Daystate New to Delta Wolf - Questions

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Huncowboy

Huncowboy

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Sep 5, 2021
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Lake Worth, Florida, United States
Hi,

Just got my hands on my new DW in .22 23" from AOA. They've also installed the latest software, and the (whatever it is called) new valve which is supposed to be more efficient. (Btw this is the USA model and setup.)

1. First thing first. I do not have a manual in the case. Is one not included? I was expecting a few hours of reading but no manual for me.

2. Next, I loaded the rifle up with some FX 18 gr and laters also some H&N predators 16 gr. I have noticed that every so often, after 6-8 shots, the rifle gently vibrates and will not shoot but the pellet is loaded. I am sure it is trying to tell me something. But basically I need to take the magazine out, and then it fires. I have also managed to load a pellet on top of another pellet twice now. I am wondering if I am doing something wrong, or is this specific rifle having feeding issues. I have only tried these two pellets. Any thoughts welcome.

Otherwise, the speed auto adjustment is really neat. 2-3 shots and I am dialed in. I only have 20 yards at home but that seams to be very accurate. My initial impression about the trigger, the way the factory settings is, is just very very light. I never had an electric trigger before but it is a bit weird.
 
Huncowboy said:
Hi,

Just got my hands on my new DW in .22 23" from AOA. They've also installed the latest software, and the (whatever it is called) new valve which is supposed to be more efficient. (Btw this is the USA model and setup.)

1. First thing first. I do not have a manual in the case. Is one not included? I was expecting a few hours of reading but no manual for me.

2. Next, I loaded the rifle up with some FX 18 gr and laters also some H&N predators 16 gr. I have noticed that every so often, after 6-8 shots, the rifle gently vibrates and will not shoot but the pellet is loaded. I am sure it is trying to tell me something. But basically I need to take the magazine out, and then it fires. I have also managed to load a pellet on top of another pellet twice now. I am wondering if I am doing something wrong, or is this specific rifle having feeding issues. I have only tried these two pellets. Any thoughts welcome.

Otherwise, the speed auto adjustment is really neat. 2-3 shots and I am dialed in. I only have 20 yards at home but that seams to be very accurate. My initial impression about the trigger, the way the factory settings is, is just very very light. I never had an electric trigger before but it is a bit weird.
Click to expand...
Download manual from Daystate website
The vibration is the mag counter go into settings and turn off magazine counter
Single load pellets until you read up on use
Handy to have a 4mm carbon rod 30” long to push pellets back out
 
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cavedweller said:
Download manual from Daystate website
The vibration is the mag counter go into settings and turn off magazine counter
Single load pellets until you read up on use
Handy to have a 4mm carbon rod 30” long to push pellets back out
Click to expand...
Thanks everybody for replying! I have watched a few videos from AOA before I got the rifle. I need to watch them again.

BTW I don't mind a PDF manual, I just wanted to make sure I am not missing a manual.

So the mag counter, when it thinks it is at empty it will vibrate the gun? I guess I am downloading the manual as soon as I get around to do it later today. I am sure this is explained there.

The other thing that was weird was that we shot a few 16gr HN Terminators at a steady 940 in factory mode (?) until we got the scope zeroed in. Then we refilled to 240 bars and waited for the evening for some backyard hunting. The rifle was sitting for 2 hours or so. We sat down, show one test shot to make sure we are good. It was dead center. I did not check the speed. Then about 2-3 hours later we had one opportunity for a single shot. It was a miss and it went at 814 fps. Hmmmm... That did not make me happy at all. The temperature was steady outside. I am not sure why that pellet went slower but it ended up being a miss for flying low. 940 vs 814 is a big difference.

EDIT:

link to the manual for the next guy who is looking for it:

 
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Huncowboy said:
Thanks everybody for replying! I have watched a few videos from AOA before I got the rifle. I need to watch them again.

BTW I don't mind a PDF manual, I just wanted to make sure I am not missing a manual.

So the mag counter, when it thinks it is at empty it will vibrate the gun? I guess I am downloading the manual as soon as I get around to do it later today. I am sure this is explained there.

The other thing that was weird was that we shot a few 16gr HN Terminators at a steady 940 in factory mode (?) until we got the scope zeroed in. Then we refilled to 240 bars and waited for the evening for some backyard hunting. The rifle was sitting for 2 hours or so. We sat down, show one test shot to make sure we are good. It was dead center. I did not check the speed. Then about 2-3 hours later we had one opportunity for a single shot. It was a miss and it went at 814 fps. Hmmmm... That did not make me happy at all. The temperature was steady outside. I am not sure why that pellet went slower but it ended up being a miss for flying low. 940 vs 814 is a big difference.

EDIT:

link to the manual for the next guy who is looking for it:

Click to expand...
My understanding is to use the Advanced setting for shot to shot consistency.
 
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Huncowboy said:
Thanks everybody for replying! I have watched a few videos from AOA before I got the rifle. I need to watch them again.

BTW I don't mind a PDF manual, I just wanted to make sure I am not missing a manual.

So the mag counter, when it thinks it is at empty it will vibrate the gun? I guess I am downloading the manual as soon as I get around to do it later today. I am sure this is explained there.

The other thing that was weird was that we shot a few 16gr HN Terminators at a steady 940 in factory mode (?) until we got the scope zeroed in. Then we refilled to 240 bars and waited for the evening for some backyard hunting. The rifle was sitting for 2 hours or so. We sat down, show one test shot to make sure we are good. It was dead center. I did not check the speed. Then about 2-3 hours later we had one opportunity for a single shot. It was a miss and it went at 814 fps. Hmmmm... That did not make me happy at all. The temperature was steady outside. I am not sure why that pellet went slower but it ended up being a miss for flying low. 940 vs 814 is a big difference.

EDIT:

link to the manual for the next guy who is looking for it:

Click to expand...
this is because the gun dumps it's last shot info when it powers down and when you take your next shot after rebooting it will take the new chrono info and adjust itself to get to the desired speed. sometimes this is 4-5 shots. That said, the advanced mode offers you a way to "set it and forget it" and the gun will perform better on the first shot.
This is one of the biggest complaints many Alpha and Delta Wolf owners have @SDstephan and @Centercut can jump in as can others.
 
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cavedweller said:
this is because the gun dumps it's last shot info when it powers down and when you take your next shot after rebooting it will take the new chrono info and adjust itself to get to the desired speed. sometimes this is 4-5 shots. That said, the advanced mode offers you a way to "set it and forget it" and the gun will perform better on the first shot.
This is one of the biggest complaints many Alpha and Delta Wolf owners have @SDstephan and @Centercut can jump in as can others.
Click to expand...
As @cavedweller says above, that USED TO BE the way the factory mode operated. However, with the latest two software upgrades, that is no longer the case. The gun retains its setting used at time of shutdown when powered back up.

I have gone over many times how to adjust (tune) your gun so that you have first shot accuracy numerous times here on AGN. Readers Digest version is to set the reg pressure about 5 bar higher than the LOWEST pressure that will give you the speed you desire at the setting you use (caliber, pellet weight, barrel length, etc.) in Factory Mode.

Once you do that you can reap the numerous benefits of the factory "auto speed" function, which let's be honest, is what the gun was designed for. If all you're going to do it set Advanced, then just buy a Red Wolf or a Ghost...
 
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Centercut said:
As @cavedweller says above, that USED TO BE the way the factory mode operated. However, with the latest two software upgrades, that is no longer the case. The gun retains its setting used at time of shutdown when powered back up.

I have gone over many times how to adjust (tune) your gun so that you have first shot accuracy numerous times here on AGN. Readers Digest version is to set the reg pressure about 5 bar higher than the LOWEST pressure that will give you the speed you desire at the setting you use (caliber, pellet weight, barrel length, etc.) in Factory Mode.

Once you do that you can reap the numerous benefits of the factory "auto speed" function, which let's be honest, is what the gun was designed for. If all you're going to do it set Advanced, then just buy a Red Wolf or a Ghost...
Click to expand...
Thanks! I am going to search for your posts. I am supposed to have the latest software per AOA. I just got around to read the manual. I don't think it mentioned how to check the version. Hmmm.... not a whole lot explained in there. They really could have done a better job with that. I guess I will need to comb through their YouTube channel that is linked.
 
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thanks @cavedweller for bringing this up again
thanks @Centercut for your answer - I know that I need to spend some time with the rifle that I just don't seem to have.

I know the rifle has accuracy in it, somewhere - just need to unlock it.
I will say that it is dead on at .25 cal, the .177 cal is what is lacking with my rifle.
 
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Huncowboy said:
Thanks! I am going to search for your posts. I am supposed to have the latest software per AOA. I just got around to read the manual. I don't think it mentioned how to check the version. Hmmm.... not a whole lot explained in there. They really could have done a better job with that. I guess I will need to comb through their YouTube channel that is linked.
Click to expand...
Let me know if you have questions after you find the recommended procedures for adjusting speed settings in Factory Mode. I don't think there are many that fully understand the MANY benefits of Factory Mode, and instead press the "easy button" and default to the Advanced Mode. Even very good competitors and factory personnel routinely recommend Advanced mode, saying its "better" and "more consistent". Again, that is if you press the Easy Button and don't take time to learn the gun.

Think about this situation. There are many I'm sure you could think of, but this is one of the numerous examples I have used. And this one is RECENT and APPLICABLE.

I ended up using Lauren P's gun at the December 2023 EFT GP event near Orlando Florida since I had problems with my Skout (those details are on other posts, and I won't hash that out here). Her gun is a .25 DW shooting .25 Heavy at 905 fps in Advanced Mode. On day 1, it was sunny and fairly warm and not that humid, and the gun shot consistently at that speed. So, the next morning on day 2, it was cloudy, cool, humid and overcast to start and her gun shot at about 880 fps. Had I used the gun without re-doing the dope, my long shots would have missed low. Had I (or she) been using Factory Mode, and her gun setup properly at 5 bar above the lowest reg pressure that would give her 905 fps, the gun would have shot 905 fps that second morning all by itself!!!

There are MANY other similar examples, hunting starting early with temps at 45 degrees and ending up over 80 degrees in the early afternoon. In Advanced, speed will most certainly change with that large a swing of temperature. But in Factory Mode, it will shoot at the speed you tell it regardless.

Anyway, I'll step off my soap box...
 
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Centercut said:
Let me know if you have questions after you find the recommended procedures for adjusting speed settings in Factory Mode. I don't think there are many that fully understand the MANY benefits of Factory Mode, and instead press the "easy button" and default to the Advanced Mode. Even very good competitors and factory personnel routinely recommend Advanced mode, saying its "better" and "more consistent". Again, that is if you press the Easy Button and don't take time to learn the gun.

Think about this situation. There are many I'm sure you could think of, but this is one of the numerous examples I have used. And this one is RECENT and APPLICABLE.

I ended up using Lauren P's gun at the December 2023 EFT GP event near Orlando Florida since I had problems with my Skout (those details are on other posts, and I won't hash that out here). Her gun is a .25 DW shooting .25 Heavy at 905 fps in Advanced Mode. On day 1, it was sunny and fairly warm and not that humid, and the gun shot consistently at that speed. So, the next morning on day 2, it was cloudy, cool, humid and overcast to start and her gun shot at about 880 fps. Had I used the gun without re-doing the dope, my long shots would have missed low. Had I (or she) been using Factory Mode, and her gun setup properly at 5 bar above the lowest reg pressure that would give her 905 fps, the gun would have shot 905 fps that second morning all by itself!!!

There are MANY other similar examples, hunting starting early with temps at 45 degrees and ending up over 80 degrees in the early afternoon. In Advanced, speed will most certainly change with that large a swing of temperature. But in Factory Mode, it will shoot at the speed you tell it regardless.

Anyway, I'll step off my soap box...
Click to expand...
This sounds very interesting. I am going to dive into this. Saturday is PCP day at my friends' house. He has a decent sized yard. We will be able to shoot up to 50-75 yards. I will report back.
 
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Centercut said:
As @cavedweller says above, that USED TO BE the way the factory mode operated. However, with the latest two software upgrades, that is no longer the case. The gun retains its setting used at time of shutdown when powered back up.

I have gone over many times how to adjust (tune) your gun so that you have first shot accuracy numerous times here on AGN. Readers Digest version is to set the reg pressure about 5 bar higher than the LOWEST pressure that will give you the speed you desire at the setting you use (caliber, pellet weight, barrel length, etc.) in Factory Mode.

Once you do that you can reap the numerous benefits of the factory "auto speed" function, which let's be honest, is what the gun was designed for. If all you're going to do it set Advanced, then just buy a Red Wolf or a Ghost...
Click to expand...
Thanks @Centercut - short and sweet... wish i was better at finding the nuts... a blind squirrel i am at times.
 
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And in more detail...

Background info:

The difference is with a Red Wolf, there is only a pressure sensor that works off bottle pressure and an algorithm that tells the gun control unit to shoot at whatever settings give the gun a power that you want. So, as the gun pressure goes down, the GCU will cause the solenoid (hammer) to hit the valve hard enough to give consistent power from 250 bar down to the pressure where it can no longer make that power. For my .25 RW HP with King Heavy pellets, that is about 170 bar.

For a DW/AW, in Advanced Mode, it is similar, except the regulator in the gun keeps the pressure in the plenum constant, so the gun functions similar to the RW, but reacts to the constant REG pressure vice the decreasing BOTTLE pressure.

For a DW/AW in Factory Mode, it does the same PLUS it uses the signal from the barrel's chronograph to input pellet Speed back into the equation. So, if the speed is set for 875 FPS, and the pellets goes at greater than 4 FPS higher or lower than set speed for two consecutive shots, the GCU will adjust the hammer strike (voltage and/or dwell) to lower/raise the speed towards the operator's set point.

Make sense? The gun retains those settings at the set speeds that the operator has used, so that the next time you select that speed it already knows what worked prior, and can set those parameters so the gun shoots at the set speed very quickly, usually on the first shot...

What is the big advantage to that you might ask? We don't always shoot at the same atmospheric conditions (temp, pressure, altitude). On a regular gun (Red Wolf, Impact, Cricket, Thomas, RAW, Taipan, FX, etc.), temperature or altitude will affect the speed at which the gun shoots. So, if you go out at 7am, and it’s 45 degrees, your gun might be shooting at 855 or 860 FPS and you zero your gun before you head out. Then as the day goes on and temp gets to 85 degrees and might be shooting at 880 or 885 FPS. Not within "minute of squirrel" at 100 yards. Also, you may have tuned and zero'd your gun at sea level, but later on taken it to shoot target or hunt at 4000 feet elevation. It will shoot at a different speed with a different POI there than at home.

With the DW/AW in Factory Mode, the gun will sense any speed changes and auto correct to your set speed as conditions change. Start at 45 degrees, or sea level, temp goes up or you change elevation, gun still shoots at set speed. The downside is that you'll no longer be able to blame the gun when you miss!

Tuning instructions:

Ok firstly at least for .30 and .25, use FACTORY mode. Set reg pressure higher, like 165 or 160 bar. I’m not sure if this method works with .22 because I haven’t used .22 much.

Decide which speed you want by trying various speeds until you find your most accurate with that ammo.
Now, once you know, lower reg pressure 10 bar. Now see if the gun will do your speed in 3 or 4 shots. If it does, lower 10 bar again. Try to get to your desired speed. Keep going until you get to a pressure that your gun won’t come up to speed.
Now raise pressure 5 bar and try to get to your speed. If it does, you’ve found your pressure. If it doesn’t quickly in no more than 3 or 4 shots, raise it 5 bar again. That’s your new pressure. On my gun that is 135 bar in .30 caliber for 86 FPE.

Make sense?
I recommend using factory mode with this “lowest functional” pressure.
 
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Centercut said:
And in more detail...

Background info:

The difference is with a Red Wolf, there is only a pressure sensor that works off bottle pressure and an algorithm that tells the gun control unit to shoot at whatever settings give the gun a power that you want. So, as the gun pressure goes down, the GCU will cause the solenoid (hammer) to hit the valve hard enough to give consistent power from 250 bar down to the pressure where it can no longer make that power. For my .25 RW HP with King Heavy pellets, that is about 170 bar.

For a DW/AW, in Advanced Mode, it is similar, except the regulator in the gun keeps the pressure in the plenum constant, so the gun functions similar to the RW, but reacts to the constant REG pressure vice the decreasing BOTTLE pressure.

For a DW/AW in Factory Mode, it does the same PLUS it uses the signal from the barrel's chronograph to input pellet Speed back into the equation. So, if the speed is set for 875 FPS, and the pellets goes at greater than 4 FPS higher or lower than set speed for two consecutive shots, the GCU will adjust the hammer strike (voltage and/or dwell) to lower/raise the speed towards the operator's set point.

Make sense? The gun retains those settings at the set speeds that the operator has used, so that the next time you select that speed it already knows what worked prior, and can set those parameters so the gun shoots at the set speed very quickly, usually on the first shot...

What is the big advantage to that you might ask? We don't always shoot at the same atmospheric conditions (temp, pressure, altitude). On a regular gun (Red Wolf, Impact, Cricket, Thomas, RAW, Taipan, etc.), temperature or altitude will affect the speed at which the gun shoots. So, if you go out at 7am, and its 45 degrees, your gun might be shooting at 855 or 860 FPS and you zero your gun before you head out. Then as the day goes on and temp gets to 85 degrees and might be shooting at 880 or 885 FPS. Not within "minute of squirrel" at 100 yards. Also, you may have tuned and zero'd your gun at sea level, but later on taken it to shoot target or hunt at 4000 feet elevation. It will shoot at a different speed with a different POI there than at home.

With the DW/AW in Factory Mode, the gun will sense any speed changes and auto correct to your set speed as conditions change. Start at 45 degrees, or sea level, temp goes up or you change elevation, gun still shoots at set speed. The downside is that you'll no longer be able to blame the gun when you miss!

Tuning instructions:

Ok firstly at least for .30 and .25, use FACTORY mode. Set reg pressure higher, like 165 or 160 bar. I’m not sure if this method works with .22 because I haven’t used .22 much.

Decide which speed you want. Try various speeds until you find you’re most accurate with that ammo.
Now, once you know, lower reg pressure 10 bar. Now see if the gun will do your speed in 3 or 4 shots. If it does, lower 10 bar again. Try to get to your desired speed. Keep going until you get to a pressure that your gun won’t come up to speed.
Now raise pressure 5 bar and try to get to your speed. If it does, you’ve found your pressure. If it doesn’t quickly in no more than 3 or 4 shots, raise it 5 bar again. That’s your new pressure. On my gun that is 135 bar in .30 caliber for 86 FPE.

Make sense?
I recommend using factory mode with this “lowest functional” pressure.
Click to expand...
With info like this i might be tempted to try 1 of these guns. In your opinion which does the best at keeping a consistent first shot? Alpha or delta?
 
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