PART II...Is a .30 caliber airgun REALLY deadlier than a .25?

Hi everybody! This video is PART II of my examination of the deadliness of a .25 and .30 caliber airgun when set to the same energy level. I knew PART I would make some of you angry, and you did not disappoint. Perhaps PART II here will help to illustrate the difference between the two and ease your worried minds. The first link is to the written article. The thumbnail is to the video. As always, all comments are welcomed and appreciated.



CLICK HERE for the written article...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piomGOAFUiM


 
That’s some very revealing tests IMHO. Donnie , you are one effen funny guy. The argument your critics seem to be pushing is the 30 is deadlier , but that incorporates a correspondingly higher energy output. 25 cal average power 45-50 FPE whereas the 30 cal are going around 70-75 FPE. However, at EQUAL power output your statement can not be denied. With birds body shots , bigger , slower projectiles work better leaving more energy in the target whereas fur and skull shot , bigger animals require more penetration power. Well done. 
 
That’s some very revealing tests IMHO. Donnie , you are one effen funny guy. The argument your critics seem to be pushing is the 30 is deadlier , but that incorporates a correspondingly higher energy output. 25 cal average power 45-50 FPE whereas the 30 cal are going around 70-75 FPE. However, at EQUAL power output your statement can not be denied. With birds body shots , bigger , slower projectiles work better leaving more energy in the target whereas fur and skull shot , bigger animals require more penetration power. Well done.

RIght on!

The world is better with a little humor in it.

-Donnie
 
Always good to get field results!

Use case is important as is shot placement and ammo selection. Each will introduce variables that should be accounted for as best as possible. I find that dome .25s have plenty of energy dispersion, as well as decent penetration. So a very capable and well rounded caliber in my experience.

I agree.

I only use domed pellets for hunting because they're the most accurate projectiles I can find.

Shot placement, shot placement, SHOT PLACEMENT! LOLOL

-Donnie
 
That’s some very revealing tests IMHO. Donnie , you are one effen funny guy. The argument your critics seem to be pushing is the 30 is deadlier , but that incorporates a correspondingly higher energy output. 25 cal average power 45-50 FPE whereas the 30 cal are going around 70-75 FPE. However, at EQUAL power output your statement can not be denied. With birds body shots , bigger , slower projectiles work better leaving more energy in the target whereas fur and skull shot , bigger animals require more penetration power. Well done.

RIght on!

The world is better with a little humor in it.

-Donnie

Absofreakinlootly!!
 
I thought this was a really well done experiment. But candidly I really don’t see the point. One of the rifles has a short barrel, one of the rifles has a long barrel. They both produce the same amount of energy, of course the 25 is going to penetrate further, I think we could’ve saved a lot of time and a couple of pieces of pork, And a couple pieces of wood. Your outcome was extremely predictable.

As far as hunting is concerned. The first time I ever shot a raccoon in the head, I was 12 feet with from it, with a 28 ft.² pound 22 caliber Theoben shooting 18 grain JSB. I hit him right between the eyes dead on at 12 feet. He grumbled and crawled off the deck and walked away.

I knew I had enough rifle, so I did some anatomy checking. And found out that the front of the skull right above the eyes is like an armor plating. The next time I shot him from the side, May be a bit behind the ear. He dropped like he was hit with a ton of cement.

if I take a switch barrel Airgun, and put a 17 caliber barrel on it shooting 20 foot pounds, when I change to 22 caliber it will be approximately 30 foot pounds. There’s really no question that on any kind of a beast , which one is going to perform better on dispatching game. 

if you want to kill hogs with a 30 caliber by shooting them in the top of the skull, I would recommend over 100 foot pounds. Even with a pellet, I’m pretty darn sure it’s going to blast right through. You could test it out with your boards I guess. I know that with my eight year old unregulated Daystate wolverine, I’ve shot right through the body of raccoons that were 120 yards away. Big raccoons. Dead raccoons.

Again, it was a well-done experiment, not criticizing, I just don’t see the point.

Just FYI, I know I have owned at least a dozen 25 caliber airguns. I’ve only owned 4 30 caliber. I’ve done extensive testing shooting at ranges out 200 yards and beyond with both. And hunting.

30 caliber is going to perform way better with good shot placement on almost any big game. As long as you have appropriate foot pounds of power. Why would you degrade one with a shorter barrel?

If I had to choose between equal foot pounds 25, or 30, prior to your experiment, it would’ve been a no-brainer. The 25 is flatter, it’s going to be easier to hit what your shooting at, which means good shot placement. 

For the original shot placement from lesson one, you didn’t have enough rifle. With a properly placed headshot, not trying to hit the armor plating on top, either one of your rifles would’ve knocked a hog down at 50 yards like he was hit with a ton of dynamite 🧨 

my 10 cents

I would love to see the experiment redone with guns shooting the exact same amount of air, through similar barrel Lengths.

Not angry at all. I know you guys have access to more rifles than I do. Again, I just don’t understand the experiment.

Mike

My answer to your question above is, depends on how many foot pounds and at what speed you’re shooting each caliber rifle.




 
I have not hunt yet any animal that implies the sort of tissue that is contemplated in the video.

Normally you shoot to critter that has hair, skin, fat, an inch of meat/ribs, air, lungs/heart, and again air, meat/ribs, fat, skin and hair.

Not all the travel of the pellet has the same resistance.

If at the end it is real that the. 25 is equally lethal than the. 30 (doubt it, but shot placement is the key) what becomes really relevant is to get to know which one is the adequate pellet in. 25 Cal for shooting to coyotes and javalina for head shots and which one for chess shots. And which pellet is the best for wild turkey considering chest shots.

I have three times more. 25 Cal air rifles than. 30 Cal, so I do not have conflict to hunt with a. 25 Cal if the result would be ethically the same.

If the real world is that. 30 forgives more to get lethal results, then what is responsible is to use. 30 Cal if it is possible.

When hunting medium size animals, for many years I feel more confident if I have a. 30 on my hands. But as I said before, I have taken javalina, wild turkey an coyote with. 25 Cal also. 
 
Great video! Very informative and entertaining. You hit it out of the park with this one.



I for one, would like to know what the butcher went to after the .30 let him down.



Some years ago I did some experimenting with ultra slow (400 fps) loads in a shotgun where the only variable was the pellet size. At that velocity the smaller #8 pellets penetrated much better than the larger #4 pellets. At that velocity the #4 pellets would not penetrate a sheet of cardboard at 15 yards while the #8 pellets would.
 
Nice experiment, I too don't care which is deadlier and find the your demonstration eye opening.

However, in real life, we shoot at speeds where the pellets are most accurate so I would expect that in a practical sense there would be more FPE on any given larger caliber since it will have more mass impacting at similar velocities.

Secondly, would it be a more comprehensive test to compare wounds at a series of ranges in FPE to explore whether given calibers favor higher or lower relative values?

So, my view is that you did prove what is deadlier at that particular FPE value, but not necessarily that one caliber is deadlier than another hands down.

No offense or disrespect to your demonstration intended. It was well done and I enjoyed it.
 
Thank you all VERY much for your comments.

I'm glad to see that people are thinking about this.

Still, I must say to those telling me that a 44.75gr pellet going 843fps is "anemic" or "underpowered"....Ted Bier won some 100yd benchrest competitions using a .30 cal shooting the JSB 44.75gr pellets at 820fps average.

It's highly likely that someone who REALLY tests and tunes their gun for accuracy could be shooting a .30 at 843fps. 

This is also the reason that the .25 was shooting at 965fps.

The gun I used was my old (sold it to a friend) 100yd benchrest gun.

It's got the Slug A barrel in it (faster twist rate) and I experimented with high velocity assuming that I could add gyroscopic stabilization to the pellet, thus making it more accurate.

I was right.

I found that at 965fps, I could commonly get 1/4" groups at 100yd indoors.

Outdoors is a different story.

The wind is a bitch, and that's why I've switched to the .30 for 100yd benchrest.

Still, that also shows that someone who really tests and tunes their gun for accuracy (me in this case) could be shooting a .25 at 965fps.

I don't think my comparison is as far fetched as some of you believe.

-Donnie