.177 vs. .22 hunting at a fixed energy level: any real difference?

I was just thinking about this yesterday. Let's say we're at a certain energy limit, as we have on a certain model of springer. For the sake of argument, let's say 12 FPE.

If I shoot a typical .177 hunting pellet, it'd be moving out at around 760 fps. in .22 it would be somewhat less. Maybe around 600?

It's said that .22 bucks the wind better and hits harder. But is that true even if it is moving slower? Or only if it's moving at the same velocity? The pellet's heavier, but the wind has longer to act on it, before the pellet hits home.

As for hitting harder, springers in .22 often have a bit more retained downrange energy than .177, but it is within 1 FPE.

Your experiences?
 
My experience with hunting is that larger calibers are noticeably more effective even if the energy is comparable. 

I mainly use 25 cal guns for hunting because small game dies quicker with anything except a perfect head shot. I hit a tiny chipmunk with a 22 last week and it took nearly a minute for it to die (as I hit the body instead of it's head). I've taken tons of chipmunks with my 25 cal guns and they always die instantly, even from body shots on lower power settings. 

As for accuracy, a faster speed does mean a flatter trajectory which is easier to range. Also, it's easier to get smaller groups with smaller pellets. That being said, I've never had much luck beyond 50yards with .177 guns. I would only use one if I was competing in FT or BR matches. That is the only scenario (in America) where a .22 would be tuned to a lower speed (to fall with the fpe limit). Otherwise, then is no reason why a 22 PCP gun can't be tuned to be as fast as the .177. 

 
Going off of Chairgun let's say you were shooting the 10.34 JSB in .177 and 15.9 JSBs in .22. (Maybe you'll shoot lighter pellet in .22 but it was the lightest JSB there was on the list and lighter will have a lower BC) Both pellets on there have the same BC so retained energy at 50yds is just over 8fpe with both starting at 11.9 at muzzle. The .177 is moving 140fps~ faster than the .22 so if I had to choose I would pick the .177. But also depends on what your targets are. Being I shoot birds mostly I've heard .177 is preferred as it penetrates better.
 
I'm with Zebra. When you think about it, the cross section of a .22 vs. the .25 is considerably smaller. The 25 will make a larger hole, have a greater impact (pun, pun) on internal organ damage thus my choice of caliber for hunting. 

Here is a video Ted did a few years back on the differences between calibers sans the FPE displacement. 

 
"Dairyboy"Although I do agree with what you guys are saying about .25 is better (really .30 is king) but he was asking about springers in .177 and .22 both at 12fpe.
Well, zebra DID say that larger calibers seem more effective, even when energy is the same. It was only at the end that he suggested I don't really need to choose, except in field target. (Assuming PCP) I'm mostly a springer guy, these days. 

For Everything I shoot, .177 is fine. It's just that once I awhile, I'd like to take a body shot, and wonder if any of my few failures would have been successes if I were shooting a .20 or .22 springer. On one shot from the .177 Marauder, I was going for a heart shot, but hit the shoulder instead. He ran off with his one arm dragging. 18 FPE with a .22 may have penetrated more deeply and done him in. 

Or that shot a couple weeks ago, where I hit the jaw? That bigger caliber might've made that a (lower) brain shot, instead of a just a crippler. (Though that shot might've been even lower, if it were .22...)

Just thinking; I'm not sure I'm ready to buy a .22 just yet. 
 
If it's the same speed, a small .177 might go through your prey (depending on factors like distance, pellet type (HP vs round nose) and the type of game), while a .22 or bigger caliber mostly doesn't at those power levels. If you don't have to worry about what's behind your target, it's nog much of an issue, but if you shoot like inside a barn or in an urban area, a low to medium-powered .22 might be a better choice.

With regard to body versus head shots, Jim Chapman has an interesting view on the topic.
 
"Jonnes"If it's the same speed, a small .177 might go through your prey (depending on factors like distance, pellet type (HP vs round nose) and the type of game), while a .22 or bigger caliber mostly doesn't at those power levels. If you don't have to worry about what's behind your target, it's nog much of an issue, but if you shoot like inside a barn or in an urban area, a low to medium-powered .22 might be a better choice.

With regard to body versus head shots, Jim Chapman has an interesting view on the topic.
Jim was using a 30 ft-lb .22 PCP to shoot BIRDS in that video. Hardly the way to make a case for not over-penetrating. ;)

A 12-20 FPE .177 would be better in that regard.

The point about body shots though, is well-taken.
 
"Smaug"
"Dairyboy"Although I do agree with what you guys are saying about .25 is better (really .30 is king) but he was asking about springers in .177 and .22 both at 12fpe.
Well, zebra DID say that larger calibers seem more effective, even when energy is the same. It was only at the end that he suggested I don't really need to choose, except in field target. (Assuming PCP) I'm mostly a springer guy, these days. 

For Everything I shoot, .177 is fine. It's just that once I awhile, I'd like to take a body shot, and wonder if any of my few failures would have been successes if I were shooting a .20 or .22 springer. On one shot from the .177 Marauder, I was going for a heart shot, but hit the shoulder instead. He ran off with his one arm dragging. 18 FPE with a .22 may have penetrated more deeply and done him in. 

Or that shot a couple weeks ago, where I hit the jaw? That bigger caliber might've made that a (lower) brain shot, instead of a just a crippler. (Though that shot might've been even lower, if it were .22...)

Just thinking; I'm not sure I'm ready to buy a .22 just yet.
Im willing to bet shot placement has been your biggest problem. Im not trying to put anyone down because we have all had a bad shot happen. But if you are having enough bad shots that it makes you consider moving up to a .25 to hopefully make a bad hit lethal you are approaching the problem from the wrong direction. You need to evaluate the shot placement, shot timing, environmental influence, accuracu potential of equipment and the accuracy potential of the shooter. If you honestly evaluate all of that you can determine what needs to be improved with each factor that comes together for the shot. Thinking a .25 is needed for a squirrel or chipmunk as some posters always say in these threads is absurd. 
 
At a fixed energy level: One of the most accurate springers I own is my Model 36 in .177. I just love that little rifle. Sweet to shoot, accurate, and deadly on squirrels out to about 40 yards if I do my part. Mine shoots H&N FTT at 850 fps for about 14 fpe. If I put my second zero at 37 yards and set my kill zone to the size of a dime my point blanch range is 10 yards to 42 yards. So I don't have to estimate range so long as I know how far is too far. If I had the same gun in .22 shooting the same pellet in .22 at the same energy level, that pellet would be leaving the muzzle at about 655 fps or basically 200 fps slower. Set up with the same zero constraints in chairgun the point blanch range for that Model 36 in .22 runs from 9 yards to 33 yards with the far zero at 29 yards. If we consider the time of flight for the two pellets we see that the TOF for the .177 to 42 yards is 0.163 seconds and the TOF for the .22 to 33 yards is 0.163. The .22 has 1.41" wind drift at 42 yards and the .177 has 1.55" at 42 yards. This is why the conventional wisdom elects the .177 over the .22 for hunting when you are limited to a fixed energy level. Really it is pretty good reasoning.

If we are allowed to relax the "fixed energy level" constraint the world changes rather dramatically. Never-the-less there will always be a place for the light weight, middle power, spring air rifle. There are some niches which can not be filled by that magnum springer or PCP shooting bowling balls at 900 fps.