Maximum distance for accurate pellet shooting.

[Caliber 22]

Played with some numbers, and based on one e ballistics app, and quite a few assumptions, that 18gr pellet would still have around 12fpe @ 150-160yards. (Assuming BC of about 0.033-0.035 and muzzle speed of 900fps).

I saw that you added this with a edit on your post.

Those H&N 18 pellets left the barrel at 940-950fps, confirmed with a second chronograph. The only way I could get Strelok to match the amount I dialed on the scope was with a BC of 0.055, and then refined to multi-BC starting with 0.062 and going down to .045 at lower speeds further away. This was confirmed over and over again so I believe it to be ballpark accurate.

Miles here above know much better than most here on AGN how ballistics work as it was his full-time job. Myself, I am getting a better understanding by reading his and other's input but I can still not explain in technical terms what is going on. My better understanding of aeroplane aerodynamics is not of much help but seems to be rather a hindrance to better understanding of pellet ballistics. All I know is what I see on target compared by my inputs.

 

[Caliber 22]

would still have around 12fpe @ 150-160yards.

I forgot to say, with the numbers I used in Strelok it says that the retained energy at 144 meter is 18fpe at 660fps. I would like to test this with the chronograph at that distance but then I will have to make a dedicated stand with metal shield to protect the chronograph from being destroyed.

 

[Franklink]

I saw that you added this with a edit on your post.

Those H&N 18 pellets left the barrel at 940-950fps, confirmed with a second chronograph. The only way I could get Strelok to match the amount I dialed on the scope was with a BC of 0.055, and then refined to multi-BC starting with 0.062 and going down to .045 at lower speeds further away. This was confirmed over and over again so I believe it to be ballpark accurate.

Miles here above know much better than most here on AGN how ballistics work as it was his full-time job. Myself, I am getting a better understanding by reading his and other's input but I can still not explain in technical terms what is going on. My better understanding of aeroplane aerodynamics is not of much help but seems to be rather a hindrance to better understanding of pellet ballistics. All I know is what I see on target compared by my inputs.

Very good. Your starting speed is faster than I assumed, and your BC is also better than I would expect from that pellet. With that data, you'd have even more fpe left at impact than I estimated.

In my testing, .22/18.13 JSBs are usually in the 0.035-0.038 range, although I've seen a few comment that their actual matches ballistic app predicted with higher....seems like I saw 0.045 cited by somebody. And generally H&N BCs are slightly lower than JSB. That was my rational for the BC guestimate.

In the pellet category, to get a BC as high as 0.062 we're usually needing the .25/34 or the .22/25.4 from some choice barrel combinations. I suspect the Grands are around there too, based on anecdotal personal experiences with them comparing to how they perform against .22/25.4 MRDs out of barrels where I have collected the BCs.

It's really surprising to find that there's only a handful of pellets that consistently produce BCs over about 0.045. And those are the pellets that you'll find being used to win Ultimate Field Target matches and EBR and RMAC and PA Cup.

Regardless, BCs are somewhat of a moving target....lots of variables like elevation and rifling profile and dependance on speed, etc. In theory the BCs shouldn't float around as much as they do for a given pellet shape/size, but in reality they simply do.

In conclusion, your 157yard pellet groups are great.

 

[Dairyboy]

These were my results with a few .22 pellets last year out of my Evol Mini. Id assume the heavy ones were lower due to the lower fps from the start. Byt ive been very happy with the JTS 18gr.

 

[Altaros]

I don't want to start any flames, but BC pellets, the standard ones in .22 caliber, since pellets in 7.62mm or 9mm no longer fulfill any of what we said in the form of the advantage of pellets vs slug, so these standard pellets ones have a BC of around 0.04. I have long-term tested JSB 18.1grain and measured at 0.041, measured by LabRader, tested from 30 to 205m and shot sat at all distances, verified by tens of thousands of shots.
These pellets, although they can sometimes shoot beautiful results, cannot consistently achieve 1 MOA or 1.5 MOA accuracy at 150 yards. Again, it is physically impossible unless you are an accomplished wind wizard who can detect wind direction and speed better than 1 km/h.
This is physics, not bedtime stories.
Each of you can enter a wind from 3-9h and 1km/h in a ballistic calculator and you will see how much will it show you the deviation.
This is the physical reality with which it is necessary to learn to live and count with it, otherwise you will continue to live in illusions of the impossible and you will try to achieve something that cannot be achieved.
(for exception seekers: you get the same result even if you put BC G1 0.61 )

And to try to drag it back to the original topic again, pellets are not hitting a wall at 100yards, beyond which they're no longer a viable option. There ARE pellets possible of hitting the killing half of a prairie dog out to 200yards with surprising success rates. (Again, a kill zone of about 5-6 inches long by about 2 inches wide).

and can you state what these PELLETS are? Aren't they more like slugs-bullets? because I don't know any pellets that are capable of this, unless we are talking, as above, about calibers above .25 caliber.

As for the rest. So carrying an air bottle is just like carrying cartridges along with bullets. The bullet will not fly out of the barrel by itself either.
It again it's a point of view. I take it from the point of view of maximum accuracy, not hunting pests, and for my type of shooting, people normally carry 10-20 kg heavy front rests to the shooting range, for example from SEB for a few thousand USD. For this type of shooting, some extra 5-7kg bottle is practically negligible equipment.

I don't want to take away your perspective. If I were to hunt prairie dogs from the car in an occasional encounter, then the .22LR would probably be a better choice, but that does not mean that for other types of shooting, the .22LR is still a better choice than a beige airgun.

 

[Franklink]

and can you state what these PELLETS are? Aren't they more like slugs-bullets? because I don't know any pellets that are capable of this, unless we are talking, as above, about calibers above .25 caliber.

Post # 32 earlier in this discussion. Pretty traditional pellet shape.

I'm not the only one stretching the. 20/15.89 so far.

The long range capability of the .20/15.89 has been witnessed by others, not just me living in "bedtime stories."

To clarify for the third time, I'm not getting benchrest accuracy from them, but I can connect on the killing half of a pdog @ 175+ yards surprisingly often. Or a Euro dove, or a starling (maybe move in a bit for the smaller starlings , 150ish)

Nowhere am I saying that these .20/15.89s are gonna outshoot the Altaros slugs with their BCs 4x as high. Simply stating that pellets ARE a viable option for long range pesting of typical airgun quarry, it just takes the right combination of barrel/pellet/speed.

This narrative that pellets are worthless past 100yards is simply false, evidenced by lots of long range pellet-taken pdogs last summer. And every other summer prior to that for the last 8-10years.

 

[Caliber 22]

I did not intent this thread to be a pellet vs slug comparison, but about pellets for those of us choosing to use pellets.
This is what I posted in the 1st post of this thread:

"What is the maximum distance you shoot pellets and get good accuracy?
Personally I am not interested in shooting slugs. I know all the benefits thereof but it is not my thing.
Most shooters change over to slugs at long distance so I cannot get good info by searching."

 

[Franklink]

I did not intent this thread to be a pellet vs slug comparison, but about pellets for those of us choosing to use pellets.
This is what I posted in the 1st post of this thread:

"What is the maximum distance you shoot pellets and get good accuracy?
Personally I am not interested in shooting slugs. I know all the benefits thereof but it is not my thing.
Most shooters change over to slugs at long distance so I cannot get good info by searching."

Yeah buddy, I feel ya.

I've tried to bring it back to pellets more times than I can remember this late at night. Certain contingent keeps piping in, almost like they're selling slugs or something, and they don't want anybody to realize pellets can still be quite accurate at long range too.

 

[Altaros]

Post # 32 earlier in this discussion. Pretty traditional pellet shape.

I'm not the only one stretching the. 20/15.89 so far.

The long range capability of the .20/15.89 has been witnessed by others, not just me living in "bedtime stories."

To clarify for the third time, I'm not getting benchrest accuracy from them, but I can connect on the killing half of a pdog @ 175+ yards surprisingly often. Or a Euro dove, or a starling (maybe move in a bit for the smaller starlings , 150ish)

Here I would like to apologize to you. Under the name Prairie Dog I had the idea that it was something at the level of a coyot, not that they are rodents. Therefore, my question about the type of pellets, because I expected something at the level 7.62-9mm to be at least some impact energy for an ethical shot.

I did not intent this thread to be a pellet vs slug comparison, but about pellets for those of us choosing to use pellets.
This is what I posted in the 1st post of this thread:

"What is the maximum distance you shoot pellets and get good accuracy?

Yes and already in the post on Monday I clearly said that first we have to define what for everyone is the term "Good Accuracy"
I have already said, with airgun for me is good accuracy target 1- 1.5 moa target
Until you say here what "Good Accuracy" means to you in numbers there is not much sense to discuss.

I don't compare slugs and pellets now. Just get a number and then we can entertain whether it is physically possible at a given distance.

The numbers and facts are what the reader should take from this thread so that he knows whether pellets are still sufficient for his purposes.
Everyone likes to boast extraordinary results and I am not an exception, but it is also necessary to mention what the probability is that it can also be done to another shooter.
The internet is full of half -truths and often lies, and then starting shooters have a sense of fluustration that they are unable to achieve, according to information they read or saw in the video bot even average results, because it is based on bad data.

A beautiful example of this is this video in the world firearms:

 

[Altaros]

Again, I want to mention, I am not saying that the only right way is slugs. Slugs must be used where the accuracy of pellets ends and the thread is just about where the distance is, which cannot be said without the number of accuracy value.

For example, if we talk about the size of a target 2- 2.5 MOA. So I'm not saying that it is not possible to shoot precisely at 150m - 165 yards with pellets. Here's one of my 7 years old video where the shoting conditions were not even ideal:

 

[Vetmx]

@Caliber 22, I understand what you’re looking for. And contrary to internet exceptions, there is a general distance where the majority of everyday shooters pellets no longer are hunting accurate. There will always be an exceptional or unique gun/pellet that on a certain day will surprise you but painting with a broad brush, it’s 100 yards. Even at 100 or when you start to inch beyond, your combo has to be tuned perfectly either by tons of shooting or just dumb luck. Then a breeze kicks up and it’s all over.

 

[Caliber 22]

@Caliber 22, I understand what you’re looking for. And contrary to internet exceptions, there is a general distance where the majority of everyday shooters pellets no longer are hunting accurate. There will always be an exceptional or unique gun/pellet that on a certain day will surprise you but painting with a broad brush, it’s 100 yards. Even at 100 or when you start to inch beyond, your combo has to be tuned perfectly either by tons of shooting or just dumb luck. Then a breeze kicks up and it’s all over.

It is not that I am looking for something, I just like to know what others have experienced. Also, like I said before, I will not ever hunt at the distances I am target shooting at. Even if I and the rifle is capable of say 1/4moa everytime I shoot, if the kill zone of a live animal is not 3moa or bigger I will not easily take the shot.

 

[Vetmx]

It is not that I am looking for something, I just like to know what others have experienced. Also, like I said before, I will not ever hunt at the distances I am target shooting at. Even if I and the rifle is capable of say 1/4moa everytime I shoot, if the kill zone of a live animal is not 3moa or bigger I will not easily take the shot.

My bad. I thought you were looking for the maximum distance for accurate pellet shooting. I was curious also a while back and asked the same question. My topic didn’t get a ton of replies but I just figured most guys who shoot pellets don’t try to emulate a powder burner. They stay in their lane under 100.

 

[JEFFPPC]

In answer to the OPs question I regularly shot around 2 inches at 100 yds with my Diana 54 springer , .22, in good conditions with flags. I have shot under 1.5, 5 shot groups. I have shot .5 or s bit under for 4 shots but 5 shots changes things. My goal 5 under 1.0. Gun is tuned and I use a barrel tuner. Lots of fun..

 

[Altaros]

As I have mentioned several times, the wind is a fundamental aspect and it is also very important whether we are talking about the group or the hit the target same size as the group. Making a groups is much easier than hitting targets of the same size as a group.

I will put here some data and simple overview. Used .22 JSB 18.1 grain, wind size 1km/h (abou 0.6 mph) wind direction from 6 or 9 hours, ie full wind G1 0.041.
The column Drift (mRad) shows what side deviation in mRad this wind is made. Since you have only half a target on one side, so when requesting 1 MOA accuracy = 0.3mRad, the number in the column must be less than 0.15 MRad (half MOA).

From the table it is seen that for accuracy of 1 MOA at a maximum error on the wind 1km/h can be fired at a distance of 70m.
For 1.5 MOA up to about 110m.

In practice, of course, the wind can also blow at a different angle of than 90 degrees and will not have the maximum effect.
But this shows perfectly what I try to say here. If you want to know what your system is capable of (Airgun, Pellets / Slugs) then you must first start based on physical data. In reality it will always be worse on average

I say on average, as there may be times when the wind is almost constant, or you are lucky to the perfect estimate of the wind at the moment. Therefore, I not say that someone could not shoot sometimes a amazing result, but that's just luck, nothing more.

Although I wrote that it is not a comparison, so just little info: top .22 slugs will have at the same conditions, for the required accuracy 1 MOA, can be fired at a distance of 480m vs 70m for pellets.