N/A Let’s talk Safety

[Bear-of-Grayling]

Just recently a AGN member posted a video (not of himself) of a simple repair being made on barrel cocker. Not to throw anyone under the bus, but many new members need to understand some basic springer safety, especially when working on one.
I want to start by explaining the function and engagement of a trigger. Here are two different adjustable triggers commonly used. The Turkish made Quattro and the German made Rekord. Both four lever adjustable triggers. In the pictures the actual metal to metal engagements are within the yellow circles. The Quattro is the first picture and fully engaged. The Rekord is the second picture and adjusted to a “very light” engagement. Barely any metal to metal contact at all. This is how a trigger is made lighter and with less/no creep. The Rekord is a finer and more precise trigger unit than the Turkish made Quattro. But with lengthened screws added to the Quattro (which I do) it can be made just as light as the Rekord. With literally a fraction of metal to metal engagement.
With this in mind, it is easy to understand that how a cocked gun, left open with no hands on the barrel, could easily let loose. Hence many a bent upwards, barrels.
Now watch the video. Hard for me to watch. If a repair needs to be made like this, the spring/barrel should be removed or the barrel should be constrained with a make-shift strap. Don’t trust your ability to hold the barrel with one hand and stick your fingers/thumb in the guillotine.
I would also encourage good safety by holding the barrel back with one hand while loading with the other. Other good safety measures are welcome on this post. Thank you.

 

[Northwoods22]

I would add, for those who may be new to the sport, that you should also restrain the cocking lever/rod on sidelever and underlever spring/gas piston guns while loading as well.

 

[beerthief]

yes ALWAYS hold at the very end (muzzle) of the barrel .

 

[specie]

I had a part of my index finger in the breech of a sliding breech sidelever airgun...the trigger released...I lost a small chunk of the side my finger. If you lose the entire tip of your digit, the lost part cannot be sewn back on because not only is it "guillotined" off, but the lost part is so badly compression damaged to be useless. This is a very good topic to discuss.

 

[Gerry52]

I had a part of my index finger in the breech of a sliding breech sidelever airgun...the trigger released...I lost a small chunk of the side my finger. If you lose the entire tip of your digit, the lost part cannot be sewn back on because not only is it "guillotined" off, but the lost part is so badly compression damaged to be useless. This is a very good topic to discuss.

Member "Ponz" posted a pic about a couple years ago showing that same thing with HIS fingertip.. NOT PRETTY! Lost the whole tip! Stay safe people!

 

[Bear-of-Grayling]

I would add, for those who may be new to the sport, that you should also restrain the cocking lever/rod on sidelever and underlever spring/gas piston guns while loading as well.

I cringe every time I load my HW97. I always hold back the cocking lever. But still, if the trigger failed, if anything failed, would I be in the ready position to save my thumb???

 

[Northwoods22]

I cringe every time I load my HW97. I always hold back the cocking lever. But still, if the trigger failed, if anything failed, would I be in the ready position to save my thumb???

I feel the same way about my Diana 48. I could see that sliding steel breech taking a thumb clean off. And what Specie said about compression/crush injuries is absolutely true. There's no re-attaching a crushed severed digit.

 

[r1lover]

I cringe every time I load my HW97. I always hold back the cocking lever. But still, if the trigger failed, if anything failed, would I be in the ready position to save my thumb???

I hear ya, Dan. I love my HW97 but the same thing always crosses my mind.....WHAT IF? I haven't had a sear let loose yet when the breach is open but I can tell you, you probably won't be "ready enough". I learned this while carefully setting a rat trap (a mouse trap times 10). The speed and power of a spring loaded piece of steel is frightening.

 

[r1lover]

I totally agree, Dan. I am not sure how to phrase this caution to newbies who buy used guns they are not familiar with because they may not be able to tell a trigger has been adjusted beyond the level of safe. Maybe have someone more experienced check out their new acquisition? I don't know.

I DO know there is a risk there though. I bought an HW55 10m target gun someone had completely adjusted the 1st stage out of the trigger, took out all the creep and adjusted the spring so it was literally a hair trigger.

Luckily I have many HW guns that have not been tampered with and I was able to take one of those out of the stock to see what a properly adjusted trigger looks like and adjust the 55's back to safe operation.

 

[Bear-of-Grayling]

Another word of caution just occurred to me. I have made Rekord triggers very light like r1lover mentioned. Seemed to hold steady for a good while. Then out of nowhere the trigger failed on the closing of the barrel and the shot went off. Had this happen in mid return but always ready to stop barrel motion. Never had injuries or damage to the gun. Thankfully. They are easy to get to light. This a on a German made Rekord trigger. Imagine on a Turkish made Quattro or a China trigger. Steel wears over time. Tolerances change. Add some extra meat to the adjustment. After the adjustment on a trigger is made, always, very carefully close the barrel while pointed down range. Do this long enough to build confidence that all is safe. If you seem to feel a change or minor difference, stop, and add more meat to the contacts. Then repeat safety check. Can also use the drop test. Load and in a safe direction firmly drop on the butt pad on a solid surface. I personally don’t like this test but many do. I worry that the trigger/sear moved just enough to make it unpredictable. That’s how accidents happen.

 

[KWK]

That’s why it’s foolish to adjust the exposed screw behind the trigger to light on a Rekord. And quite a few do. There really is no benefit to it. And your first stage and sear may not reset reliably.
When the spring is set with correct tension there is quite a bit of overlap to the sear when cocked.

 

[cjtamu]

When I’m holding the barrel or under lever or arm barring a side lever I always make sure the butt of the gun is firmly braced. If it’s not and you have a failure you’re going to have a problem. And you don’t want to go through a compression or de-gloving finger injury. Those of us with only 9 fingers already can tell you that for sure LOL. Non-AG related.

 

[Septicdeath]

There where several times watching this video, I cringed. A accident waiting to happen

 

[specie]

Hopefully not taking over the topic, but I have a question: What happens if you're firmly holding the barrel or side/underlever and the trigger releases? As long as you are still holding them, can anything bad happen?

 

[MDriskill]

That’s why it’s foolish to adjust the exposed screw behind the trigger to light on a Rekord. And quite a few do. There really is no benefit to it. And your first stage and sear may not reset reliably.
When the spring is set with correct tension there is quite a bit of overlap to the sear when cocked.

TOTALLY agree. So many folks seem to think the object of an adjustable trigger is to make it as light as possible...not! As KWK noted, a good rule of thumb is that the blade should return to the starting point if you let go of it at the end of the first stage.

It's possible to adjust the Rekord, while the module is out of the gun. But be VERY cautious with this - there's some "slack" in the components, and there will be LESS sear engagement when the trigger is restraining the mainspring in a cocked action. (Ask me how I know... .)

 

[SpiralGroove]

I cringe every time I load my HW97. I always hold back the cocking lever. But still, if the trigger failed, if anything failed, would I be in the ready position to save my thumb???

I never completely got used to my (3) HW77K/HW97 for various reasons, but loading always caused me a moment of hesitation .
They were beautiful, accurate machines, but not often used, hence I sold them ........

 

[Bear-of-Grayling]

Hopefully not taking over the topic, but I have a question: What happens if you're firmly holding the barrel or side/underlever and the trigger releases? As long as you are still holding them, can anything bad happen?

If the trigger releases while you’re hold back the barrel,side or under lever will depend on the model of the gun. Most new guns have a anti bear trap mechanism. And these vary also. The older ones with a safety button are different from the oldest ones without a safety. If is important to know what you have and never totally depend on any mechanism. If the barrel/lever comes back from a mechanical failure and you are holding it back, you will instantly feel the full power of the spring. If the gun has a anti bear trap safety mechanism (in most cases), the barrel will return to open.

 

[bf1956]

Hmmmm... maybe time for some pellet pens.

 

[Bear-of-Grayling]

Hmmmm... maybe time for some pellet pens.

I have them. Work great in barrel cockers. Not so much in under/side levers.

 

[scotton]

I have had an accidental discharge (or whatever you want to call it) with a HW97 while holding the cocking lever. The pressure on the cocking lever was enough to keep the chamber from taking my thumb off. What I wasn't expecting was the butt stock coming up and popping me in the chin.

So I can confirm that holding the barrel or cocking lever while loading gives you a much better chance of not losing body parts. And those of you with 48/52/54s, I recommend tucking the cocking arm under your loading arm. This way, if the cocking arm comes flying forwards it should knock your hand out of the breach.