Which Springer?!?!

[Bear-of-Grayling]

Don’t know anything about the Ruger. This is a forum about the Hatsan. I really like my Hatsan’s. The 125 is available in both the Vortex and the spring. For what you want I would highly recommend the spring model. 
https://www.airgunnation.com/topic/hatsan-the-good-the-bad-and-the-ugly/

 

[thumper]

I'd skip both honestly. Especially if you are new to spring guns in general.

Buy something better made (German) on the used market, and it will be a much better shooting gun, and have resale value if you need to sell it later on. 

The Diana 34, 48, and 350 pop up from time to time for not a lot if any more money. And I'd feel better about owning any of those. 

If you aren't in a big hurry, put a WTB ad on the classifieds. Someone may have something to help you out. 

 

[Ezana4CE]

Anyone know anything about this Crosman Vantage Nitro-Piston budget rifle? Pretty powerful looking entry level rifle considering the specs for the price point. https://www.pyramydair.com/product/crosman-vantage-nitro-piston-air-rifle?m=3233

Think it’s worth throwing $120 at to get one’s feet wet?

 

[BryanH]

Hard decision, the Hatsan should make a smidge more power but the Ruger Air Magnum works with any tune kits or internal parts for an RWS 350 Magnum. I think I would go with the Ruger Air Mag for the aftermarket parts and support. Either one needs to be de burred and properly lubed, likely requires a new piston seal etc. Lots of upgrades available for Air Mag.

 

[glr59]

Budget and springer don't go together. Save and buy any HW springer or Diana springer(which will make more power). As power goes up it get unmanageable fast with springers. Limiting their hunting capability. I didn't say impossible but pretty limited. As an alternative maybe look at a crosman 362 with hop up components from Baker Airguns. They are advertising 15ftlbs which would be pretty healthy for a springer and a lot more manageable.

Jerry

 

[Deerstalker]

FYI, Chrono #s for my HW95L .22 after a year with an ARH kit, a Vortek seal and about 3K to 4K pellets. Rifle is very accurate for these 83 year old eyes.

Created: 04/05/22 12:08 PM

Description: HW95L Chrono test

Notes 1: 25 yard target

Notes 2: Cary NC, Clowdy

Distance to Chrono(FT): 4.00

Ballistic Coefficient: 0.019

Bullet Weight(gr): H&N FTT 14.66

Temp: 72 °F

BP: N/A inHg

Altitude: 495.00

Shot# FPS FT-LBS PF

10 723 17.02 10.60

9 720 16.88 10.56

8 714 16.60 10.47

7 721 16.92 10.57

6 722 16.97 10.58

5 720 16.88 10.56

4 724 17.07 10.61

3 721 16.92 10.57

2 712 16.50 10.44

1 713 16.55 10.45

Average: 719.0 FPS

SD: 4.3 FPS

Min: 712 FPS

Max: 724 FPS

Spread: 12 FPS

Shot/sec: 0.0

True MV: 731 FPS

 

[crowski]

Your far better off waiting for a good used German made springer, both economically and pleasureable, than a lower quality springer. A HW35, HW50, R9, HW85 or a HW95 would be my choice. I shoot all my German rifles as each is a pleasure to shoot. My Hanson 135, I shot it when I first got it. Can’t remember the last time I shot it, probably when I first got it. No comparison. Good luck. Crow 

You will find it cheaper in the longer run buying better quality.

 

[1BadDart]

As many have mentioned, save your money and buy a quality rifle. My first one was a Diana 48 in .22, it's a powerful gun and the learning curve to shoot it well was very steep. I wouldn't recommend a magnum springer for a first gun to anyone.

 

[Glenroiland]

As many have mentioned, save your money and buy a quality rifle. My first one was a Diana 48 in .22, it's a powerful gun and the learning curve to shoot it well was very steep. I wouldn't recommend a magnum springer for a first gun to anyone.

Tis. My d48 8 got on the bay with a scope for under 200 a few years ago. I gave it a light tune, and it is fantastic in .22 giving me near 20FPE now and quite accurate..

 

[maxtrouble]

I second the HW50S in .177 for putting something in the pot. German heirloom quality that will last for years. Lightweight, easy to cock and shoots most pellets very well. Well worth the extra money. Or spring for a HW95 and never look back. Buy once cry once.

 

[abslayer]

HW 97 k this is why you buy a good one 

 

[BryanH]

A lot of people have suggested that you should spend more and buy more quality. I agree with this to an extent but you can, for sure, get a lot out of a cheap gun. I hunted with a pro tuned XS28M (same gun as a ruger air magnum) almost exclusively for more than 2 years.

The only aftermarket pieces in the gun were a spring and a piston seal, less than $30 worth of parts.

He did great work though.

In addition to that, I killed a bunch of critters and shot tens of thousands of pellets through a $79 Stoeger X10 I de-burred, lubed, and re-sprung/re-sealed. I wish I could get that one back, it was a great gun.

Don’t be afraid of a cheap springer but do your homework, and if you think you may depend on it for meat, it doesn’t matter how much you spend. You need springs, seals, and a solid bar clamp or spring compressor and a few extra small tools. Also learn to trap Doesn’t matter what kind of gun you use, traps work better.

 

[BryanH]

I would also look at the Crosman 360. That’s a gun that was built with the existing aftermarket parts and support in mind. Be a great little gun to leave at your cabin, barn, garage, etc. can be had for about $100, or order from Baker Airguns with many of the upgrades installed for about $200.

If you are really interested in spending more and have the extra cash I would skip Diana and step on up to a HW95/Beeman R9.

I have owned, repaired, de-burred/lube tuned, and kitted a couple dozen breakbarrels. I only own one pellet gun today- a Beeman R9. It is the only one I have not had the urge to tear down/“make better”.

 

[BryanH]

Also just fyi- I have owned and used both the Hatsan and the Ruger Air Magnum as well as the XS28M. I have also taken all three apart and done work on them.

The Ruger Air Magnum is the more solid gun. Might be Chinese, vs Turkish, it is what it is. In this case the Chicom gun is built better and sold for less in most cases.

 

[SteveP-52]

Great follow up questions!

The chosen Springer will be for hunting, not backyard plinking. Looking for the best budget survivor SPRINGER air rifle & I've narrowed my research to these two (but open to other suggestions). 

My thought process is when all the traditional powder ammo is gone and you can't find compressed air or buy piston cylinders, the Springer's will survive and put food on the table...

Thanks again!

Watch how fast I get slapped for this one, but for what you laid out right here for Budget, Survival, Springer?? Crosman Optimus .22 springer. Why? A few reasons actually:
-Springer first. Not gas rammed/nitro piston which when they fail, you have a club or a door stop. A springer even with a broken spring will still shoot.
-Wood stock so while you might break it, less chance than you will with anything synthetic.
-You want spare parts, it's a Crosman, so springs, piston and breech seals can be easily and cheaply gotten to have 3-4 spares on hand.
-There are a couple things you can easily and cheaply do to make it better plus you get experience working on it. 
-They are easy to work on. I owned one in .177, first rifle I ever took apart and rebuilt. Easily took small game
-Crosman's own pellets will likely shoot well in it so cheap and easy to stockpile multiple tins of them.
-Rifle itself is budget, scope too, they usually are so leaves you money for better and several out there for $100 or less and save the included one for a backup.

I won't argue better quality rifles and own more than a few German's myself. Budget, inexpensive rifles take more to get used to shooting them and be accurate but it can be done and I own more than a few of those too. Let the slapping begin...lol.

 

[BryanH]

Great follow up questions!

The chosen Springer will be for hunting, not backyard plinking. Looking for the best budget survivor SPRINGER air rifle & I've narrowed my research to these two (but open to other suggestions). 

My thought process is when all the traditional powder ammo is gone and you can't find compressed air or buy piston cylinders, the Springer's will survive and put food on the table...

Thanks again!

Watch how fast I get slapped for this one, but for what you laid out right here for Budget, Survival, Springer?? Crosman Optimus .22 springer. Why? A few reasons actually:
-Springer first. Not gas rammed/nitro piston which when they fail, you have a club or a door stop. A springer even with a broken spring will still shoot.
-Wood stock so while you might break it, less chance than you will with anything synthetic.
-You want spare parts, it's a Crosman, so springs, piston and breech seals can be easily and cheaply gotten to have 3-4 spares on hand.
-There are a couple things you can easily and cheaply do to make it better plus you get experience working on it. 
-They are easy to work on. I owned one in .177, first rifle I ever took apart and rebuilt. Easily took small game
-Crosman's own pellets will likely shoot well in it so cheap and easy to stockpile multiple tins of them.
-Rifle itself is budget, scope too, they usually are so leaves you money for better and several out there for $100 or less and save the included one for a backup.

I won't argue better quality rifles and own more than a few German's myself. Budget, inexpensive rifles take more to get used to shooting them and be accurate but it can be done and I own more than a few of those too. Let the slapping begin...lol.

Same gun as the Stoeger x10, Can’t be beat in the price range. Parts and support from Crosman themselves. Just get you a baggy of longer trigger screws from Fastenal because it won’t be your last B19 project I promise 

 

[OldSpook]

A lot of people have suggested that you should spend more and buy more quality. I agree with this to an extent but you can, for sure, get a lot out of a cheap gun. I hunted with a pro tuned XS28M (same gun as a ruger air magnum) almost exclusively for more than 2 years.

The only aftermarket pieces in the gun were a spring and a piston seal, less than $30 worth of parts.

He did great work though.

In addition to that, I killed a bunch of critters and shot tens of thousands of pellets through a $79 Stoeger X10 I de-burred, lubed, and re-sprung/re-sealed. I wish I could get that one back, it was a great gun.

Don’t be afraid of a cheap springer but do your homework, and if you think you may depend on it for meat, it doesn’t matter how much you spend. You need springs, seals, and a solid bar clamp or spring compressor and a few extra small tools. Also learn to trap Doesn’t matter what kind of gun you use, traps work better.

Ayup... for sure. That trap works 24x7 to bring home meat.

 

[Moe M.]

Anyone know anything about this Crosman Vantage Nitro-Piston budget rifle? Pretty powerful looking entry level rifle considering the specs for the price point. https://www.pyramydair.com/product/crosman-vantage-nitro-piston-air-rifle?m=3233

Think it’s worth throwing $120 at to get one’s feet wet?

Yes, I bought a Crosman Vantage in .177cal. (only because I couldn't find one in .22 cal. at the time, I happened to see a video review of the .177 cal. Vantage that Kenny at 'My air gun reviews' channel, he said it had a horrible trigger, but it proved to be (his words) "A Gem in the rough", Kenney got the trigger pull down to 2-1/2 pounds and proceeded to shoot some impressive scores with it, he was so impressed with it's performance and consistency that he decided that it was a keeper.

Kenny was right, it has a horrible trigger, but there are several easy mods that can be easily done to it to remedy that problem, I did mine in 30 minutes start to finish and it shoots at about 2-1/4 pounds, it shoots a 10.5 GR. lead pellet at 900 fps. for 18.89 FPE, and I have no problem putting all my shots in a one inch circle at 35 yds. from a rest, I did have to swap out the junk center point scope that it came with with a UTG variable AO scope.

In my opinion the Crosman Vantage is exactly what Kenny said it is, A Gem in the rough, it's not my Beeman R-7 but it's a very capable plinking/small game hunting gun if kept within ethical ranges (under 35 yards), and that it is quite affordable it makes a great back up foraging air gun in case your more expensive air rifle breaks down or if you have to hunt in bad weather, you could do worse for a starter gun.

 

[BryanH]

You could do a lot worse for a starter gun. Crosman Vantage, Crosman Optimus, Remington Summit, Benjamin Trail (not the XL or the NP2 though), Stoeger X10/X20, and a whole bunch of other guns are literally the exact same rifles that come from the same places. They are Chi-Com counterfeit of the original Gamo Hunter which was actually a pretty good little rifle. Some have a gas ram and some have a steel spring and that’s about the only difference. Trigger is an easy fix and there is plenty of parts and support, pretty sure you can drop a Crosman Optimus spring, guide, and seal in each of them as well as the Gamo Varmint/Big Cat guns. The same ARH piston seal will fit all of the above guns and I have personally installed them in all of the above rifles.

Another good cheap gun is a Ruger Blackhawk, and any Diana 34 tune kit will drop right in.


It’s a whole lot better to buy one gun you can afford now than it is to do without completely. But just don’t go through a whole bunch of cheap ones before you invest in something high quality.

Get that Crosman Optimus or whatever and wear that MF-er out while you save for a good upgrade. Great knockaround rifle.

 

[Bear-of-Grayling]

You could do a lot worse for a starter gun. Crosman Vantage, Crosman Optimus, Remington Summit, Benjamin Trail (not the XL or the NP2 though), Stoeger X10/X20, and a whole bunch of other guns are literally the exact same rifles that come from the same places. They are Chi-Com counterfeit of the original Gamo Hunter which was actually a pretty good little rifle. Some have a gas ram and some have a steel spring and that’s about the only difference. Trigger is an easy fix and there is plenty of parts and support, pretty sure you can drop a Crosman Optimus spring, guide, and seal in each of them as well as the Gamo Varmint/Big Cat guns. The same ARH piston seal will fit all of the above guns and I have personally installed them in all of the above rifles.

Another good cheap gun is a Ruger Blackhawk, and any Diana 34 tune kit will drop right in.


It’s a whole lot better to buy one gun you can afford now than it is to do without completely. But just don’t go through a whole bunch of cheap ones before you invest in something high quality.

Get that Crosman Optimus or whatever and wear that MF-er out while you save for a good upgrade. Great knockaround rifle.

Another good cheap gun is a Ruger Blackhawk, and any Diana 34 tune kit will drop right in.


“It’s a whole lot better to buy one gun you can afford now than it is to do without completely. But just don’t go through a whole bunch of cheap ones before you invest in something high quality.”

That is very good advise. A whole lot of nothing is still nothing.