UTG drama 🙄

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fishinwrench

fishinwrench

Member
Nov 25, 2017
589
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mo
UTG has been great about replacing several scopes for me that haven't held up as advertised, and the latest one generated this message: 

"Mr.****, just want to let you know that your replacement scope is being sent out to you today. But please note that, the reason that the scope is rattling internally is due to user error on tightening down the scope ring too tight and had deformed the external tube. Therefore originally this would not have been covered under warranty. We appreciate your support and make this one time exception on replacing the scope and it will be shipped out today.

Sincerely, ****



My reply: 

"Thank you ****. In my defense, the rings used were the ones supplied with the scope, and they had to be tight enough that the scope tube wouldn't walk back from recoil.

Maybe a more robust outer tube should be considered on a scope designed and advertised to be "TOUGH ENOUGH FOR SPRINGER AIRGUNS" ? 😉

Respectfully, ****



I'm not denying a slight dimple in the outer tube, but hey.... Ya gotta have the MFer good and tight!!! That was NOT what caused the reticles to fall out ! How could slightly pinching the wimpy outer tube cause the reticles, which are part of the INNER TUBE to fall out ?

Bullpoop I say ! 😊
 
Bummer that happened with your scope, but..
Don't just rule out the company, because the same thing could happen with any of them.. 

One person's "tight" and another person's "tight" will always be different.. 
And with scopes, it is Very Important that obviously they don't move, but, that they are Torqued Correctly. 
If the tube had any type of malformation - unfortunately, that'd be a result of over torquing.. No doubt about it.

I worked professionally in the customization and installation field for over 20 years, 
and no matter what, Recommended Specs were always applied..
This is a Big one - As specs will differ with different brands/models/etc. and it makes a big difference w/ warranties! 

The scope manufacturers know what materials are used, the material tolerances, etc.. 
They know what pressures are acceptable / best / and too much. 
So that said, torque will either be not enough - the scope will move / Correct - good to go / too much - cause issues

Here's a link I found that brought up this issue over on GTA:

https://www.gatewaytoairguns.org/GTA/index.php?topic=82223.0 

Rings should come with torque specs - and if they don't, that's a 'must' to find out. 
Otherwise, it's all guess work, and that doesn't always work out.

Torque drivers, sticks, wrenches are very handy for things like this..

I don't use them personally, but, years and years of experience helped me 'just know where I'm at by hand'.

My friend Chad on the other hand? He's the type that when tightening something, 
he'll just go until things wither strip out, or snap. hahaha 

Hope that helps a bit..

🙂👍 

Sam -
 
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No real experience with springers owned one for about 3 hours. The bug busters are a favorite of mine for their size and weight on a couple of different guns. A friend after 20 years killed a Nikon Slugger with at least a thousand 3" slugs through the gun. I gave him a Leapers 3-9 that I got on a used gun. He sighted in took several deer and gave me back the scope after the six weeks it took Nikon to fix the scope. The scope was still working. You might want to try some tape to line the rings, I think I've read as high as 20 inch/pounds for a maximum torque.
 
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They have 'moving mounts' that allow the scope to 'float' when the rifles recoil.. 
They're most definitely recommended for springs - especially magnum versions:

1554245151_17374242885ca3e61febecf2.67802585_bullseye-zr-1-pc-mount-1-quot-rings-11mm-dovetail...gif
 

https://www.airgundepot.com/bullseye-zr-1-pc-mount-1-rings-11mm-dovetail-004.html 

🙂 

Sam -
 
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So y'all think that over-tightening the rings could cause the whole reticle to fall out ? I ain't buying that line of baloney.

I mean, I knew I was bearing down on the mounts....but dammit the sticky crap on the rings wasn't enough to keep the scope from slipping back after 20-30 shots. And if Bullseye mounts were required then why not include them instead of standard 6 screw mounts ?

Just seems to me that if you are building a scope specifically for springers, and advertising it as such, then you'd beef up the outer tube, knowing full well that it was going to need to be cranked down pretty snug. I chose the UTG knowing full well that the glass was only "so-so" and the reticles were thicker than my dogs toenails.....because it was supposed to be a TOUGH SCOPE. And I wanted TOUGHNESS over everything else.


 
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So y'all think that over-tightening the rings could cause the whole reticle to fall out ? I ain't buying that line of baloney.

I mean, I knew I was bearing down on the mounts....but dammit the sticky crap on the rings wasn't enough to keep the scope from slipping back after 20-30 shots. And if Bullseye mounts were required then why not include them instead of standard 6 screw mounts ?

Just seems to me that if you are building a scope specifically for springers, and advertising it as such, then you'd beef up the outer tube, knowing full well that it was going to need to be cranked down pretty snug. I chose the UTG knowing full well that the glass was only "so-so" and the reticles were thicker than my dogs toenails.....because it was supposed to be a TOUGH SCOPE. And I wanted TOUGHNESS over everything else.

Click to expand...

I have several UTG scopes on springers. They have worked fine. I use a torque wrench.
 
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fishinwrench,

What type of springer are you using? Just curious..

Normal power or 'Magnum'?

With most springers in the usual ft/lb range, scopes built for springers usually hold up relatively well, 
but I've heard that Magnum [over powered] springers will nuke just about anything you throw on em.. Just a matter of time.. 

It all just has to do with the excessive force when recoil - or more exact - the double movement at high speed/force..

If they only test for mellower ft/lb guns, maybe that 'could' be part of the issue..

I've only used UTG scopes on .22LRs, so I can't personally vouch for how well they should work on 'different springers'..

*Yells* JOE!!! Where are you?! 🤣
 
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I have an UTG in my Diana springer, and I torqued it to only 15lbs. That rifle kicks hard! Originally it comes with the ZR mount but I didn’t like the scope and I change to the UTG, the ZR mount is there, collecting dust, I’m not using it because is a 1” ring and all my scopes are 30mm.

Over torquing can damage the internals. 

If what you were looking was something beefy why not going with a Discovery? Those are famous because have been used as hammers lol, that was a joke, in case It wasn’t clear.

The UTG should do good, do not over torque, and see if it holds, if it get loose, torque a bit more, but they will hold solid. In my Diana Stealth review, I show the UTG scope and you van see me shooting and see that the rifle is a horse! 
 
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fishinwrench,

What type of springer are you using? Just curious..

Normal power or 'Magnum'?

Click to expand...

In this instance it was a slightly modified Gamo Swarm. It has eaten 3 UTG scopes thus far, and I also have a Benji Prowler that has eaten 2.

JFTR, the 2 that the Swarm ate before this one, AND THE 2 THAT THE PROWLER ATE.... were NOT dimpled from 'over-tightening". THIS ONE kept creeping back so I had to put a little extra squeeze on it to keep it holding zero. 

They are just pissed because I only paid for 2 and they have had to send me 3 replacements. As long as the warranty is good and they are honoring it (which they have done every time so far) then I suppose I should be happy.....which I am, but I took a bit of offense to being blamed for this one. 

😋 

Every one of them has had the reticles fall out. I figure I'lI just keep sending them back until I get 2 that will stay together.....or they tell me to kiss their ass, then I'll switch brands. 😊

I have Hawke Vantage's on my pumpers and PCP's.....but Hawke tells you clearly NOT to put them on spring/gas piston guns.....So I don't. UTG claims theirs are "MAGNUM SPRINGER TOUGH"....so I am just wading through them until I get 2 that truly are.
 
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I have an UTG in my Diana springer, and I torqued it to only 15lbs. That rifle kicks hard! Originally it comes with the ZR mount but I didn’t like the scope and I change to the UTG, the ZR mount is there, collecting dust, I’m not using it because is a 1” ring and all my scopes are 30mm.

Over torquing can damage the internals. 

If what you were looking was something beefy why not going with a Discovery? Those are famous because have been used as hammers lol, that was a joke, in case It wasn’t clear.

The UTG should do good, do not over torque, and see if it holds, if it get loose, torque a bit more, but they will hold solid. In my Diana Stealth review, I show the UTG scope and you van see me shooting and see that the rifle is a horse!
Click to expand...

That. (Highlighted in bold). Discovery scopes (Gen 1 for sure) are built like tanks, or a sore peter... They're hard to beat.

That said, I usually apply a bit of blue Loctite on the screws of my scope rings and crank on the bolts a bit more than recommended specs. I have also have never crushed a tube, including the cheapos (and thanks to Joe Rhea's video reviews, I don't own cheap scopes anymore lol). Never a single failure due to torque. I've also never had a scope walk on me either (knock on wood).

If one were to crush a tube, I can see a reticle maybe popping out depending where it is located in the scope. Many moons ago I had a cheaper Tasco where the reticle was located around where the rear ring was mounted. The only reason I know that is because I was an idiot kid at the time and literally disassembled my scope without understanding the relevance of Nitrogen.

It's nice that UTG is sending you a new scope. I've seen mixed reviews on here from great to crap... I don't own one but I stay away from them because lately I tend to gravitate towards scopes that don't get any crap reviews like UTG/Centerpoint/BSA/etc. Everyone's mileage varies, but lately I try to hedge my bets on things that have a solid (pun intended) reputation.
 
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Ok, just for a second imagine a small tube with crosshairs inside of a bigger tube. Now squeeze the larger tube a bit, just enough to very mildly deform it. 

How did that effect the crosshairs inside the smaller tube?

Now imagine that you have 5 scopes in front of you with the reticles rattling around inside them, and ONE of those scopes has a slight dimple in the outer tube. Are you now going to claim that the reason reticles are not staying in place is because of over-tightening?
 
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My scopes kept twisting in their rings. XS-25 and XS-46 springers. I torqued the bejesus out of them.Finally ended up deforming the tubes and they still twisted. Also broke a couple reticles "made in china scopes" simply from the the recoil Finally went with Hawks Air Max scopes and double strap BKL rings.so far so good. Also have a Rex scope that is holding up so far.that's a surprise.
 
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