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Shooting for score is so much more stressful than just shooting groups

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Sqwirl57

Sqwirl57

Member
Apr 13, 2020
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PA, United States
I found some 25yd benchrest targets online and decided it would be fun. I thought it would be much simpler than it actually is. Typically I just shoot for groups and do pretty well but this has been eye opening. It is a completely different mountain to conquer. Granted the targets are scaled down a bit to fit an 8.5x11 printer paper, I still hoped for a bit better. For scale, the 6 ring or better is under a dime. The outer black 5 ring is roughly a penny.

OBLIGATITORY EXCUSE PARAGRAPH:

Wind was definitely a factor here this morning and I was severely lacking wind flags. I scored on broken lines counting the lead outline of the pellet. Not sure how its actually supposed to be done but that was my best guess. I'm using domes as opposed to wadcutters so my punches weren't as clean as they could have been. Anyway, here's my attempt with my .22 Theoben. 217/250


20230729_111652.jpg


My cheap printer can't handle card stock well so it's unfortunately off center. The important bits are there though.
 
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SpiralGroove said:
Yes - Absolutely:cry:
I can shoot 1 MOA at 50/100 yards often enough, but trying to hit an exact DOT is another level of difficulty(y).

However, shooting a card for score helps you realize there is much to learn:whistle:.
Click to expand...
Absolutely more to learn. There's always more to learn in this game it seems. This was fun though and will be fun to track my scores. Funny enough I did shoot a quick group when I finished just to see if my gun was acting up. Sure enough, nope, just over 1 MOA so I have noone to blame but myself. Time to git gud.
 
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You have to always shoot over flags. It is impossible to do well without getting lucky no matter how calm it seems. If you always shoot over flags and watch them every shot…you will learn without even trying to learn. Right eye on the scope…left eye on the flags at all times. If you cannot do that at first…that should be your first step.

Don’t shoot at a range that has a million obstacles and wind impediments. You cannot learn the wind that way. It will take forever to learn anything useful. You can learn how to shoot crappy broken up wind after you learn how to read basic wind. Don’t shoot past 50y if you’re trying to learn wind with a pellet gun. 25y is best. You will do nothing but get frustrated. The fastest way to learn wind is to shoot at a range and distance that is 100% readable. If your gun is good for a reliable 1 moa….don’t practice on cards that require 1/2 moa. It is impossible to do well without a lot of luck. Nobody can make a 1 moa gun shoot 1/2 moa except by chance. Nobody.

Mike
 
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thomasair said:
You have to always shoot over flags. It is impossible to do well without getting lucky no matter how calm it seems. If you always shoot over flags and watch them every shot…you will learn without even trying to learn. Right eye on the scope…left eye on the flags at all times. If you cannot do that at first…that should be your first step.

Don’t shoot at a range that has a million obstacles and wind impediments. You cannot learn the wind that way. It will take forever to learn anything useful. You can learn how to shoot crappy broken up wind after you learn how to read basic wind. Don’t shoot past 50y if you’re trying to learn wind with a pellet gun. 25y is best. You will do nothing but get frustrated. The fastest way to learn wind is to shoot at a range and distance that is 100% readable. If your gun is good for a reliable 1 moa….don’t practice on cards that require 1/2 moa. It is impossible to do well without a lot of luck. Nobody can make a 1 moa gun shoot 1/2 moa except by chance. Nobody.

Mike
Click to expand...
Great advice. Noted and thank you!
 
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thomasair said:
You have to always shoot over flags. Right eye on the scope…left eye on the flags at all times. If you cannot do that at first…that's your first step.

Don’t shoot at a range that has a million obstacles and wind impediments. You cannot learn the wind that way. It will take forever to learn anything useful. Don’t shoot past 50y if you’re trying to learn wind with a pellet gun. 25y is best. You will do nothing but get frustrated. The fastest way to learn wind is to shoot at a range and distance that is 100% readable. If your gun is good for a reliable 1 moa….don’t practice on cards that require 1/2 moa. It is impossible to do well without a lot of luck. Nobody can make a 1 moa gun shoot 1/2 moa except by chance. Nobody.

Mike
Click to expand...
Mike,
My range only has distances of 50/100 yards, but I will check to see if anything can be done in-between.

Also, my range (circa 1945) has had housing developments built around it, hence there are many sound baffles around/top of it to reduce noise.
Tree lines on either side too - Question:

- How much do these obstacles hinder a 100% readable range .... ?
 
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SpiralGroove said:
Mike,
My range only has distances of 50/100 yards, but I will check to see if anything can be done in-between.

Also, my range (circa 1945) has had housing developments built around it, hence there are many sound baffles around/top of it to reduce noise.
Tree lines on either side too - Question:

- How much do these obstacles hinder a 100% readable range .... ?
Click to expand...
That would be hard for me to say. Maybe not much…maybe a lot. Your best option is an open field. Most gun ranges are not good places to learn basic wind.

Mike
 
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I am retired and can spend up to two days during the week and one during a weekend at the range. I like to spend at least 4 hours each trip.

With center fire you reload at the bench and adapt the round to the conditions. With rim fire and a barrel tuner you can change make and brand of ammo and tune the barrel as conditions change . Both of which makes an enjoyable 4 hours at the range.

With pellets, to extend my shooting out as long as possible for maximum training, I set an ARA or N50 target out at 25 yards for .177 and 50 yards for .22 and shoot 3 pellets per bull's eye. No sighters once record shots begin.

I score 0 if the 10/100 ring is broken completely, 10 if is not, and 10X if all three pellets make one hole.

You get the best of both worlds, group and score, you learn how your rest behaves, and how to shade for wind conditions on the fly.
 
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Jon

Good advice given here.

A couple ideas have come to mind as I digest this. I started using flags about two years ago, and still struggle with what they are telling me. But, they definitely do help.

If your range owner allows it, place your target at 25 yards vs. 50 yards with 1 flag 5-8 yards from the bench.
Try and choose a light wind day at first, progressing to higher wind days after you start learning good shooting wind conditions. You can also do this at 50y and use 1 or 2 flags, but try and start at 25y for learning purposes.

Take notes on various bulls. As an example, what was your flag doing when you shot bull #’s, 4, 5, & 6? What was your hold for those shots? I would also observe the same for your 9’sand 10’s. I know taking notes is a pia and slows everything down, but who cares. You are learning and you want to recall what worked and what doesn’t.

I realize that after a while, you won’t need to take notes as you will remember the wind calls / flag directions that worked and didn’t from repetition.

I started doing this note taking but stopped, but your post reminded me I need to start doing this again so I can analyze what I am learning, or not.

Mike’s point about using a reliable rifle that can shoot 1 hole at 25 yard and MOA or better at 50y is so true. If your gun can’t consistently do either, and you combine that with using smaller bulls ( or rings) than your gun realistically can hit; then factor in the wind = frustration.
 
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All great points and thanks to all for sharing your tips. I concur with @tommyb about keeping a range log especially if you have CRS disease like I do. Yes, its the dreaded Can't Remember Squat disease. Mine is so bad that I write stuff down on Post-It notes then I forget where I stuck the darn note, duh! All kidding aside my range log has been an immense help to me in both ARA and N50 shooting events as well as wind reading notes.

Not only do wind flags help with wind direction but more important [to me] is watching the flag's tail angle position as that tells me about wind speed and that tells me how far off to hold. I am by no means as skilled as many of the shooters here but I continue to learn every time I sit behind my rifle.
 
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Sqwirlfugger57 said:
I found some 25yd benchrest targets online and decided it would be fun. I thought it would be much simpler than it actually is. Typically I just shoot for groups and do pretty well but this has been eye opening. It is a completely different mountain to conquer. Granted the targets are scaled down a bit to fit an 8.5x11 printer paper, I still hoped for a bit better. For scale, the 6 ring or better is under a dime. The outer black 5 ring is roughly a penny.

OBLIGATITORY EXCUSE PARAGRAPH:

Wind was definitely a factor here this morning and I was severely lacking wind flags. I scored on broken lines counting the lead outline of the pellet. Not sure how its actually supposed to be done but that was my best guess. I'm using domes as opposed to wadcutters so my punches weren't as clean as they could have been. Anyway, here's my attempt with my .22 Theoben. 217/250


View attachment 376588

My cheap printer can't handle card stock well so it's unfortunately off center. The important bits are there though.
Click to expand...
card stock is available in many weights , My Epson will handle 63# pound card stock . also (3M) spray adhesive works great to attach printer paper to cardboard to avoid tear outs
 
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beerthief said:
card stock is available in many weights , My Epson will handle 63# pound card stock . also (3M) spray adhesive works great to attach printer paper to cardboard to avoid tear outs
Click to expand...
Thanks for the tip on the spray adhesive! I'll get some here.

I was debating ordering a proper printer that can handle 11×17 card stock (so I can print them to the correct scale) but quickly realized how expensive they can get.

I can order 300 of them through legit channels for $115 though so I shot them an email this morning.
 
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I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks that since I can shoot great groups I can become the next BR champion. It is a world of difference. After shooting my first card I was pretty disappointed. However, I will accept this new challenge and try to learn from everyone and everything. Thanks for starting this discussion and I hope the input and advice will keep coming.
 
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beerthief said:
Targets , like most things i try to reduce costs , usually end up the same or less by ordering on line, just have to watch shipping $$ . sometimes if you order 2x or 3x the count of targets for the same shipping cost as 1 pkg.
Click to expand...
Yeah I found that out quickly. Shipping is $25 whether I buy 100 or 300 so I figured may as well just go for 300. They'll get used eventually.
 
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