Name all the possible tunes that you could do to make a springer better.

[AirShot]

No need to spend a hundred to tune a springer, most of mine have all std factory parts, my TX for example is all stock, just taken apart, polished, removed burrs, cleaned and properly lubed. Will put it up against any kit tuned TX out there. Last time over the chrono was avg 900 fps, extreme spread was 8, std dev was 3 all with AA 8.4 gn pellets with beeswax lube. Have numerous targets with sub one inch groups at 75 yds on nice days. Aftermarket kits can be made even better but not always needed. I spend about the same amount of time or more reloading for my firearms. The best part about my airguns is I dont have to spend all that time cleaning when I am done shooting them. Over all....much less time on air guns than firearms even with all the tuning !!!

 

[thumper]

Well yeah, they are two totally different things. 
An airgun uses a totally dead projectile. The gun and its workings provides all the motivation for the projectile to get where it's going. All the energy comes from the gun. 

A firearm uses the powder in the cartridge to do all the motivating of the projectile. All the gun has to do is ding the firing pin and the cartridge does the rest. That's it. 

I guess you've never seen firearm guys reloading ammo or shotshells? Why do that when they come ready to shoot out of a box from the store? What idiots would waste time making their own loads right?

You almost sound personally offended we have different opinions. Don't be, really doesn't matter.

WTF does the ammo and reloading have to do w/tuning a springer? The former I get.

Spending another $100 on a $500 airgun to somehow "make it better" I don't. Especially if it has little if any effect on the accuracy of what should be a fine shooter out of the box. 

Next time you reply, just because I have question, don't treat me as stupid. I'd run circles around you boy.

I thought my reply was pretty clear explaining the difference between two things that you compared as similar? Maybe not. That's okay. 

I'm not offended by your opinion, or your ignorance, or your lack of self control. If I was, that would have happened on your earlier threads. Nothing new here. 

Concerning running those circles, I'd venture to say that you couldn't even beat your meat.

Merry Christmas! 

 

[bberg7794]

Wow, this thread went to a dark place.

 

[Arnie]

Wow, this thread went to a dark place.

Hahaha lol…very much so unexpected.

 

[Maizen]

Well yeah, they are two totally different things. 
An airgun uses a totally dead projectile. The gun and its workings provides all the motivation for the projectile to get where it's going. All the energy comes from the gun. 

A firearm uses the powder in the cartridge to do all the motivating of the projectile. All the gun has to do is ding the firing pin and the cartridge does the rest. That's it. 

I guess you've never seen firearm guys reloading ammo or shotshells? Why do that when they come ready to shoot out of a box from the store? What idiots would waste time making their own loads right?

You almost sound personally offended we have different opinions. Don't be, really doesn't matter.

WTF does the ammo and reloading have to do w/tuning a springer? The former I get.

Spending another $100 on a $500 airgun to somehow "make it better" I don't. Especially if it has little if any effect on the accuracy of what should be a fine shooter out of the box. 

Next time you reply, just because I have question, don't treat me as stupid. I'd run circles around you boy.

But see the case here is that it does help though!!! As I said in the aforementioned reply (check it out if you haven’t)…it does make a difference as long as you tune what needs to be tuned. Bringing up the firearm analogy as a way to substantiate a reason to not tune an Airgun doesn’t make sense to me; they are inherently different. 


The problem I have is with this rhetorical question you made; “Or are we fooling ourselves with our tuned guns that might feel better, but really don't shoot any better than when they came out the box?” Trust me…if you shoot a tuned HW95 v. an untuned one…you will FEEEL the difference and see the greater consistency down range. My TX200 didn’t shoot at a 2 FPS spread when I first got it. It was only when I threw a modified V-Mach kit in there that it did…and boy I felt the difference and saw the difference down range too.

Yeah it’s not everyone’s cup of tea. However, it does make a difference. 

 

[Maizen]

I've owned dozens of firearms and airguns. If not well over 100 in the past decade.

Firearms instructor and national level NRA airgun coach, I've not seen the fanatic need to tune powder-burners as I have with airguns.

Sounds more like another hobby than a real need.

If a person spends any time on PB forums like Rimfire Central, like I do, they will find an amazing number of posts where someone is looking to purchase or has purchased a decent or high end rifle, and they start a thread, "What barrel, trigger, chassis, improvements should I make to my new ________________." It has always amazed me how many folks over there seem to assume that their brand new Anzchutz, CZ, Tikka, etc. is going to come with a sub-par barrel. There are copious numbers of posts about trigger tuning and bedding a stock, or installing a chassis, torquing action screws, installing and tweaking a barrel tuner. I find many similar threads in a couple of high power forums I visit too. Similar arguments there about a manufacturer being unable to take the time required to get the most out of every individual rifle that leaves the production line.

Regarding it sounding more like another hobby than a real need, I tend to agree. If I had to bet, I believe most folks who begin these threads worrying about the finest levels of accuracy have not sent multiple thousands of rounds downrange nor spent years perfecting their marksmanship skills.

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“If I had to bet, I believe most folks who begin these threads worrying about the finest levels of accuracy have not sent multiple thousands of rounds downrange nor spent years perfecting their marksmanship skills.”

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THAT’S because it’s inefficient to do so! Take a scenario where you have everything (your ammunition type, how each ammo type behaves, all factors involving long range shooting, B.C., wind, etc.) calculated to the dot and know how to do everything…why waste your ammunition? It’s inefficient and a waste UNLESS of course you’re just out there to have some fun. 


What I’m trying to say is that the folks who worry about “finest levels of accuracy” do so in order to be efficient. Why hit the nail on the head 4 times when you can knock it out in 2 with a certain technique and a more efficiently designed hammer???

 

[bberg7794]

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THAT’S because it’s inefficient to do so! Take a scenario where you have everything (your ammunition type, how each ammo type behaves, all factors involving long range shooting, B.C., wind, etc.) calculated to the dot and know how to do everything…why waste your ammunition? It’s inefficient and a waste UNLESS of course you’re just out there to have some fun. 


What I’m trying to say is that the folks who worry about “finest levels of accuracy” do so in order to be efficient. Why hit the nail on the head 4 times when you can knock it out in 2 with a certain technique and a more efficiently designed hammer???

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With PB rifles, often the shooter is the limiting factor. If the rifle will already outperform the shooter as it comes from the factory, then it would be inefficient and expensive to replace a barrel, add a tuner, and have the stock professionally bedded vs. shooting the rifle a bunch to improve one's skills.

I have been shooting for 49 years now, but only began formal rifle competition 13 years ago. I have attended formal matches in 3 and 4 position smallbore, 50/100 yard prone smallbore, and 10 meter standing air rifle. I have shot CMP high power and smallbore silhouette for fun. All of these events take a lot of practice and are a perishable skill. If a person begins with a suitable rifle for these events, likely the rifle will outperform the shooter by a factor of 2 for a long time, so the shooter is best served in practicing their craft instead of focusing on modifying their equipment, at least until a high level of proficiency is attained.

Pardon the thread drift:

Regarding springer tuning: I am new to springers and bought my first one in April of this year. The advice I followed was from a world-class field target competitor who posts here occasionally. He recommended that before shooting a new springer, one should disassemble it and remove all excess grease inside the compression chamber to prevent dieseling, which can damage the seals. This made sense to me. I'm all for tuning your springer. I have a custom trigger that I have yet to install. Where I work, I have a lathe so I imagine I will be turning an acetal spring guide. The next time I disassemble my rifle, it will receive the trigger and spring guide, and who knows from there?