Question about low powered pigeon culling.

[RangerPete]

Hi Folks,
I have a very specific question for pest controllers who have experiance and knowledge in this very specific situation…
I have been asked to shoot some pigeons in the enterance way to a building. The distance is about 10m (11yards). Easy shot, right? However there is a glass roof to this entrance hall .
This question is aimed at people who have EXPERIENCE in shooting pigeons at close range with LOW powered air rifles.
My question is what FPE is needed to dispatch a pigeon at 11y, with out exiting the bird?
What set up do you use, pellet caliber, weight, shape, fps, fpe and what results (pass through or not) do you get.
Thanks in advance.
Pete.

 

[qball]

3-5 FPE max at that distance with 177, more specifically 400-500fps.

 

[RangerPete]

Thanks qball.
That’s about what I was thinking.
I’m planning on using a .177 8.18gr wad cutter, at 501fsp, which is giving 4.56fpe.

I think I’d still like to find a test subject or two before tackling the entrance hall

 

[igolfat8]

Try to shoot them in the gullet or chest. There is more meat to retard pass through. Resist side shots. Texas lung shots also work well too.

Can you find a shot where glass isn’t in play? I’m pretty accurate but there is no way I’d take a shot with glass behind the target.

 

[qball]

Try it on walnut, apple or pine board, you’ll be surprised how much damage it can do. 5FPE will easily damage/make a hole in building parts, wadcutter generally do a good job stay inside of the pigeon though.

 

[igolfat8]

Try it on walnut, apple or pine board, you’ll be surprised how much damage it can do. 5FPE will easily damage/make a hole in building parts, wadcutter generally do a good job stay inside of the pigeon though.

Yes ….. but …. There is always a chance one could miss and that glass roof has coulda, woulda, shoulda $$$$$ written all over it.

 

[qball]

Yes ….. but …. There is always a chance one could miss and that glass roof has coulda, woulda, shoulda $$$$$ written all over it.

Yeah, glass and pellets don’t go well together. Maybe try 3fpe or 5.7 grain lead free pellets at 500fps, but try it on scrap glass first

 

[RangerPete]

I’ll try it on an apple, but ideally a pigeon or two would be the best test subject.
And yes igolf, I agree a chest shot is probably best, especially with an upward angle, as long as the pellet actually gets through the breast muscles and to the vitals

 

[Hal4son]

I would not take the job if shooting was mandated. Glass as a backdrop would be a non starter. I would eliminate them with spiked feed.

 

[Nattboy]

Well, I wouldn't walk away from that job. I'd run.

 

[c_m_shooter]

Daisy 880 and Crosman 2100 were what we used on the farm growing up. Wadcutter pellets dropped them fast and never exited.

 

[rangur1]

Predator polymags at 2-3 foot pounds or so. probably use a CO2 gun. But birds bodies stop nothing. Their body mass is too light. The pellet will pass through. At 2-3 foot pounds of energy at 5-10 yards it should not break the glass but could chip it. The more I think about it, shooting is not an option unless it's high impact glass, if the owner doesn't know for sure, I'd give it a hard pass.

 

[beerthief]

that glass roof has coulda, woulda, shoulda $$$$$ written all over it.

bet that glass is also curved so a special made pain in the A

I would take a pass fast .

a cheap C02 pistol no ammo , lot of bang but no damage , but if this roof is outside you will never get rid of them .

 

[Struckat]

Well you can’t shoot them with glass as a back stop. I shoot mostly 177 wc @ 3-9fpe and have yet to see a pellet stay in a critter. Birds are soft targets, my bet is you will gat pass through.

Shoot them when not in the entryway, is that possible?

 

[fuznut]

Shooting anything with glass in the back ground is beyond a bad idea. You can treat surface with many different things that will cause birds, insects or rats to find a new place to chill. Research or contact a pest control company very simple and cheap solutions exist for that problem.

 

[Struckat]

I always have Robins trying to nest in the awning over my back door. This year I shot some CLP around the area where they want to build.

That completely discouraged them and the nested elsewhere.

 

[JimD]

Unless you can find a way to test your gun/projectile on a sample of the glass you might hit I would also decline. Glass comes in a wide range of thickness and types so it might be able to absorb the impact of a low power projectile but it also might not. Window glass I am pretty sure would break. A glass block, probably would not. Tempered glass, I don't know. Only difference might be the shape of the pieces if it broke.

The other side of the argument is the results on the pigeons you hit. How much of an issue is it if they fly a bit before falling? With a low powered gun I would expect some will fly at least a short distance, especially with body shots. Is that OK? I've never shot a pigeon (but hope to) but I've noticed the similar but smaller doves are sometimes slow to get the message they are dead. Even with much higher powered, larger caliber, hits.

 

[RangerPete]

Miserable day today, but I managed to get out to one of my permissions and asked if I could use their bottom paddock which I turned into a little shooting range. Wind was strong enough to keep blowing our camp chairs over and the light rain was cold, but it was still nice to get out and do a bit of shooting.
It’s like therapy for me…

So I tested my 4.5fpe .177 and the apple today…
It was a small apple, only about 60mm diameter. The wad cutter unfortunately exited the apple, knocking it off its pedestal.
Second shot did the same again.
I then put a backstop behind the apple and tried it a third time. Wad cutter exited, and lodged into the wood behind it. But was only lightly embedded in the wood…

An interesting side note is that my sons little gamo delta fox shooting a domed pellet at 3.8fpe (so only slightly less power) was also shooting stright through the apple, but didn’t knock it off it’s pedestal.
So both pellets have enough energy to pass through the apple, but the wad cutter is delivering more energy into the apple and thus knocking it over.

Not convinced with todays results, I managed to get out to another permission where I know there are some pigeons and just before dark I managed to bag a pigeon, and a rabbit .
So tomorrow morning I’ll do some (dead) pigeon testing

Shooting the pigeons while they are not in the enterance hall is not a bad idea, but they would be in a public parking lot, so would need to be carefully controlled

 

[Hal4son]

Those are definitive results. FPE is a poor indicator of penetration . If it wasn't for the British setting the standard with their excessive restrictions there wouldn't be the endless chatter about FPE.

 

[fuznut]

The biggest concern with glass is a phenomenon know as Concordial fracture.
Red rider very low power yet knocks a plug out of very thick store front glass due to the density and molecular structure of the glass. That's why it's always a cone shaped plug that gets knocked out. Window and tempered is different and will have different reactions to being hit. Point being you can damage very thick glass with very low power. Even though it might could withstand high power hammer blows with no apparent damage.