New slugs ATP King .22 40gr and .25 slugs for Huben and Leshiy

[Altaros]

When have you seen Nielsen ammo come to this forum n try to dumb us with his slugs..making claims of what they do or don't do, we buy them because the work in some of our guns n those who not work .. they work in other members guns.. and I say dumb us because how many members have 800y + to use.. they are trying to sell a 1000y slugs with the most horrible recorded video on you tube. Every one that tries to make slugs now are experts in ballistics n twist rate.. the older you get in this hobby the harder it it to sell me Dreams.. go out there make real groups at 200 n 300 n 400y with good camera equipment.. don't tell me you can't because if some non sponsored you tubers could do them I'm sure altaros could bump his game up on the recording arena.. n stop making those crapy video's..

Yes, I think I can say that I am an expert on ballistics in this regard. I've read a number of Brian Litz's ballistics books, watched and listened to most of his podcasts. I read other books by other authors and, of course, other educational videos on YouTube, but mainly I verified everything in practice. I have more than 400 records of measurements of various slugs through LabRadar for for BC measurement, where each one has at least 10 shots, but mostly around 20, 25. I have made and tested more than 40 types of slugs of different shapes and sizes.
I clearly saw how a 20mm long slug fired with insufficient twist even at 30m hit the paper directly on the flat, because according to the calculations it could not be stabilized.

I tested slugs from 30 to 1500m and I saw how some are simply not able to cross the border by a certain distance.
So yes, I consider myself an expert, and I'd love to hear your reasons why I shouldn't consider myself an expert and who do you think is the bigger expert in airgun ballistics?

crapy video's : show me better videos at maybe 500yards than mine. I've been using the Nikon P1000 superzoom for over 2 years, which is the most expensive and best superzoom on the market, and no better one has come out yet. I recently bought a TriggerCam, as the old Side-Shots are no longer sufficient.
This video has a bad image? If so show me a better one!

Videos at 1000m are already very difficult to film, as the conditions must be suitable. In addition, the scope on which the MoaBooster is installed deteriorates the image quality, since it is another optical device.
On the new Arken optics, the quality is already significantly better even if the MoaBooster is used, see my video in the first post on 700 yards. You see the target, you see the hits, you see whatever else on earth you want to see, tell me
If the slug works at long distances, it works at all lower distances, but it doesn't work the other way around, that's why I always show the hardest conditions.

 

[mercado]

Yea what ever.. put the dam things on us soil to be tested instead of being on this fourum taking bull %$×@#% .. this is not Europe people here are shooting slugs way before you appear in this seen... this and your othe post about the gun are ridiculous..you understand ridiculous send the guns to us cut the crap n we will see those 1000y shots .. any of the new hp guns on the market with the proper scope mount coud hit something pretty far but not necessarily is a moa gun .. this is not a child fourum this Is A
a fourum with old guys that shaves.. we test the products n see this is not church I don't have to believe only because you say it... you think you been so arrogant about something that we in us have only the worst videos recorded..we are going to be interested in buying anything from altaros.. me personally I wouldn't buy a nail for you or your company..being like this will make you stay a small company...not even the owner of FX will dare .. to make claims about his products.. users hipe the products themselves..because they work for them n they being tested over n over .. not because he goes on the fourum bragging about untested items.

 

[coffeepan]

So shooting with airguns, shooting with slugs and making videos is somehow the job of beginners and men without beards in the rest of the world?
Only You and Your fellow-countrymen can do it?
Alright. It's your opinion and you're entitled to it..
I'm out of this discussion nothing useful just bashing others....

 

[Airfuture]

I don't understand your harsh words, Altaros has its recognized dignity and quality, I only admit bad marketing. But sometimes you need to get a slap to wake up...

 

[Deleted 45061]

I will test the slugs regardless but if you are claiming reliable accuracy at 700yrds+ or even 400 then I have a car to sell you. I'll see the 50yrd accuracy and from that judge if it can make it to 75 and 100yrd.

 

[Silvio]

Hello, I don't understand why the snails of Altaros are being badmouthed here. If you don't believe it, just try it. Of course, the difference to others cannot be seen at 100 meters, since all are fairly accurate here. But anything that goes over 100 meters is when you see the benefit of the Altaros projectiles

 

[Deleted 45061]

Hello, I don't understand why the snails of Altaros are being badmouthed here. If you don't believe it, just try it. Of course, the difference to others cannot be seen at 100 meters, since all are fairly accurate here. But anything that goes over 100 meters is when you see the benefit of the Altaros projectiles

I am not badmouthing them, and I said I will buy them and test them. I do stand by my statement that reliable accuracy at 700yrds is not a thing for any slug out there coming from an airgun, even 400 yards for that matter, exempting Big Bore of course.

To get accuracy at greater distances, a 40gr will frankly be too light. The best accuracy I've seen has usually been in the .257 diameter out of custom airguns, and no those airguns could not hit MOA at the distances above, and especially minute of squirrel in real life conditions.

 

[Altaros]

to meracdo
yes, I'm only 37.5 years old and I've been doing this job full-time already while studying at university, then completion of university for the next 8 years practically 12 hours a day, 7 days a week (I test on the weekend), but yes, I can't be more competent in this industry than you or anyone else.

I don't need to rush to the US with oure airguns, we have enough customers on the M24 from the rest of the world. Yes, the US is the biggest market for guns, but Europe rules the airgun industry.
if you personally think that your insulting me and my company will somehow speed me up in trying to get M24 rifles to the US, then you are very mistaken. I don't do my job to make the company as big as possible and make the most money, but because it is my life's goal to bring airguns closer to the accuracy of firearms (for myself not primarily for customers, ) the customer is actually just benefiting from my efforts because if they were just doing it for the money then I would never work as hard as I do and get the results I do.
My goal is definitely not about supplying rifles and other products to someone like you, so I really don't mind if you never buy anything from our company. If a any customer doesn't want a product from us because don't believe of its technological superiority, then I'm not going to sell it to them with some fraudulent advertising, there are other brands for that.

Just so I don't mess around like meracdo, I'm adding a photo of my "lead trash can" and this is only the top layer, it is already quite high and heavy.

and coincidentally, I received a link to a video for 900 yards shoting from our customer who uses ATP Smooth .25 slugs in Vulcan 3
I know the video isn't important because it's not from a godly US boys but from an ordinary European.
( I hereby apologize to the rest of the population of the USA and the other 5 continents, but someone has to explain to meracdo and his ilk that for other states and their residents, the US is really not in the first place )

 

[Altaros]

I am not badmouthing them, and I said I will buy them and test them. I do stand by my statement that reliable accuracy at 700yrds is not a thing for any slug out there coming from an airgun, even 400 yards for that matter, exempting Big Bore of course.

To get accuracy at greater distances, a 40gr will frankly be too light. The best accuracy I've seen has usually been in the .257 diameter out of custom airguns, and no those airguns could not hit MOA at the distances above, and especially minute of squirrel in real life conditions.

but this is what I never said that our rifle with our ammo is 1MOA the entire range of the rifle. I always provide technical data, and according to them, if you have the right software, such as an appliet ballistic analyst, you can determine with what probability you can successfully hit a specific target, at a specific distance with specific changes.
In some videos, I clearly show specific extreme cases where you are generally just betting against statistics, which, for example, tell you that the chance of hitting is 1/10 and the chance of hitting again is much smaller.
In other videos, like the one in the previus post, you have 17 shots in a row and you can clearly see the statistical accuracy, given the conditions and the shooter's ability to read the wind. After entering the data into the appliet balistik analytic, I got a very similar hit probability to what was actually on the video.
If there was a significantly more variable wind that I couldn't read, the % success would be much less, but that doesn't mean that in good conditions this particular setup isn't capable of that accuracy.

here in the attachment I am sending measurements from LabRadar just after the shooting. At the time, the entire system showed extremely good muzzle velocity consistency, and that is essential at this distance:



as Silvio writes, at 100 yards, if there is no wind, you will know the minimal difference. At 200m already quite essential. At longer distances (400-500-600m) it will make a huge difference

View attachment SR0116-6.35 ATP smooth.zip

 

[Deleted 45061]

but this is what I never said that our rifle with our ammo is 1MOA the entire range of the rifle. I always provide technical data, and according to them, if you have the right software, such as an appliet ballistic analyst, you can determine with what probability you can successfully hit a specific target, at a specific distance with specific changes.
In some videos, I clearly show specific extreme cases where you are generally just betting against statistics, which, for example, tell you that the chance of hitting is 1/10 and the chance of hitting again is much smaller.
In other videos, like the one in the previus post, you have 17 shots in a row and you can clearly see the statistical accuracy, given the conditions and the shooter's ability to read the wind. After entering the data into the appliet balistik analytic, I got a very similar hit probability to what was actually on the video.
If there was a significantly more variable wind that I couldn't read, the % success would be much less, but that doesn't mean that in good conditions this particular setup isn't capable of that accuracy.

here in the attachment I am sending measurements from LabRadar just after the shooting. At the time, the entire system showed extremely good muzzle velocity consistency, and that is essential at this distance:



as Silvio writes, at 100 yards, if there is no wind, you will know the minimal difference. At 200m already quite essential. At longer distances (400-500-600m) it will make a huge difference

View attachment 305516

Thank you for the reply. That is all well and good. I will shoot some cards at 50 yards, 75, and 100 yards and do a side by side comparison with other slugs and maybe some pellets too to show their effectiveness.

 

[mtnGhost]

It would be great if you offered UPS or FedEx shipping options for international shipments. My package got beat up in the 7-8 weeks that it was in transit.

 

[steve123]

Altaros, after seeing your lead scrap pile, and knowing you use a lathe to make slugs, it occurred to me that experimenting with slugs like you have done by using a wide variety of shapes, weights, and diameters would definitely help in finding the optimal combinations to work best for long range.

Man, using a lake like they did in the video sure does help seeing exactly where the impacts land.

Wow, you have a ton of energy and ambition going to University along with starting your own Company and all the work involved in development, etc!

 

[Deleted 45061]

Well we shot these today ... out of a Prophet tuned for HP and a low power AGT Uragan Compact (also custom tuned). We also shot with the same airguns the Zan, Knock Out JSBs, and the Daystate Howlers. I'll post a vid up when I get to it.

 

[Silvio]

Very good. I will also do the test and put it in so you also have a comparison of at least 2 shooters

 

[Airfuture]

Well we shot these today ... out of a Prophet tuned for HP and a low power AGT Uragan Compact (also custom tuned). We also shot with the same airguns the Zan, Knock Out JSBs, and the Daystate Howlers. I'll post a vid up when I get to it.
View attachment 306141

Before the test, see Altaros tips on speeds and barrel cleanliness.

Altaros M24

Altaros M24 .25 - Magazine version

www.altaros.cz

 

[Deleted 45061]

Before the test, see Altaros tips on speeds and barrel cleanliness.

Altaros M24

Altaros M24 .25 - Magazine version

www.altaros.cz

Lol not doing that ...I never white coat stuff and never do my shooting friends. I filmed, they shot, and the results will be published. I like real world results. But being that @intenseaty22 Prophet just went to EBR, I am pretty sure the barrel was cleaner than most. We didn't test the above slugs but a different set by Alteros, the 31gr:

 

[Silvio]

Hey, here is a short video until the comparison video is finished

 

[Removed]

Hey, here is a short video until the comparison video is finished

Very impressed with that shooting, wow the tomatoes. I wouldn't ever be able to hit a little spinner like that at such close ranges. The speed those slugs get out to 60 yards is incredible, what's it take to become a superstar?

 

[Silvio]

Very impressed with that shooting, wow the tomatoes. I wouldn't ever be able to hit a little spinner like that at such close ranges. The speed those slugs get out to 60 yards is incredible, what's it take to become a superstar?

how do you get to 60 yards?

 

[Altaros]

Lol not doing that ...I never white coat stuff and never do my shooting friends. I filmed, they shot, and the results will be published. I like real world results. But being that @intenseaty22 Prophet just went to EBR, I am pretty sure the barrel was cleaner than most. We didn't test the above slugs but a different set by Alteros, the 31gr:
View attachment 306388

considering that I am on a family vacation abroad for the first time after 5 years since the birth of my daughter, so until I return, I will not get bogged down in a deeper discussion and will only tell the facts.
1) I would like to know from whom the used ATP slugs were obtained, because according to the old label and the text label alone, it is a production from 2020 9 months, i.e. more than 2 years old, and at the same time it is a test package, which is already more like a year he doesn't sell.
The reason why I say this is that this package contains slug sizes of 50 each, size 5.48, 5.49 and 5.50 mm.
The Prophet rifle uses a LW barrel, which according to the manufacturer has a tolerance of +- 0.02mm on the inner diameter. If 5.48 and 5.49mm slugs are inserted into this barrel, which will have a larger inner diameter (still within tolerance), simply the wrong slug size, then exactly this will happen. Slugs will whistle in flight as they won't rotate at all due to breaking out of the grooves.
It is necessary to use the correct slugs for the barrel, both in terms of maximum and minimum sizet. This is not my excuse or fabrication but a simple fact who knows experienced airgun shooters with slugs, :

The size of slugs 5.48 was functional for only one rifle we owned, the original Vulca with a CZ barrel, with other rifles, including the M24, when using 5.48mm, the described effect occurred and we cannot talk about accuracy at all, which does not mean that they do not work in the correct size of the barre.


in this case, it doesn't matter how the test was performed, because slugs with the wrong diameter were used. It is one of the reasons why we no longer sell slugs smaller than 5.50, since most barrels (not all) start at a suitable slug diameter of 5.50 and larger diameter. For those few customers for whom a smaller slug diameter would be more accurate, it makes no sense to risk using 5.48 slugs in an unsuitable barrel. These customers can use this larger slug with the difference in accuracy being small, but it doesn't work the other way around as the aforementioned video from AtlasAirgun shows.
But what is a colossal nonsense is the way the test was carried out,
For testing when trying to find maximum accuracy, it is essential to have a cleaned barrel and shoot at least 20-30 slugs of the same type, brand and diameter (simply from the same package or batch).
Every benchrest firearms shooter and even experienced airgunerst, such as Tofazu or RusBear, know this information and you can find it on their YouTube channel.
if I use the threading again so it's like testing a new tire, but instead of the clearly indicated pressure to which the tire should be fill, I fill it a low or a to high and then I'm surprised that it doesn't work optimally.
it is inappropriate to test new slugs on precision without cleaning the barrel, but even more nonsense is to always put one type of slug in the magazine and then another type next to the other and nonsense about laboratory conditions will not change that fact.