When is a wait just too long ??

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racer1

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May 19, 2017
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Idaho
Folks I ask the question because it is a passionate topic on every forum I follow.
It seems to run 1-2 days for the often cited Amazon prime,to several days or even weeks when dealing with small to larger companies.
Just what is the threshold? What about contact to or from the parties involved?
Do we have unrealistic expectations as a community?
Are we way too patient?
Not to put too fine a point on things,a small company or one man show is probably putting loads of hours in just to keep the doors open.
I currently put in 10-14 hours a day,depending on how much interaction I have with customers,vendors,bankers etc.
Please understand it is done by my choice.
There is a simple saying that goes like this "A dollar goes where it is treated best". I live by that.
However there are certain well known sellers and tuners that JUST DON"T GET IT !!!!
They should read and understand their customers.
11 months of waiting and I'm truly fed up.
 
In my personal opinion, it is too long when it goes beyond the promised delivery date. I think it is incumbent upon the customer to ask what the expectation is and be grown up enough to know that sometimes quick service isn't possible or practical. It is incumbent upon the businessman to be realistic about his abilities and challenges, and give honest information to the customer. With an 11 month waiting period, I don't think losing business is a problem. But once the two parties agree on time to delivery, that should be the expectation. Underpromise and overdeliver.

Next!
 
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I ask the retailer I'm considering, how long shipping and handling will take. If I like their answer, I'll do business with them and expect the item(s) to arrive within no more than 2-3 days later, unless the dealer gives me an updated delay note. 

I'm an avid archer, have been for about 52 years. Since 2010 I've been buying custom hunting recurves, mostly very lightly used ones from folks (like me) who want to move them. Occasionally, I've ordered one from the bowyer personally. I've waited an advertised 8-16 months, depending upon the bowyer's backlog. I've never had to wait longer than a week beyond what I was told. These custom bows cost about what Wildcats to Steyr's cost. 

The most impressively short and dependable shipping times for any air rifle I've bought has been Krale in the Netherlands. They obviously understand the torture of long waits don't mess around getting product out! I've found Midway and Pyramid Air to be quick too. That Donny fellow in Florida is super fast at shipping as well!

 
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Let's toss another element in shall we? In a custom providers realm it is not uncommon to pay 50-100% upfront.
A timeline will be stated or negotiated for delivery to the customer and agreed upon.
What happens when the delivery changes along with the story repeatedly?
Numerous emails and telephone calls are ignored and whoops the window is closed to get a refund from the credit card provider OR heaven forbid a postal money order was sent?
I applaud the forums and members for giving credit for smooth transactions.It is helpful to all.
But what the negative dealings?
I hope this topic gets lots of feedback.
 
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Several years ago I ordered a stock for one of my powder burners, an ambidextrous thumb hole for a rh action, I shoot lh. The vendor was the only one who provided a truly ambidextrous stock. I had to pay full up front and was promised 13 weeks, it turned into 5 1/2 months. I called several times and was given every excuse in the book, everything from they moved into a new shop (wasn't told up front) to ALL the employees had the flu at the same time.........TWICE!

I really like the stock but will never use that stock company again.
 
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"racer1"Let's toss another element in shall we? In a custom providers realm it is not uncommon to pay 50-100% upfront.
A timeline will be stated or negotiated for delivery to the customer and agreed upon.
What happens when the delivery changes along with the story repeatedly?
Numerous emails and telephone calls are ignored and whoops the window is closed to get a refund from the credit card provider OR heaven forbid a postal money order was sent?
I applaud the forums and members for giving credit for smooth transactions.It is helpful to all.
But what the negative dealings?
I hope this topic gets lots of feedback.
Click to expand...
Honestly I would not pay more then 10% upfront. This tells the builder you are serious (won't likely cancel) and if something happens on their end you "only" need to recover 10%, not 50 or 100.

What inventive does the builder have to complete your project by deadline if he has been paid 100%. 

Maybe we (custom buyers) should be negotiating contracts with the builders for completion dates. In the construction industry plenty of "smart" buyers do it. You agree on a date and a price. If the project is not completed by that date then $$ starts coming off each day/week it is beyond. $500,000 job might be cut $1000 for each day/week it goes beyond.
 
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I use contractors for building things from time to time. I Never give them any money up front. If they need materials, I buy the materials. At the end of the job, I hold back 20% for ~ two weeks. This gives time to inspect the work thoroughly and let's them know they better do it right.. Some get upset but in the end we ususaly become really good friends and I pass their names on to others for work.
The absolute worse thing any custom builder can do is not return a call, and provide updates. If they can't or won't do the job, pack up everything and ship it back with a full refund. THEY work for you!! 
ANY contractor is only as good as his last job..
I hope you get your situation straightened out..( if I read between the lines correctly..) 
 
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This is one of my personal hot spots. I call it standing in line WAITING to pay your money. This has evolved across our whole society. From everyday little things like standing in a line 10 deep at the cashier of a grocery or retail store, while non-working employees watch from the sidelines, to buying a boat, car or motorhome. Airgun industry is no exception. Problem is that we tolerate it. I personally believe that this is one of the reasons Amazon Prime is so successful. You know when your order will come, if they are late they notify you and 99% of the time it works. Also in my rant, I want to say there are those out there known for good service and I'd like to give them credit. Sylvan
 
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>>><Honestly I would not pay more then 10% upfront. This tells the builder you are serious (won’t likely cancel) and if something happens on their end you “only” need to recover 10%, not 50 or 100.<<<<


Interesting perspective. I had a customer that had a "Hot Job" recently involving titanium. I had dealt with this company for several years without problems. Their ultimate end user cancelled on them and they cancelled on me.
Several thousand $$$$ in material cost and machine time, I'm stuck with a lot of half completed expensive scrap.
Based on folks speaking out about this thread,I hope more will jump in. Perhaps we will draw more understanding to the problem from both sides? In our own world of air gunning do we need to self police by naming names perhaps saving a fellow gunner some problems? Or, keep discussing the good to awful customer service we live with in our daily lives? Keep those thoughts coming......
 
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"racer1">>><Honestly I would not pay more then 10% upfront. This tells the builder you are serious (won’t likely cancel) and if something happens on their end you “only” need to recover 10%, not 50 or 100.<<<<
Interesting perspective. I had a customer that had a "Hot Job" recently involving titanium. I had dealt with this company for several years without problems. Their ultimate end user cancelled on them and they cancelled on me.
Several thousand $$$$ in material cost and machine time, I'm stuck with a lot of half completed expensive scrap.
Based on folks speaking out about this thread,I hope more will jump in. Perhaps we will draw more understanding to the problem from both sides? In our own world of air gunning do we need to self police by naming names perhaps saving a fellow gunner some problems? Or, keep discussing the good to awful customer service we live with in our daily lives? Keep those thoughts coming......
Click to expand...
Most definitely we do.........unless you are on a forum where this involves a "sanctioned vendor", 'cause then when you do you get chastised and ultimately leave, winding up in a better place.
 
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"racer1">>><Honestly I would not pay more then 10% upfront. This tells the builder you are serious (won’t likely cancel) and if something happens on their end you “only” need to recover 10%, not 50 or 100.<<<<
Interesting perspective. I had a customer that had a "Hot Job" recently involving titanium. I had dealt with this company for several years without problems. Their ultimate end user cancelled on them and they cancelled on me.
Several thousand $$$$ in material cost and machine time, I'm stuck with a lot of half completed expensive scrap.
Based on folks speaking out about this thread,I hope more will jump in. Perhaps we will draw more understanding to the problem from both sides? In our own world of air gunning do we need to self police by naming names perhaps saving a fellow gunner some problems? Or, keep discussing the good to awful customer service we live with in our daily lives? Keep those thoughts coming......
Click to expand...
This is a great perspective from a Craftsman's side. Have we just moved past the era if verbal or handshake agreements? In pretty much every other area in life, separating hundreds or thousands from our hands requires a written contract, often with line by line description of the total estimate, and the terms. Maybe it's time for the airgun industry to grow up, to protect both sides.
 
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>>>>Maybe it's time for the airgun industry to grow up, to protect both sides.<<<<
I couldn't agree more. The sad reality is that sales departments are driven by self serving profit motives. Some might even call it greed in certain cases. If sales is pushing the envelope but production isn't keeping up or contractors are not delivering on time,then where does the blame lie? As customers we are conditioned to "buy the buzz". I would point to a certain $299.00 airgun that has a limited release with much extended release date(s).
If we go to a restaurant and it doesn't meet our expectations,we can move on to the next one. The days of accepting something at face value or on a handshake seem to be in the rear view mirror. It's a target rich environment......
 
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