HW/Weihrauch Ring modification

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.20calguy

.20calguy

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May 6, 2021
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My HW97, with an opticaly centered scope, shoots low. (See 5 shot group at 30 yards)
I have since zeroed my scope to it's max adjustment achieving a 75 yard zero.

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I have a set of West Hunter rings that are height adjustable, but the ring angle is fixed, so that they don't follow the scope angle when one ring is raised. The result concentrates the clamp forces to edge of the rings. That could damage a scope and void its warranty. Reading the warranty with my scope, an Element Helix, it says that damage from scope shims will void the warranty. So I've got to do this right.

So, I have begun modifying these West Hunter, rings to be height, and MOA adjustable.

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I filed the grooves in the center ring, and trial fit it with good results so far. The remaining grooves in the base grab well.
I will also drill and tap a scope stop screw, which will be adjustable for height then do some testing.
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If scope height is not a problem, you might want to modify these adjustable risers instead and avoid putting stress on your scope tube.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B076Y28TQ...p_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9kZXRhaWxfdGhlbWF0aWM

I did the same thing you did about 2 years ago and filed away the groves on one side of the riser that's adjustable and locked the whole thing down with a set screw.
However, these are so cheap that I've completely skipped the set screw part and just permanently epoxy them at the height I want. I have 4 sets of these at different heights. I might try JB weld in the future for more stability.

The advantages with the riser are:
1. there's zero chance of bending or putting stress on your scope tube. (no clue why some like to shim their scope mounts when there are better options)
2. by putting shims on the sides, you are also able to adjust for windage. (again these shims are on the riser...no stress on scope tubes)
3. you can put any size scope tubes on these, 1 in, 30 mm, 34 mm etc

Just a warning, I got flamed when I posted this a year ago. I'm sure those flamers are still around.

I've been told not to use these in competition (There's no way these would be stable...blah blah blah) ... LOL...some of you know me. I don't listen. Been shooting these riser set ups on my TX200 in WFTF with mostly heavy scopes (Sightrons, Falcons, Hawke 10-50x etc). By July I'll post my "experiment" with these risers.

I tried talking Sportmatch into making adjustable risers instead of their one piece adjustable scope mounts. The answer was "we'll look into it" that was 3 years ago. They are probably still looking ...LOL. I think financially, it doesn't make sense for Sportmatch to make adjustable risers cos it's going to negatively impact their adjustable scope mount sales. That's the short-sighted view. If they move forward, I think they can corner the market on adjustable mounts and risers.
 
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JP806TX said:
If scope height is not a problem, you might want to modify these adjustable risers instead.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B076Y28TQ...p_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9kZXRhaWxfdGhlbWF0aWM

I did the same thing you did about 2 years ago and filed away the groves on one side of the riser that's adjustable and locked the whole thing down with a set screw.
However, these are so cheap that I've completely skipped the set screw part and just permanently epoxy them at the height I want. I have 4 sets of these at different heights.

The advantages with the riser are:
1. there's zero chance of bending or putting stress on your scope tube.
2. by putting shims on the sides, you are also able to adjust for windage.

Just a warning, I got flamed when I posted this a year ago. I'm sure those flamers are still around.
Click to expand...
any one find an adj.riser with 11 MM rail ?
 
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JP806TX said:
I did the same thing you did about 2 years ago and filed away the groves on one side of the riser that's adjustable and locked the whole thing down with a set screw.
Click to expand...
I searched for that article and couldn't find it. I was interested in your results.
I decided to do it first hand and document my findings.
 
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JP806TX said:
Just a warning, I got flamed when I posted this a year ago. I'm sure those flamers are still around.
I've been told not to use these in competition (There's no way these would be stable...blah blah blah) ... LOL...some of you know me. I don't listen.
Click to expand...
A concideration for mine are that they are going on a springer. If they pass that test they good to go. If not I was looking at replacing them anyway, but who makes an MOA adjustable dovetail mount? A riser makes two purchases.
 
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RX2 fitted With B-Square AA adjustable mounts

Made the stop pin and now installed hecoil inserts in the gimbals 2 were striped, I think this will be better then original threads, as the set screws will be pushing on the coils. Think the mount will hold up to the RX2,
www.airgunnation.com www.airgunnation.com

My posting is in the link above (see #3)

Yeah you need a dovetail to Picatinny adaptor for that riser....I don't think that riser comes in 11 mm dovetail. Yes it is two purchase.
BUT one time payment and delivery if you buy thru Amazon. LOL


Dovetail to Weaver riser 20 MOA
B08VSDLKCP

20MOA DOVETAIL TO PICATINNY RAIL

HI i FOUND A 20MOA DOVETAIL TO PICATINNY RAIL AND IT IS MADE IN USA , THIS IS ANSWER TO THE FX GUNS SO YOU CAN RUN A GOOD PAIR OF SCOPE RINGS AND HAVE ADJUSTMENT i PUT IT ON MY WILDCAT AND ON MY AIRFORCE TEXAN AND MY CONDOR , WOW THE BEST RAIL i EVER USED I ALSO NEEDED A RAIL FOR MY THERMAL...
www.airgunnation.com www.airgunnation.com
Sorry there's a dead link in that post.

One of the active links for Dovetail to Picatinny 20 MOA riser is this one. Made in America

www.morraccuracy.com

Morr Accuracy

Morr Accuracy - manufacturers of top quality scope rings and scope mounts for the target shooting, tactical, police and military markets.
www.morraccuracy.com
 
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If one needs a low scope height I recall the lowest option was the Burris Signature adjustable rings with the clip in dovetail to picatinny adapters.

If the recoil of a springer with those adapters is a concern the next lowest option is a dovetail to picatinny adapter from Eagle Vision. Again, used with the Burris Signature rings.

I did try the spring loaded adapters with a Gamo gas piston with especially severe recoil. They were not strong enough. But I'm convinced this Gamo was haunted or something. Even the stock riser with the stop pin caused the stop pin hole on the rail to ovalize.
 
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For the time being, I am using a RWS "lock Down" mount and shims. It's not ideal but I hate bending barrels on underlevers that latch to the muzzle. The Blue Lam is almost as accurate as my TX200s so I'm going to keep it. The shot sequence is a bit twangier than a TX and the out of the box trigger isn't what it should be but that is easily fixable. I used the same tactic on the HW98 but will likely bend the barrel. The HW 98 is smooth and accurate so it's worth it to keep.

Yes, I know; send them back. BUT I can make them work and didn't buy them to collect. And, like I said, the HW97k is nearly as good out of the box as a TX, and they don't see fit to build in .20. I still hate Ambi stocks on the HW97k. The HW98 stock is fine to me.
 
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Mycapt65 said:
Fix the droop or go with an 11mm drooper mount. I've fixed probably two dozen Weihrauchs with droop including my 97 and another for someone else.
Click to expand...
I agree but don't think that we should have to do this. I have 5 AA TX and ProS bought from 2010 to current. and never more than a couple of MOA of droop. Never have I had windage issues. The HW 80 that I just got has NO droop. That is the only HW springer that has less than 15moa of droop and some have quite a bit of windage issues. These are bought over the last 15yrs and while I am an amateur compared to Crowski, I do have a lot of HW springers.

They can do it right; we shouldn't have to at that price point. My Gamo and Cometa don't do this.
 
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Star7 said:
I agree but don't think that we should have to do this. I have 5 AA TX and ProS bought from 2010 to current. and never more than a couple of MOA of droop. Never have I had windage issues. The HW 80 that I just got has NO droop. That is the only HW springer that has less than 15moa of droop and some have quite a bit of windage issues. These are bought over the last 15yrs and while I am an amateur compared to Crowski, I do have a lot of HW springers.

They can do it right; we shouldn't have to at that price point. My Gamo and Cometa don't do this.
Click to expand...
I completely concur. I'm only offering you a viable solution for a difficult situation for the general consumer. I'll help you if you like, but complaining about Weihrauchs quality control is preaching to the choir. I've reluctantly been down this road too many time s.
 
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Mycapt65 said:
I completely concur. I'm only offering you a viable solution for a difficult situation for the general consumer. I'll help you if you like, but complaining about Weihrauchs quality control is preaching to the choir. I've reluctantly been down this road too many time s.
Click to expand...
The viable solution in my opinion is Dovetail MOA adjustable rings.

As I have said before a bent barrel to me is a ruined barrel. I can see an advertisment " used HW97 for sale, bent barrel for moa correction."

Springers aren't the only airguns with this condition but the others seem to deal with it by adjusting the scope angle, or indexing the barrel.

This is the rear Eaglevision ring from my professionaly set up FX Crown. Look how much MOA compensation it took to center the scope

As you can see theres not a lot of difference in the Eaglevision and the West Hunter rings designs.

The question is weather a springer will compromise their grip. I plan to drill and tap the rear base for an stop pin.

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.20calguy said:
The viable solution in my opinion is Dovetail MOA adjustable rings.

As I have said before a bent barrel to me is a ruined barrel. I can see an advertisment " used HW97 for sale, bent barrel for moa correction."

Springers aren't the only airguns with this condition but the others seem to deal with it by adjusting the scope angle, or indexing the barrel.

This is the rear Eaglevision ring from my professionaly set up FX Crown. Look how much MOA compensation it took to center the scope

As you can see theres not a lot of difference in the Eaglevision and the West Hunter rings designs.

The question is weather a springer will compromise their grip. I plan to drill and tap the rear base for an stop pin.

View attachment 461820
Click to expand...
A bent barrel isn’t ruined at all. The bend required to fix it isnt noticeable to the eye. My 177 97k has shot dimes at 50 yards on a good day and quarters regularly. Ive adjusted nearly all my Weihrauchs to optical center at 10 yards and they all shoot very well. Bending a barrel to optical center at 10 yards will zero again at 25 or 30 yards. Holdover reticles are used past that.

Adjustable rings are too much of a PITA for me. Most adjustable rings don't compensate for windage and IMO look like an ugly erector set on a rifle. I prefer a more elegant solution.

Almost all of these guns have had their barrel corrected. Can you tell which ones? I'll tell you the 97 has and it's a real shooter.



Area 419 is a top shelf company that makes canted 11mm pic rails for cz and Anshutz PB rifles. Perhaps one of those and Burris signature rings will fix the problem without touching the barrel. It'll cost you and it still won't look as clean as two Sportmatch rings but they are serious quality parts with a strong followingin the powder burning world.

Please dont imply that my advise to bend the barrel is dangerous to the function of the rifle. You do things your way. I'll do them my way. I've straightened out plenty of guns for a few people here without a complaint. They wouldn't continue to trust me with their rifles if I didn't know what I was doing.

Ron

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I think the OP intent was to zero at 75 yards to shoot long distances? (hence you see the low POI at 30 yards, then again maybe I'm wrong)
These springers were designed to be zeroed at 25-30 yards.

So stretching it out to 75 is going to require a different set of mounting system.

I think some replies might have overlooked the 75 yard zero and rightly questioned why bending the barrel was offered as an option.

Again I caution the OP and others who wants to test out a two piece scope mount system with adjustable height/windage (or the practice of shimming). It's very easy to put stress on your scope tube or bend them with two separate rings (or shimming them).

There are one piece adjustable mounts (or modified mounts or manufactured Moa risers) that does the same thing with zero chance of putting stress on your scope tubes.
 
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