• The AGN App is ready! Search "Airgun Nation" in your App store. To compliment this new tech we've assigned the "Threads" Feed & "Dark" Mode. To revert back click HERE.

Researching my first PCP... I think I'm ready.

"guod123"You mentioned night vision, one problem you might have is with scope height. The air Force guns with their design already have the scopes riding high, add a weaver-picatinney adapter and a scope like the ATN xsight and you'll probably be higher than the 100 mm/ 4" ? max I believe they have for their calibration.
I'm going as cheap as possible with this night vision setup because it will be dedicated to this gun and only used under 40 yards. Planning on getting a Bushnell equinox Z with mount and running that behind a red dot. Ill need some rail adaptors but that's easy. I agree the cheek weld won't be good with the higher Airforce rail but it still should be useable. 

Thanks for all the advice so far, I'm going to look at the other guns that were reccomend. 
 
The real problem is that there are so many really good choices out there. So, let me throw another "Choice" into the ring. Either a .22 or .25 Marauder. I tuned mine for JSB 18.3gr pellets. 830 fps at the muzzle. At this tune, it gets about 20 shots per fill when the speeds bottom out at about 810 fps. That gives around 27 foot pounds energy. Sufficient to knock down any critter you described. I get 1.5 inch or so groups at 75 yards.

​Folks with the .25 tell me they get way better accuracy at longer range. Now, not sure how much is true and how much is a fish story, but universally, they are happy.

​As for filling, hand pumps are a royal pain in the backside. Find someplace that can fill your tanks, and buy a tank. I use the small AirVenturi 90cubic inch bottle. Made shooting sooooooooo much better. If no one can fill a bottle close by, start looking for a compressor.

​The other direction you could go, knowing that you will want a better gun in a year or two is a Benjamin Maximus. Crappy trigger from what I've heard, but very accurate. If you order from Crosman on Friday's (free shipping Fridays), and use the code "AGNATION" the Maximus is $165 shipped. The big plus to the maximus is that a hand pump will work very well. It's only a 2000 PSI fill, so pumping is easy. On my Marauder with a 3000 fill, that last 300 or 400 PSI is a real bear. It is an exercise program all on it's own.

​In my case, the low end guns available today weren't there when I started. I chose the Marauder as my entry level, also knowing I'd be looking for better over time. I'm sure everyone is sick of hearing my sob story about saving for a Crown, but that's where I am at the moment. It's a terrible disease once you get into the sport.

In business it's called Prototyping. Build a small working version that you intend to learn from and eventually completely leave behind. My prototype was and is my Marauder. The final design will be the Crown. (with more to come after that).

​The marauder is not regulated, but does give 30 solid shots with the 14.3 Domed Premier pellets at about 830 fps or about 20 shots with the JSB 18.3 grain Exacts. It does require tuning for the pellet, but it's three hex wrenches to tune everything. The Premier Domes have a standard deviation of about 12 fps with the proper tune at 30 shots per fill. My current tune seems to be about 6 fps standard deviation. Still working on the best combo, but trial and error says this is about the best I can get for Premier Domes.

​Unfortunately, I didn't keep the JSB information. I'll have to reshoot those shot strings to provide the information.

​Whatever you choose, there are so many good choices, you can't really go wrong. Pull the trigger (pun intended) and get shooting!
 
"Siscakidd"I really want the Kral Puncher Breaker but its just not quiet enough for me. Anything much more expensive is out of my price range for now. I can go up to a $750 if there is another super short, dead silent gun I’m unaware of. I haven’t looked at used guns yet.
you can can buy a .25 Kral puncher breaker from annihilator Airguns with in your budget...with his quiet kit installed and his valve set up all done,it’s super quiet
The Annihilator Puncher quiet kit is only $35. I'm now wondering if a stock Puncher for $500 with that kit would be quiet enough...

Does the tune and valve kit from Annihilator effect the sound at all? I'm not convinced I need that. 
 
"intenseaty22"
"Vance"So I'm looking at the Air force TalonP and I really like what I see. Are moderators from Talon tunes good or should I keep looking? They have a 9" moderator for $175. Would this setup be more or less quiet than a P2 QE?
Call Donny FL and see what he recommends. His moderators are generally better and cheaper than the others.
DonnyFL has some really nice stuff. I bet a Puncher Breaker with one of his suppressors would be quiet enough. :D
 
For the price a Marauder pistol with stock is really appealing, especially the kit with the pump included. I'd probably end up adding a moderator so there is some extra cost. I have one concern though. It looks like adding rail adaptors and higher optics would not be easy and the stock is so basic that there wouldn't be any cheek weld.

The optic rail height on a bullpup like the Breaker seems ideal. The rail is already almost even with the cheek piece. I'm a little hesitant to commit to a full size rifle like that because I'm starting off with a hand pump until I can get a booster pump for my 60 gallon compressor. I don't plan on shooting a lot though, I really just need this for pest control. A gun that's more versital with more room to expand is better though.
 
"intenseaty22"Have you considered the Brocock Compatto? Pretty good value. $700 new, very accurate, quiet, short, comes with LCD included. I had one and only sold it to upgrade to a Cricket. It’s pretty short too. 
https://www.airgunsofarizona.com/precharged-pcp/brocock-compatto-.22/
I did see that gun before but not at $700. That is a very strong contender. Just slightly longer than I want but not bad. Looking on that website I can't tell if the price includes the Hugget moderator or not, its in the picture.
 
Airgunners,
http://www.aafta.org/html/organization/organization_aafta_clubs_ne.html

that's a good start.

Have you looked at chairgun ( free download ) to see just what a 150+fps spread will do it poi? 

Now that you clearly stated what your trying to do, except if you "need" short, a Benjamin Maximus or Discovery in.22 with a TKO will absolutely do what you need and it will do so easier than your first choice. Used na Maximus with quite added should be around $200???

Play with chairgun a bit , you'll see why that extreme spread matters. 


John
 
"Vance"
"intenseaty22"Have you considered the Brocock Compatto? Pretty good value. $700 new, very accurate, quiet, short, comes with LCD included. I had one and only sold it to upgrade to a Cricket. It’s pretty short too. 
https://www.airgunsofarizona.com/precharged-pcp/brocock-compatto-.22/
I did see that gun before but not at $700. That is a very strong contender. Just slightly longer than I want but not bad. Looking on that website I can't tell if the price includes the Hugget moderator or not, its in the picture.
Call them and ask. When I bought mine it absolutely had a Huggett.
 
8291e01ce9dbc99061a874210c6fd4c3.jpg
ba428eceaf6587126d6a70fce47f1d4a.jpg
Here is a couple 30 yards shooting with my Compatto. 5 shot group. 1 dead Fly. 
 
Vance, let me tell you about my Benjamin Woods Walker. Hopefully this will help narrow it down and hope to not piss off any previous posters.

I own several PCP's. FX Wildcat in .25, Kalibrgun Colibri Hummingbird in .22, gen1 Vulcan .22...but my go to gun is my Woods Walker in .22.

It's literally about the most fun you can have shooting off the cuff. It's a Lazer beam inside 35 yds. With a Donnyfl sumo you only hear it poot. It doesn't want to float as much as my other bullpups when I'm lining up my shots. Bottom line is, it what I take out all the possums, raccoons and squirrels and starlings that damage my property. I made two shots in the past week at 43 and 47 yds on squirrels where only the head was presented as a shot. Both were hit right behind the eye.

Couple of last key points...it's very light. It's very short even w Donny's sumo attached. And as far as kill ability, better than any of the other guns I own for small critters because it's hits so hard because of the lesser 580 fps. Believe me, they don't go far...highly highly recommend you look at this thing twice.

You can almost always find one for under 400 bucks. And accurate to a fault esp w Crosman hollow points and premier domes. Good luck buddy!
 
  • Like
Reactions: ironlion269
"Vance"
"Siscakidd"I really want the Kral Puncher Breaker but its just not quiet enough for me. Anything much more expensive is out of my price range for now. I can go up to a $750 if there is another super short, dead silent gun I’m unaware of. I haven’t looked at used guns yet.
you can can buy a .25 Kral puncher breaker from annihilator Airguns with in your budget...with his quiet kit installed and his valve set up all done,it’s super quiet
The Annihilator Puncher quiet kit is only $35. I'm now wondering if a stock Puncher for $500 with that kit would be quiet enough...
Does the tune and valve kit from Annihilator effect the sound at all? I'm not convinced I need that.
You don’t need the tune but the hardened valve stem is important ,mine failed and so did my buddies,Troy just makes um bulletproof,give him a call he is a good guy to talk to,and the gun is really quiet with the quiet kit installed,the pellets hitting the target make more noise then the gun.
 
Well Vance, a lot of opinions for your first pcp, head spinning faster now? My first was the Marauder in .22, good gun, good "enough" accuracy at sensible distances, quiet without additional moderation and hand-pumpable. But I wanted lighter weight without some of the internal adjustments that go along with making the Mrod the best it can be. Bought a Condor SS also in .22 and haven't looked back. It was pretty quiet out of the box, but I added a TalonTunes 6" moderator and all I hear is the hammer-drop noise now. Awesome accuracy and power, 50+ shots before re-charge with most of the pellets I've shot 16gr up to heaviest, 18 and 21 shoot identical and those are my "go to" ammo. It is only a single shot compared to many models of guns with magazines, but I say this often, "I was a break-barrel shooter before" so single shot is not an issue. AND the .22 WILL dispatch raccoons , no problem!
​Now, for your pesting problems, and the mention of night-vision, (I've never shot or looked through night-vision),, but I could imagine that single shot loading with night-vision apparatus "could" possibly become just-another-thing-that-could-go-wrong and be a frustrating PITA!

​Some of the other suggestions mentioned Hatsan QE models, though I have no experience with these, I wouldn't hesitate to own one, they get great reviews. Good luck choosing and good pesting to you.
 
I've watched HOURS of YouTube videos and looked into everyone's recommendations but this isn't really getting any easier. LOL!


One thing I have realized is I'm probably not going to be happy with a hand pump. Its not that I'm out of shape, I'm in excellent shape. If I'm going to hunt anything I want to put a ton of rounds down range first and my time is somewhat limited. If I can spend a little more and get a scuba tank now I think the time ill save filling the gun will be worth it alone. So I'm looking for someone local to fill tanks for me.


There are a bunch of nice rifles that would do the job for me but I keep coming back to the Puncher Breaker with a quiet kit. It seems like it fills in all my check marks. The price is right and that's probably my number one concern now that I want a tank. I've heard bad things about the Kral though, seems like they might have a quality control issue. If I have to replace the valves at some point that's no big deal. Are there other problems with these besides the valve issue?


Also now considering a BullBoss. Its not as short as the Breaker though. Its likely louder than a Puncher with Quiet kit. Is anyone running a short barrel with aftermarket moderator on a BullBoss? 


The Gladius and Brocock rifles are a little to far out of my price range for now. All the guns in the $300 range are either too long or no good for mounting my night vision setup. Seems like right around $500 is the sweet spot where I can find the features I need.



 
I guess I was lucky when I bought a few years ago. Not nearly as many choices, so the choice was a lot easier. Can't go wrong with most of the choices out there, so at this point, make your best choice and pull the trigger on the order.

As for the hand pump, if I was buying a Maximus with a 2000 PSI fill, I think it would be fine. It only took me a few fills on the Marauder at 3000 PSI fill to figure out I wanted a tank. My goal was to shoot, not pump. Up to 2500 PSI or so isn't bad, but that last few hundred PSI takes some real oomph! Paying a paintball shop $5 per fill is sooooo much easier and I can refill my gun a dozen or so times on each tank fill (96CI HPA Tank). Highly recommend a tank.
 
You found the member map button at the bottom of every page right? Slight help there but something.
FT is always a great place to start, give a shout out there contact may know someone right down the road from you, you'll learn more in one day at a match than a year of reaind, ... ,... ,... .

http://www.aafta.org/html/organization/organization_aafta_clubs_ne.html

And if the Kral now seems appealing, you've read the reviews here right?
Strikefast is a straight shooter has put this up:
http://www.airgunnation.com/topic/my-new-kral-breaker-silent-bull-pup-honest-review-2/page/10/

John

 
I have five Air Arms rifles in .177, (one TX200 MKIII spring rifle and one S-510 pcp) .22 (two S-510 pcps), and one .25 S-510. My experience would indicate that the .22 is by far the most versatile and will easily dispatch a raccoon. Far more pellets to choose from in the .22 and they are deadly accurate. My .25 is a tack driver and hits the target very hard, but it doesn't shoot as flat and it takes a little more time at the range to fully understand hold points beyond 40 yards. From 18 to 35 yards, no hold point understanding is needed with the .25. Either the .22 or the .25 will kill any small game you shoot at if you place the shot where it needs to go inside of 60 yards (some claim much further). I can generally maintain groups of -1.5" at 50 yards with my rifles, often sub 1".

It really comes down to personal preference.
 
I have spent time with the Kral PB .22 and a bullboss in .25 an the bullboss seems HUGE compared to the little kral,there are two main issues with the kral both of which are easily fixed in the aftermarket. The valve and the cocking lever...or you can buy it all done from Thammer ,my kral in 22 shoots dime size groups at 50 yds ,I say if that is the one you keep going back to then go for it and don’t look back.
2f734d94120497f6f88e578243a44e17.jpg

this is 12 shots at 40 yds, will do the same at 50 yds