50 meters, Walther LGV, Benjamin Trail NP 177, Benjamin Trail NP 22

Forums Springers, Pumpers, C02, & Vintage 50 meters, Walther LGV, Benjamin Trail NP 177, Benjamin Trail NP 22

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    Windmill01
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    It’s a windy afternoon in down town Queensland and I thought I’d pit my new Walther against my old friends the Benjamin brothers. Set up the Target at 50 meters and decided to set the bar with the Walther, mmmmmm things didn’t shoot too well.
    So I dragged out the trusty 177 Trail and pulled of 11 shots ( now to the defence of the177 I shot the last of the Barracudas, 4 and the rest were [email protected] Barracuda match, the match seemed to group better) Not too bad considering it was windy and its a 177.
    Out comes my goto the 22 Trail. I think it shot the best.
    To say I’m disappointed in the Walther is an under statement. It’s shoots unreal at 30 mths but out to 50 is poor. I’ll do some more practice, it is probably just me. Has anyone else experienced this type of phenomenon with expensive and not so expensive break barrels?




     

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    oldspook
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    Sometimes velocity can change enough as the pellet travels down range to allow the pellet to destabilize?  Maybe that is what you are seeing with the Walther?  Have you tried a number of different pellets in it at range?

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    Windmill01
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    Regrettably pellet choice where we live is somewhat limited. I use H&N Field,Target and [email protected] 14.66 gr. I have a few JSB jumbo’s
    @ 15.9 gr I’ll give them a try today and let you know.

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    JoeWayneRhea
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    +1 with Oldspook . It was the first thing that I thought of. My personal rifle with I believe H&N match does that at around 40 yards …You can see it start making corkscrews ..And my gun isn’t very fast .

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    Rock-Steady
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    Wow at 55 yards those are good groups to me!  :)

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    Airgun_N00B
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    Not bad… Are heavier pellets more accurate on that Trail? I got a Hatsan 125 Vortex in .22 caliber, and the Crosman 14.3 Hollowpoints are all over the place, but the Premiers seem pretty decent, haven’t shot past 15 yards at paper… Hole in hole at 15 yards :) 

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    Windmill01
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    Well I started to do some testing. I used the JSB jumbos first but I started to fall asleep between pulling the trigger and the pellet hitting the paper. I found a half of a tin H&N Field,Target,trophy Green @ 9.56gr and they started to group very well after a few shots but the wind has now come up. It’s blowing at least 20 knots so I’ll have to wait but the greens looked promising. I also tried altering my hold on the pellets I was using yesterday but the wind started to interfere. I’ll keep you posted.

    Airgun NOOB I have tried Crosman domed 14.??gr, JSB jumbos 15.9 and the H&N Field Target and trophy 14.66 gr. The 22  Trail likes the H&N the best. At shorter distances say 25 meters i can on my day put 5 inside an Aussie one cent piece.
     

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    Windmill01
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    Thanks Rock Steady but I was expecting more from my expensive (to me) Walther. At just over one grand with scope I was hoping for some good results. The Walther is rated at 625 fps and I bought it knowing that but I was expecting better accuracy over distance with it. I’ll keep trying to source some other pellets (like oldspook and Joe suggested) to see what can be achieved.

    If someone reads this and owns a Walther LGV Ultra in 22 cal could you advise me on the pellet that suits your rifle the best.
    Thanks

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    oldspook
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    Wind drift for a CPHP at 50 yards in a 1 MPH wind at 45 degrees is about 0.3″.  So if you had a 3 to 8 mph wind and you were not holding off for wind the group would string about 1.5″ left/right and there would be some vertical component as well due to spin drift.  That part varies with the rifling twist and muzzle velocity in combination with the wind.

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    Windmill01
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    Thanks old spook whilst I’m not up on exact movements and measurements on pellets under wind affected conditions I do hold off in some windy conditions. If you look at the first group for the Walther I was aiming dead on. The wind was about 10 to 15 knots I think and from the right. For the second group with the 177 I held off to the right, I can’t recall how far as it just seems to come naturally. I always seem to hold off further for the lighter 177 cal. And with the last group for the 22 I aimed dead on as winds of that strength don’t seem to effect the trajectory that much.
    I also have also read that optically centering your scope will improve your groups at various distances as in some scopes the variance can be significant. I’ve ordered a scope mount that can be adjusted without touching the scope turrets. I’m looking forward to compairing the results.
    It’s early morning here and there is no wind at the moment, I’ll give it another go after breaky.

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    Smaug
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    “JoeWayneRhea”+1 with Oldspook . It was the first thing that I thought of. My personal rifle with I believe H&N match does that at around 40 yards …You can see it start making corkscrews ..And my gun isn’t very fast .

    
Agreed to both. Joe’s probably got the most accurate springer here, but at 50m in wind, it would be slaughtered by a $150 magnum Crosman.

    I think that’s what your’e seeing here.

    Repeat this on a windless day first chance you get, and I think your spendy Walther will redeem itself. ;)  Wind, esp. with any kind of gusting, makes one hell of a difference.

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    Windmill01
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    Ok the wind has dropped this morning considerably so out I ventured. 
    – 10 shots on the left are with H&N Green 9.56 gr (alloy)
    – 10 on the right are with H&N 14.66 gr (lead)
    The scope was adjusted for the green, aimed dead on, no adgustment for wind ( approx 5 knts ) Fired off 5 shots. Went to the right target and fired off 5 lead pellets, one mil dot hold over.
    Followed the same procedure went back to the left and fired off 5 green and then onto the right with 5 lead.
    Well what do you guys think, I like the green, they are 8.29 fpe compared to 12.72 fpe for the lead. I’m ok with this. Both types of pellets grouped 4 shots. Interesting 

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    Windmill01
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    PS I didn’t use the jumbos as I would still be asleep waiting for the pellet to hit the paper lol.

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    Smaug
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    Nice groups! It seems to confirm that it was the wind that was messing you up earlier.

    If you’re shooting on your own property and you have a well, I’d definitely go with the Greens. Otherwise, stick with lead, as they won’t get blown as much when the wind kicks up. In game, they’ll deform more too, which is good.

    Also, you may consider getting Baracuda Green next time. They’re closer in weight to a light lead pellet and more aerodynamic than FTTs. They’re the best-shooting lead free pellets I’ve found so far.

    FWIW, I shot a field target match with my TX200 last year, when it was shooting at 9 FPE. Any target out to 30 yards was in mortal danger, but past that, I didn’t have the hold-over right and it dropped faster than I was ready for, and the wind carried it more than I was ready for. Now, it’s tuned and shooting at about 14 FPE and should be better at longer range.

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    Windmill01
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    Thanks for the tip Smaug, I’ll try to obtain those pellets you mentioned. I shoot on our property and we do have a bore, dam and a creek so the greens are looking good. I don’t hunt much in our property as the wife likes all the furry rabbits and hares. Some feral cats about at night and that’s fun. Also some foxes now and then mainly at night when your in bed you can hear them call. We also have dingoes and wild dogs that frequent our place chasing the wallabies and Roos but I’m a bit under gunned for them.
    I do like the hitting power of the lead pellets so I’ll probably mix them up now and then.

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    Bobbed06
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    Not much to add here that hasnt already been said. I find the Crosman/Benjamin nitro pistons extremely accurate. I routinely take 35 yard shots at my 1.5 inch spinner from the second story window in wind (I live in a valley) and have no issues smacking it every time…well, I missed once and I knew it before I pulled the trigger.  I use Crosman Premier Hollow Points 22 in 14.3 Gr, and will switch to the Magnums when I run out as they fly even straighter without the hollow point. I should be receiving my new 177 today! I have 10.5 Ultra Mags for it already.

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    oldspook
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    “Windmill01”
    Well what do you guys think, I like the green, they are 8.29 fpe compared to 12.72 fpe for the lead. I’m ok with this. Both types of pellets grouped 4 shots. Interesting 

     

    
Go with the lead because 50% more energy is 50% more energy..  That is a big difference at 8 fpe.

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