• The AGN App is ready! Search "Airgun Nation" in your App store. To compliment this new tech we've assigned the "Threads" Feed & "Dark" Mode. To revert back click HERE.

Tuning Stainless steel barrel sleeve

Jump to latest Follow Reply
I got a reply back from Ronny Vanhove on the SS sleeves. 

From: Ronny Vanhove <[email protected]> 

"Thank you for your interest in our products.

Sorry for the delay in replying to the email. Due to the numerous requests, the waiting time is slightly longer

We are located in Belgium. The prices of our stainless steel sleeves are 95 € / per partand the 100mm extension 45 € / per part 

Prices do not include shipping costs.

Regards"

I did the conversion and its 95 euro is $113.20 and 45 euro is $53.62

Now we know..
 
Upvote 0
Interesting idea but I’m not sure what it buys or what is the benefit. Stainless steel is actually softer or not as strong as the blued carbon steel barrel sleeve so it’s actually a down grade. Also without making it thicker there won’t be any performance increase but making it thicker creates all sorts of other tolerance problems, it’s not like FX machine work is a sloppy mess. By the time you get all the parts together for a full barrel you already already paying almost the price of a FX barrel while getting an inferior, no warranty product. 


Btw when people/smaller shops make things out of stainless steel is usually because stainless is softer and only requires a single machining step as supposed to much more expensive tooling needed for much harder carbon steel and then another entire processs to rust proofing like bluing. I’m pretty sure FX uses chromoly tubes(not sure which series) which is very tough on tool bits to cut but one of the best strength to weight ration material outside of titanium. 


extension is an interesting idea though.
 
Upvote 0
Interesting idea but I’m not sure what it buys or what is the benefit. Stainless steel is actually softer or not as strong as the blued carbon steel barrel sleeve so it’s actually a down grade. Also without making it thicker there won’t be any performance increase but making it thicker creates all sorts of other tolerance problems, it’s not like FX machine work is a sloppy mess. By the time you get all the parts together for a full barrel you already already paying almost the price of a FX barrel while getting an inferior, no warranty product. 


Btw when people/smaller shops make things out of stainless steel is usually because stainless is softer and only requires a single machining step as supposed to much more expensive tooling needed for much harder carbon steel and then another entire processs to rust proofing like bluing. I’m pretty sure FX uses chromoly tubes(not sure which series) which is very tough on tool bits to cut but one of the best strength to weight ration material outside of titanium. 


extension is an interesting idea though.
Click to expand...


Without knowing which version (or grade) of stainless steel the guy is using it's too early to say whether or not it is a weaker version of a barrel.
 
Upvote 0
@covid_hunter: it goes back to my point is that most little shops won’t have the tooling or funds to use high grade stainless which is quite expensive and don’t usually come in tube form. Even high grade stainless are usually much softer than good/not high grade carbon steel or chromoly which comes in many grades and just about any size tubes. Stainless tubes are a little more expensive as raw material than chromoly tubes but the extra expense of tooling and secondary finish processes means unless you are capable of mass production stainless is a LOT cheaper but will last you unknown(few) number of rounds.


just shop for good quality AR barrels and see the price difference between stainless and steel barrels. A good cold hammer forged and blued steel barrels are north of 800 dollars while stainless barrels are 200 bucks on sale and can do MOA. 




Again the question is what does it buy you after 150 bucks with shipping? Shinny barrel? You can buy FX barrel sleeve directly from FX and guaranteed to fit. A barrel kit is 400 with probe and shroud, by the time you piece together a barrel kit that’s not guaranteed to work or have correct alignment you are not going to be far off from the 400 dollar mark but with added pleasure of figuring out what is wrong with all those individual parts that you really can’t return. If I have any issues with my barrel kits I’ll call FX and they will send me an entire new barrel kit. 
 
Upvote 0
@covid_hunter: it goes back to my point is that most little shops won’t have the tooling or funds to use high grade stainless which is quite expensive and don’t usually come in tube form. Even high grade stainless are usually much softer than good/not high grade carbon steel or chromoly which comes in many grades and just about any size tubes. Stainless tubes are a little more expensive as raw material than chromoly tubes but the extra expense of tooling and secondary finish processes means unless you are capable of mass production stainless is a LOT cheaper but will last you unknown(few) number of rounds.


just shop for good quality AR barrels and see the price difference between stainless and steel barrels. A good cold hammer forged and blued steel barrels are north of 800 dollars while stainless barrels are 200 bucks on sale and can do MOA. 




Again the question is what does it buy you after 150 bucks with shipping? Shinny barrel? You can buy FX barrel sleeve directly from FX and guaranteed to fit. A barrel kit is 400 with probe and shroud, by the time you piece together a barrel kit that’s not guaranteed to work or have correct alignment you are not going to be far off from the 400 dollar mark but with added pleasure of figuring out what is wrong with all those individual parts that you really can’t return. If I have any issues with my barrel kits I’ll call FX and they will send me an entire new barrel kit.
Click to expand...


I sent the maker an email asking him how his product compared to the FX sleeve with regard to strength and stiffness and also asked him what were the advantages of using his product over the FX brand. When I get a reply, I will post it here.

With regard to where I spend my money, I prefer stainless steel over carbon steel for knife making and I like the look of it also. If it made a better sleeve, I would definitely buy one.
 
Upvote 0
If you really like stainless I would suggest spend just a couple of hundreds more (you will with all the other parts anyways) and just get a full stainless steel barrel machined to a FX transfer port, LW, TJ and other barrel makers all make stainless barrel blanks that can be machined to exact spec. Absolutely ZERO harmonic problems because it's solid, with single piece of metal there is very little chance of misalignment between parts as long as you have a good machinist. You get the shiny barrel and a proper/real upgrade, granted not going to be a lot more accurate than the current FX barrels but there is almost no tuning needed thanks to the solid barrel. The only down side is it is much heavier than the FX barrels, with airgun ammo's soft lead there is no wear disadvantage compared to the cold hammer forged barrel and FX liners are stainless anyways for the very same reasons I mentioned before. If there is actual advantage to use stainless tubes for their sleeves FX would have done it already, it probably would of saved them manufacturing time at the very least.



Let's be honest, regardless of which material is stronger the strength argument is a completely moot point because the amount of force we are dealing with as airgun's barrel sleeve is minimum at best. If you like stainless and want to pay for it then go ahead but there is no doubt that there is no advantage going that route outside of the look with possible problems when trying to put together a bunch of parts from different corners of the world that require very tight tolerance. I wish you luck if you do decide to go that route. 
 
Upvote 0
I don't see a need for it, if you want stiff do the bonded on the liner and a slide over 3mm wall tube on the outer. Plus I think it looks goofy as the only shiny part of the gun.

Solid barrel adds a lot of weight where you don't want it so thats not a perfect solution either. I have a solid lw barrel for the Boss and its noticeably heavier (all out past the hands) than when I use the STX setup.
 
Upvote 0
Looks okay in a polished finish.

FX Bling.1615231868.JPG


FX Bling1.1615231868.JPG

 
Upvote 0
I want to see results. Not so concerned with the material make up. Or bling....If it makes the gun shoot better than stock then I’m interested. 
Come to think of it, I haven’t seen any comparison of stock barrels and “carbon fiber” barrels before and after, shooting targets. Perhaps I missed the videos. I’d really like to see them before I plop down one dime. 


i agree, the extender looks interesting and would prove more useful to me as my other Impact has a 600 mm barrel setup. 
 
Upvote 0
Yea I agree with Drumsnguns...the idea of putting a barrel liner inside a carbon fiber sleeve for "strength" or whatever other reason has not been shown to improve accuracy, so what is the point other than to fleece a bunch of suckers out of their money by creating a "need" for something that is totally unnecessary?
 
Upvote 0
Click to expand...

Yea I agree with Drumsnguns...the idea of putting a barrel liner inside a carbon fiber sleeve for "strength" or whatever other reason has not been shown to improve accuracy, so what is the point other than to fleece a bunch of suckers out of their money by creating a "need" for something that is totally unnecessary?
Click to expand...



Have you tried it? The carbon liner is absolutely not "needed" if you stick to pellets at sub 20 FPE, but when trying to push slugs at well over 50FPE and trying to get sub inch group at 100 meters then it absolutely does improve accuracy and not by a little bit either. The outer carbon barrel tensioner or shroud spacer to create tension on the barrel isn't for accuracy, it's for preventing minor POI shift after bumping the barrel.

Is it totally unnecessary? To some, yes. To me it's definitely "needed" and I have carbon liner sleeves on almost all my liners, that darn Ernest won't take my money any more though! 
 
Upvote 0
Click to expand...

Yea I agree with Drumsnguns...the idea of putting a barrel liner inside a carbon fiber sleeve for "strength" or whatever other reason has not been shown to improve accuracy, so what is the point other than to fleece a bunch of suckers out of their money by creating a "need" for something that is totally unnecessary?
Click to expand...



Have you tried it? The carbon liner is absolutely not "needed" if you stick to pellets at sub 20 FPE, but when trying to push slugs at well over 50FPE and trying to get sub inch group at 100 meters then it absolutely does improve accuracy and not by a little bit either. The outer carbon barrel tensioner or shroud spacer to create tension on the barrel isn't for accuracy, it's for preventing minor POI shift after bumping the barrel.

Is it totally unnecessary? To some, yes. To me it's definitely "needed" and I have carbon liner sleeves on almost all my liners, that darn Ernest won't take my money any more though!
Click to expand...

Chuck can stack em without one, he can definitely shoot. But again it isn't about accuracy, full disclosure I have 3 on my favorite (700mm) liners and love them. As well as a 14x20mm 3mm wall one I run on the outside. I like them, I can bounce it around in the woods and POI doesn't move. To each their own but I am admittedly one of those suckers and enjoy it.
 
Upvote 0
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back
Home
Forums
Resources
Menu