorry, most of us have slightly higher standards ween it comes to accuracy. that is NOT Accurate. Period!

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    Willie14228
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    When I want to carve or sculp a piece of granite I use a precision small hammer but if I want to break a rock I pick up a sledgehammer……  I really don't get it why does precision shooters want to try and compare a target gun with a hunting gun?

    At 40 yards I've punched holes into an dumpster with the nosler and drilled through plenty of big thick shields and thick skulls to the vitals with them at longer ranges. Big Bores still are for the most part engineered around the three inch group kill area for big game. 

    Do I like putting a gun on a bench and challenging myself to take take shots out in the 200==300 yard shot…. you bet, but my reason for spending the extra money for a big bore rifle is big game to put in the fridge not to put 5 shots into one hole on a paper target at xxx yards or ping a steel Target at 300 yards. As an ethical Hunter I would never try to take game at that range with an airgun. And knowing my abilities wouldn't likely take it with any gun 

    I do agree the nosler could do with some accuracy improvement (and price adjustment) but the bulldog was not engineered to shoot 100 plus yards for Target and precision it was engineered for 40=100 yards for Medium to Large game with a bullet that can maximize it's KE into penetration through thick hides and bone. 

    One of the greatest things Benjamin has always had going for them is a platform that tuners can have a field day with and so it wasn't long after the first bulldog hit the shelves (and before) that the screwdrivers and torx bits went to work undressing the girl to see what she looked like and what tweeks can be made.

    For a platform that can be taken out of the box by a novice air gunner and hunt large game with success at a reasonable price the Bull Dog and the Nosler does exactly what they are engineered for and does it quite well. It's bulldog design makes it ideal for short range thick wood and brush gun work

    With a fast at rest to shoulder shot without hanging up in brush while still lending the power-penatration to pop a big boar with a head shot within the 50-75 yard range and even better have more shots in the clip if needed (I don't climb trees as fast as I used too) the bulldog and Nosler are my go-to for brush popping hogs 

    For those precision shooters who wants to spend hundreds extra to ping steel targets at ranges you need rolling transportation to go back-n-forth to check ur target more power to ya but please don't misrepresent the engineered purpose of a base platform by trying to compare it to your custom re-engineered purpose built one

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    Sorry Joe the answer as I see it is embedded in the little bit of a rant. I believe it wasn't just the barrel and bullet it was the concept as a whole, Benjamin engineered a short barrelled (relatively speaking) big bore repeating rifle with an air supply that is able to shoot two clips with the KE and penatration at range to take down med to large game

     

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    Joe Shooter
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    Well said Willie…good points!

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