pellets and slugs. Dazed and confused.

Folks. I am still new to this whole pcp thing. I have some newbie type questions.
1. I see where folks change barrels and stuff to shoot slugs. Is that necessary just to switch to slugs? Would I be ok shooting slugs in my new Huntsman Revere?

2. Hollow point pellets. I tried some H&N hollow points (crow magnums) today that were almost identical weight to the domed pellets I set up with. The difference was
astounding. They hit all over the place! AT 50 yards, they would hit first left, then right, then low, etc. A few shots at 100 yards and the pellets would not even travel the
entire distance. They fell short by 10 feet or more. The ballistic coefficient was that different. Is this normal? Can you do anything to shoot these pellets effectively?

Thanks gang.

Doc
 
First off, the Crow Magnum pellet is good to about 30 yds. Very devastating pellet at that yardage. My experience with them is that after that yardage, it’s a crap shoot. Try the H&N Baracuda Hunter. Much better hollow point pellet.

if you want to try slugs, start light and work your way up. Try different diameters to find what works best in your gun. It will be frustrating and may cost a little money to get there. Best of luck to you.
 
Hello Doc,
You are ok to try slugs in your rifle. You won't hurt anything. Other brands make specific slug barrels with attributes designed just for slugs but you can certainly try the slugs in your barrel and see how they do. I would probably select a medium to light weight slug for that Revere.

You have found what most of us have which is that air rifles really like domed pellets. Your Revere does seem to have a strong distaste for the Crow Magnums. I've never tried those pellets. I have always found great accuracy using the JSB domed pellets in all the calibers I shoot. If you are looking for a hollow point style pellet maybe try the JSB Hades. I have read great reviews but have never tried those either.
Kenny
 
Doc, from my experience with slugs, the first thing I look at is how they fit thru my barrel as slugs are spin stabilized so whether your barrel is choked or non choked, the slug needs to fit snug/good contact on the lands it comes in contact with (choked area on choked barrels) then speed and oftentimes length. Your Revere as far as I know comes with a choked LW barrel. You can purchase a few different diameter and weights/lengths and/or you can slug the barrel by pushing one thru from the breech out the end and see the groove marks. The kicker is each barrel will be ever so slightly different. I shoot both pellets and slugs thru my RAW's non choked barrel and if a slug loads too easily without much resistance then it will not group (if it was a choked barrel then it would probably fit in smoothly as the choke is at the end of the barrel). Hope this helps and good luck on your slug journey.
 
Thanks for all the information. I was just experimenting with the hollow points for kicks and rats. I normally am not a big fan of hollow points
even in PBs. Soft points with limited expansion leave a better and longer wound channel in my opinion.
I would imagine it is the same for pellets. The daystate has already taken a dozen bushytails around the home place using the domed pellets.

I would like to give slugs a shot(tic). Having something heavier to sling could be handy.
 
From all the testing and feedback I've seen, most hollow point pellets expand very little if at all (usually not at all). Pellets are very different from powder burner bullets. Accurate pellet speeds are typically less than 900 fps, speed bleeds off very fast due to the low ballistic coefficient (much less velocity at the target), and on top of that, the hollow point cavity is very small. The designs with the best reputation seem to be the Predator Polymag and JSB Hades. But even the Hades which is a fresh latest-generation design, people seem split 50/50 whether they get good performance from it. The trade-off with expanding pellet designs is that they are usually less accurate than their domed counter-parts. All of these reasons are why many stick to domed pellets, especially if longer ranges are in play. If your requirements are only for short range, you might have luck finding a sufficiently accurate expanding design and running them as fast as possible.

With regard to 'slug barrels', there is a lot of misunderstanding out there. A big part of this is that FX offers their superior 'standard' barrels and also 'slug barrels'. The main difference in the slug barrel is a faster twist rate that is needed for heavy-for-caliber slugs. Since a lot of people shooting slugs want to hot-rod and use the heaviest slugs, this is what you hear about a lot. The 'standard' barrels in most pcp airguns (not just FX) have twist rates suitable for light to midweight slugs. FX superior standard in .22 cal for example, comes with a 1:24 twist rate (which is slow for a .22 barrel) and is good for up to ~25 grain slugs. Something to keep in mind is that slugs are not forgiving like pellets are. The twist rate may be appropriate, but a gun may not just like a given slug, or it may like a slug but then a small manufacturer change throws things off. Also, when you are shooting slugs, even light ones, your tune is going to be hotter to get them out the barrel so shot cycle movement increases as well as hold sensitivity. Where slugs really shine is shooting 60+ yards, especially in the wind. It's pretty awesome to be able to hit a 1" spinner at 100 yds even with some wind. Good slug accuracy after much trial and error is around 1 MOA for 10 shot groups.

To give you an example - I found that my 600mm .22 Impact M3 shot NSA 20.2gr .218 diameter about 1 to 1.2 MOA. Enjoyed that for about a year, then something changed and now its 2 MOA. I think I got a really bad batch of slugs, and then the absolute latest batch is better but still not what it used to be. .217s also seem to do better now. I don't know for sure and I've been going through validating everything on the gun to be sure. In the middle of all this, I put 10 JSB 18.1gr pellets in the magazine, turned the power wheel down so they'd shoot ~890fps, and I proceeded to shoot a 1MOA group at 50yds. If that 60+ yd performance wasn't oh so sweet with slugs, I would have gone back to pellets.
 
Try quality domed pellets and the choose the ones that perform best for you. Forget about slugs with your current platform. Shoot that sweet Revere with pellets. Lots of “super hype“ around slugs. Shooters come to “pellet” guns for myriad reasons. To try and make them slug shooters like firearms? Super unnecessary for 99% of air gunners.
 
Cro mags were almost always the worst grouping pellet I used. That big cup shape in the front does not help. Great smasher at short range. Now as for slugs, they usually do best when pushed at higher speed than pellets, but that's a can of worms , and plenty of research and money, for what? Daystate makes exceptional pellet shooters, You find that pellet from JSB/FX/AA that drills a hole at 50 yards and enjoy!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Doc C.
My personal rule of thumb...pellets for anything under 70ish meters and 40 fpe.

Beyond those parameters, however, slugs can offer substantial advantages...

While I have found pellets to generally be more accurate than slugs at closer distances; as soon as there is any substantial wind I find that slugs become more accurate at around 50-60 meters due to the much higher BC. It's all about putting that projectile in the kill zone....
 
The H&n barracuda hunter pellets perform very well for me and group nearly as well as domed pellets. Attached you will find a photo of how they expand when fired into water. The projectiles on the left are nsa slugs. The two on the right are barracuda hunters. The last one was fired supersonic.
If you are hunting you will find the hollow points have much better knock down Power.
slugs are great if you intend to shoot much over 80 yards or thereabouts. That is if you can get them to shoot accurately.
 
The H&n barracuda hunter pellets perform very well for me and group nearly as well as domed pellets. Attached you will find a photo of how they expand when fired into water. The projectiles on the left are nsa slugs. The two on the right are barracuda hunters. The last one was fired supersonic.
If you are hunting you will find the hollow points have much better knock down Power.
slugs are great if you intend to shoot much over 80 yards or thereabouts. That is if you can get them to shoot accurately.
1677871929034.jpeg
 
  • Like
Reactions: Doc C.
I am a fan of simple domed pellets. I've killed 44 squirrels with them so far. With my 32 fpe or higher guns, I rarely get one to stop in the squirrel, they usually go on through. The squirrel rarely does anything other than dropping on the spot. I don't think expansion is necessary. But at some point I will probably shoot a few squirrels with metal mags in my P35-22. It places them pretty well and I think they will expand some. But I am not anxious to make the switch because the domed H&N Baracuda Match are working so well. To me the biggest advantage of hollow point pellets is to reduce damage to buildings from pass throughs. Domed kill things just fine.

I've messed around with slugs some but I don't do much shooting at even 50 yards so I don't really see a need. But I will probably shoot some targets at 100 yards this year and may try slugs some for that. In my limited experience it is harder to find a slug your gun shoots well than it is to find a suitable pellet.
 
I've made the switch from pellets to slugs in my .22 Taipan Veteran with phenomenal success. Yes, domed pellets kill stuff when you hit them just right...but have you ever center punched a starling with a HP slug @ 900+ fps? POP!!

The FX Hybrids have proven to be absolute lasers @ 925 fps from my 700mm CZ Taipan barrel and compared to Hades pellets at roughly the same speed it's not even close past 40 meters on terminal performance and accuracy(due to wind).

The Hybrid's are only 22 grains but have over 30% higher BC than heavier JSB 25.39 grain pellets.

The biggest advantage that I've noticed since shooting the Hybrid's is that inside of 60 meters I don't have to worry about wind. Today we had a lot of wind with gusts up to 25 mph and I was shooting at 44 meters with less than a 1/2" drift if even that. I no longer worry about wind unless I'm shooting past 60 meters and it's blowing hard...
 
... I think I got a really bad batch of slugs, and then the absolute latest batch is better but still not what it used to be...

Tooling wear is the reason why some spend $5k on pellets/slugs from a single batch. Imagine Al at NOE swaging slugs with the same tooling for 2-3m pieces before having Corbin make him a new die set. Somewhere along the line, your gun REALLY liked the slugs but was it the first few thousand or midway through the tooling life?

When Crosman retooled a year or so back, I bought all the CPHP's I could afford as the CPHP's were shooting as well as JSB's at that point.
 
Tooling wear is the reason why some spend $5k on pellets/slugs from a single batch. Imagine Al at NOE swaging slugs with the same tooling for 2-3m pieces before having Corbin make him a new die set. Somewhere along the line, your gun REALLY liked the slugs but was it the first few thousand or midway through the tooling life?

When Crosman retooled a year or so back, I bought all the CPHP's I could afford as the CPHP's were shooting as well as JSB's at that point.

That one of the things that seems annoying about rimfire - you have to test all kinds of ammo and when you find a winner, immediately buy a pallet of that lot code. I figured that without the case/primer/powder variables, it would be easier to keep an airgun fed with ammo it liked. I do know FOR SURE this happened on my .30 with NSA 47gr. The initial box I bought for testing was great, then I ordered a bunch more and the new batch looked just slightly different in a few ways. No go on the new ones. With my .22 and these 20.2gr NSAs, they look identical, so any change would have to be fresh dies or something that should be very minor. I hope it doesn't turn out that it's common (from any manuf) to get very different results from the same slug purchased 6mo apart.

My biggest regret was not saving a box from my first order when everything was going well. If I had some of those original slugs to shoot now, it would confirm instantly whether this is an ammo or gun change. I will DEFINITELY be doing that going forward.