I'm now convinced all my hawke scopes are temp sensitive to heat .Is there a foolproof way to wrap them in an insulate that won't obstruct the use of the scope ? FT target shooters use this practice ?2 of my Hawkes sit on springers with wood stocks .
- The AGN App is ready! Search "Airgun Nation" in your App store. To compliment this new tech we've assigned the "Threads" Feed & "Dark" Mode. To revert back click HERE.
Tuning Temp sensitive hawke scopes...
- Thread starter Ace1969
- Start date
I had I think the same issue with my Falcon 50X in 102 degrees heat in Oregon's recent Grand Prix. Some Targets were in crystal clear focus when my parallax wheel was at 60-70 yards (Max target distance should have been below 55 yards).
The second day, I started to put ice packs into my gun case. I don't think it helped. Mainly because the scope was sticking out above the soft gun case.
Thinking back, there are a number of things I could have done to mitigate heat effects on my scope and rifle.
1. I should have put lens caps back on my scope. I'm sure the huge scope bell is very efficient in gathering heat waves and turning the internals of the scope into an oven.
2. Wrap aluminum foil around the scope. Or a more semi-permanent solution. Silver spray paint?
3. keep both gun and scope in the shade. This probably has limited value because at 102 ...in the shades...your equipment is still getting cooked at 90?.
4. Cover your gun/scope with those car sun shades. Tape the sides into a taco shape and cover.
5. I shoot a wooden Maccari FT stock. Don't know if a polyurethane spray would help to "heat/moisture" stabilize the wood
6. There are a number of thermal sensitive items in my TX200. I'm in the process of replacing those. I'm still running a Delrin Spring guide. Looking to go with a metal spring guide in the future and bronze piston bushing instead of Delrin.
7. (tongue in cheek). Buy a March FT scope. I hear those are less temperature sensitive. (spend-y though...$3000+)
Last edited:
Upvote 0
I kinda got yo think if nitrogen purged the seal leaked it out snd no longer..
The nitrogen or a inert gas hot cold tolerances are pretty high and low / far more stable then plain ol air ..
Now argon filled is catching on claiming better then nitrogen. Anyway if wrong its just my thoughts on this
The nitrogen or a inert gas hot cold tolerances are pretty high and low / far more stable then plain ol air ..
Now argon filled is catching on claiming better then nitrogen. Anyway if wrong its just my thoughts on this
Upvote 0
John
Yes I think I'm running the Tony Leach 22mm set up in my TX200. I mic it before and should have recorded it.
I got someone to machine a bronze bushing and replaced one of the Delrin bushings about 4 months ago?
Sorry to hijack this thread.
So at the Oregon Grand Prix, I was running a hybrid (one Delrin bushing and one bronze bushing) mainly to see if I was going to get the best of both worlds. Unfortunately, I didn't count on Cameron kicking my butt by 22 points. Probably shooter related vs equipment related.
But on the objective side, the gun on Thursday and Friday (prior to the match and in Oregon) chrono- at 11.5FPE (same as at home...would have expected a lower FPE as I was 2-3,000 feet up?)
Then we were required to chrono- our guns during the match. Saturday 102 degrees. We started at lane 15 the kneeling lane ...chrono-station was lane 9? (12 lanes later, 14 minutes/lane, total time in heat approximately 2.5 hrs later). I was down to 10.3 FPE. I'm still trying to correlate which lanes I had a potential scope shift (ranging error), what lanes were FPE related and what lanes were shooter related (probably 90% of the misses).
So yes, it looks like there was a drop in my TX200 power in the heat.
I haven't chrono- the gun at home yet after the match. But a preliminary check of POI indicated that the clicks were back to their base line. I'll update this post after the chrono at home to see if I'm back up to 11.5 FPE. This may give more weight/evidence that I'm still experiencing some thermal sensitivity with this set up...next change...1. reduce Delrin size 2. run both bronze bushings ...3. leave it alone.
Yes I think I'm running the Tony Leach 22mm set up in my TX200. I mic it before and should have recorded it.
I got someone to machine a bronze bushing and replaced one of the Delrin bushings about 4 months ago?
Sorry to hijack this thread.
So at the Oregon Grand Prix, I was running a hybrid (one Delrin bushing and one bronze bushing) mainly to see if I was going to get the best of both worlds. Unfortunately, I didn't count on Cameron kicking my butt by 22 points. Probably shooter related vs equipment related.
But on the objective side, the gun on Thursday and Friday (prior to the match and in Oregon) chrono- at 11.5FPE (same as at home...would have expected a lower FPE as I was 2-3,000 feet up?)
Then we were required to chrono- our guns during the match. Saturday 102 degrees. We started at lane 15 the kneeling lane ...chrono-station was lane 9? (12 lanes later, 14 minutes/lane, total time in heat approximately 2.5 hrs later). I was down to 10.3 FPE. I'm still trying to correlate which lanes I had a potential scope shift (ranging error), what lanes were FPE related and what lanes were shooter related (probably 90% of the misses).
So yes, it looks like there was a drop in my TX200 power in the heat.
I haven't chrono- the gun at home yet after the match. But a preliminary check of POI indicated that the clicks were back to their base line. I'll update this post after the chrono at home to see if I'm back up to 11.5 FPE. This may give more weight/evidence that I'm still experiencing some thermal sensitivity with this set up...next change...1. reduce Delrin size 2. run both bronze bushings ...3. leave it alone.
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Maybe. But. When I take one of my rifles out to shot I let it set an acclimate to the temp ( mainly humidity) at least 1/2 hour befor I start shooting. Don’t have any issues. Just my 2 cents
Upvote 0
Mr. Frogy
I wished it was that simple.
But shooting a Field Target match. There's not much we can do to control the environment.
During match day...sight-in 7-9 am...temp starts at 65 degrees and goes to ...80 degrees. The gun has already been out for 2 hours and shot to verify dope.
Match starts around 9:30-9:45 am...temp is now around 85? Twelve lanes into the match (two hours later, conditions have changed...things are heating up) you are now at a high of 102 degrees or more. You hide your gun and scope in the shade between lanes...you are lucky if it's 90 degrees in the shades. your equipment is still getting baked (both rifle and scope).
That's why it's called FIELD Target. Subject your equipment to those extreme conditions... most sub 12 FPE springers will show some power fluctuations. Some can minimize POI shifts by highly tuning their rifles.
Scope wise, I'm hearing most scopes have some shifts in extreme conditions. March scope I hear don't shift as much. The better shooters can adjust under these conditions...me, I suck at adjusting.
--
Edit
Yeah, I met David A. He was the one with the Silver March scope. David said he's had the March for 12 years and has not noticed any temp shift. Even in the ovens of Italy WFTF 2022. David said no temp shifts.
I wished it was that simple.
But shooting a Field Target match. There's not much we can do to control the environment.
During match day...sight-in 7-9 am...temp starts at 65 degrees and goes to ...80 degrees. The gun has already been out for 2 hours and shot to verify dope.
Match starts around 9:30-9:45 am...temp is now around 85? Twelve lanes into the match (two hours later, conditions have changed...things are heating up) you are now at a high of 102 degrees or more. You hide your gun and scope in the shade between lanes...you are lucky if it's 90 degrees in the shades. your equipment is still getting baked (both rifle and scope).
That's why it's called FIELD Target. Subject your equipment to those extreme conditions... most sub 12 FPE springers will show some power fluctuations. Some can minimize POI shifts by highly tuning their rifles.
Scope wise, I'm hearing most scopes have some shifts in extreme conditions. March scope I hear don't shift as much. The better shooters can adjust under these conditions...me, I suck at adjusting.
--
Edit
Yeah, I met David A. He was the one with the Silver March scope. David said he's had the March for 12 years and has not noticed any temp shift. Even in the ovens of Italy WFTF 2022. David said no temp shifts.
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Got to kimda figure heat expands cold contracts things. Somthings got to give weather its the metal , plastic, wood, ect. Then wood shrinking or swellilg from dry to humidity conditions. Then i dont know how little or extreme your poi shifting is. A miniscule at 10m can add up a lot at 100y.
I also notice new stuff is worse then older . im going to guess that old stuff seasoned or settled in to place . (???)
I also notice new stuff is worse then older . im going to guess that old stuff seasoned or settled in to place . (???)
Upvote 0
Many scopes do this as well as rifle shifts. I've seen a fair number of folks at the GOB cover there scope when in direct sunlight though most of the courses at Roz's were shaded. You can buy a fancy cloth cover (usually white) but I've not seen those used mostly just a mylar blanket when rifle is at rest.
More common than that I've seen many people with color changing temp. strips (like on a fish tank) attached to the rifle then learn what it does at what temp. and adjust accordingly. Harold used to add 3 click's elevation to his at exactly 84 degrees to his Leupold 35xand if the temp. dropped he clicked back down (that didnt happen often in TN tho).
Know of one shooter with a high power March (silver) scope who said he never had any temp issues and his shooting seemed to reflect this, but... .
Seems best just to cover when in Direct sunlight And learn the shift.
Fairly sure if there was some "fool proof" way to totally avoid such someone -everyone- would have been using it but also shift happens.
Try a temp strip and lot's of testing & keep us posted.
John
More common than that I've seen many people with color changing temp. strips (like on a fish tank) attached to the rifle then learn what it does at what temp. and adjust accordingly. Harold used to add 3 click's elevation to his at exactly 84 degrees to his Leupold 35xand if the temp. dropped he clicked back down (that didnt happen often in TN tho).
Know of one shooter with a high power March (silver) scope who said he never had any temp issues and his shooting seemed to reflect this, but... .
Seems best just to cover when in Direct sunlight And learn the shift.
Fairly sure if there was some "fool proof" way to totally avoid such someone -everyone- would have been using it but also shift happens.
Try a temp strip and lot's of testing & keep us posted.
John
Upvote 0
I’ve experienced the same with my Hawke sw and my sightron FT. I believe it’s all about keeping your scope out of the sun ☀
Upvote 0
I have experienced heat sensitivity with my SW 10-50.
Did not know what was going on for a long time.
Did not know what was going on for a long time.
Upvote 0
I do the same thing but only about 15 minutes while i set up everything else .
Seems to me that moving the scope in and out of a sun shield would make it worse IE: scope would be heating up as your shooting ?
Upvote 0