Impact probe screw failure & solution

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I understand what you mean but i am not from US , I am from Canada.
Using a more solid screw is not a real solution.
FX "must" act with respect and come back to us with a serious solution or screw if you wish.
And why not communicate here instead of using a third party distributor make no sens for me at this point.
Frederic spend time to travel in US for benchrest compition so why not take some time to share with his consumers sometimes.
He need branding and communication coaching seriously.
FX must communicate what they have improved and changed on the Impact since the first batch they sold.
That is simple and not time consuming from their site.
 
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Either the issue is in the quality of the set screws or in the machining. If the machined threads have tolerances exceeded then those will result in a 'loose' fit per-se and result in the set screw bending or worse sheering over time with the forces exerted on it.

What Ernest said is correct on it all becoming like one piece of metal but only if tolerances are within spec.

Based on my Impact, I have always been of the view that machining is something FX really need to pay very close attention to, especially in their flagship rifle.
 
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GQ and sharroff.... In my opinion, as an FX customer/owner, FX should be already aware of this situation and they probably are. I hope they are not playing a lawyer's game. This will not go away by itself..and if not addressed in a meaningful way an irreversible damage to the reputation of the FX Impact model and possibly to the FX brand may ensue.

If FX is not aware of this accident...then I fault their professionalism in keeping abreast of the airgunning community events they seek to represent and sell to. Also, those amongst us who had and have a prominent voice in evaluating and promoting FX products and /or well known in the hobby this is the time for you to step up (even if behind the scenes) and weigh in with your expertise directly to FX. You owe that to yourself and to the rest of us and as a professional to yourselves.

I do not want to speculate if the cause of the setscrew failure may be a systemic problem (let's hope not). It may be a one-time defect of the screw, itself and not an FX design problem. Albeit many chimed in (with probably many decades of combined experience) that such design poses a lot of questions...questions that FX should answer without having to lawyer up. I can assure that this situation will not go away. We are talking about safety and potentially...lives. Am I hyping it up too much? I hope so, because I rather be called a whiner than having my FX Impact or someone else's Impact cause a life long injury.
 
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I will be getting FX replacement screws and will be ship to me on monday.

1. This screw is 10X stronger, same military grade steel that was used on submarine fasteners and setscrews that I used to install
2. The allen socket slot is shallower 
3. color is silver, if you have the black one you need to replace it. 
4. they are in house made at FX to control quality assurance, the outside bender black screw didnt have the tolerance, strength and socket slot to deep.

So PM me to get on the list to receive a free updated probe screw. when I receive the screw I will post a new topic to indicate I have them in hand.




 
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I doubt that any message memo or statement will be coming from FX. This sadly is the blood in the water that propels our legal system. It seems when variables are put into play it's always the manufacturer that becomes a target. My father had a Lincoln always dealer serviced, at almost 100k it spit out the spark plug on the passenger side closest to the firewall. I was driving it and limped it home. It seems a heli- coil had been installed and a totally different non spec plug had been inserted during a dealer tune up at 60k. My point here was a trained tech that screwed up, it took some 3 year and 40k miles with vibration, and pressure it failed. The problem would not have happened if the original plug was inserted correctly. I'm not blaming or suggesting user error, I think you have a similar situation here. You have individuals tightening to variable specs, and different degrees of usage, and power. The pictures of failing grub screws shows a problem, hope FX can make this right and please all that are involved.
 
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"sniperlabyo"I will be getting FX replacement screws and will be ship to me on monday.

1. This screw is 10X stronger, same military grade steel that was used on submarine fasteners and setscrews that I used to install
2. The allen socket slot is shallower 
3. color is silver, if you have the black one you need to replace it. 
4. they are in house made at FX to control quality assurance, the outside bender black screw didnt have the tolerance, strength and socket slot to deep.

So PM me to get on the list to receive a free updated probe screw. when I receive tham I will post a new topic to indicate I have them in hand.





Click to expand...

Thank you Ernest for stepping up being a true professional! Taking the lead is what we learned in the US military...
 
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We are aware of the malfunction posted within this thread. The rifle in question was collected by us via Air service to be returned for inspection. We take safety concerns very serious and will make sure, in conjunction with the FX factory, that all measures are taken to ensure the safety of everyone. Until we have the rifle in our possession, we are unable to diagnose further.

As a precaution, we are currently preparing to send out replacement parts to all owners, custom made by the factory, which we are told to be roughly 10 times stronger in material than the original screw in this incident. We will be able to begin shipping these parts Monday. Owners do not need to contact us to request this part, as we will be mass shipping to everyone who has purchased an Impact and to all dealers will be made aware to do the same. 

We at AOA and the FX factory are very keen on addressing this concern and making sure that the airguns function safely without any cause for concern.

Airguns of Arizona
 
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"7deuce"FX Impacts aren't perfect but I still love mine. It's just fun.
Click to expand...
No gun is perfect and FX is certainly not the only manufacturer to have used internal parts that weren't properly hardened for what they do. It's good to see them trying to fix the issue quickly. 

It doesn't take nearly as much force as people think to snap small metal parts under the right (or wrong) circumstances. It just needs enough leverage, some force in a direction it wasn't designed to handle or repeated stress. The problem just presents in a more spectacular fashion when HPA is involved as the bit that snaps off can be shot out like a bullet. 

The one I worry about most is those brass or stainless steel fill probes. They are so delicate. I have had two snap on me when I went to pull them out. I'm scared that one day when I put my face in front of one while filling to see where the gauge is up to, one will snap off and end up in my eye.

I'd like to see all manufacturers making an effort to phase out the use of weak metal components for anything that touches HPA.
 
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"sniperlabyo"I will be getting FX replacement screws and will be ship to me on monday.

1. This screw is 10X stronger, same military grade steel that was used on submarine fasteners and setscrews that I used to install
2. The allen socket slot is shallower 
3. color is silver, if you have the black one you need to replace it. 
4. they are in house made at FX to control quality assurance, the outside bender black screw didnt have the tolerance, strength and socket slot to deep.

So PM me to get on the list to receive a free updated probe screw. when I receive the screw I will post a new topic to indicate I have them in hand.


10x stronger ? does not exist.
A set screw like they used are normaly called P6SS 45H and is of material 12.9. This means 90% of 1200Mpa = 1080 mpa This is really high to start with.
Screws does not come in higher class. There are 8.8, 10.9 and 12,9
Normal construction steel in the US is normally not above 3-400 mpa. I think the best constrution steel available in the US is something like ASTM500 just to give a picture of where we are starting.
I have never even heard of materials stronger than 2000 mpa.

So 10x stronger screw does not exist. Maybe 50% stronger is possible if the one they used is lower class than my guess

Click to expand...
 
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Wow. 
Some response.

Now until just a day or two back FX had NO idea about this safety issue, and, they got custom FX factory made parts to AoA in those few days! WOW. FAST.

FX knew back when the first one posted about let go, and started making said screws back then? Couldn't be no company would risk such.

No matter.

A good number of years ago a US airgun maker ( small but loved for big-bores and well respected by all) had ONE person's rifle shoot the cocking bolt out the rear. You can see where this is a BAD thing eh?
The rifle in question had been HEAVILY modded for extreme power the maker NEVER intended it to see. This modding was what caused the actual problem. It would NEVER have happened if not modded, it was a 100% safe design as issued from the maker.
The manufacture is this case instantly stopped making the design entirely and destroyed all inventory. He then redesigned the receiver so that NO MATTER WHAT this ( bolt out rear) could NEVER happen again no matter what was done to it after it got in private hands.
"I" personally do not even use .177's IF the could COULD come straight out the rear. Only receivers with solid metal between that bolt and eye/I.

Everyone who knows airgun design ( and hey most here are just shooters and rightfully assume someone who KNOWS their stuff worried about safety for them) knows ( and knew) this is NOT a fool proof design.
Darn good business idea's that man ran on.

To be idiot proof ( and this Impact issue certainly does NOT appear to be due to any consumer issue) and safe a re-design will be needed. 

Except for perhaps shooting yourself or dropping one on your foot, there should be no way to be injured by a new unmolested ( or even modded but that would nessacerally be on anyone but you) modern airgun.

I know of several people who "thought" , and said so out loud, that design doesn't look safe to me esp. in a big bore.
I thought this, but just a thought as I've not seen one and believed there would be some other safety measure in place.


Oh for the longing of the good ole day's & Logan quality FX. 




John


Most manufactures
 
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beeser,

From 7dueces picture and AoA's response it is clear that the screw was not strong enough. That is the diagnosis, just to be confirmed when AoA gets the gun. They are providing a screw that is '10x' stronger. That will not exacerbate the problem, it is the next best step in fixing the issue.

SWEJaeger,

Think about it this way if someone took the strongest steel and made a tube (basically what that hollow screw is) with walls 1/1000 thick you would have strength A. Take the same steel and make a tube with walls 1/100 or 1/10 or 1 inch thick. Those would be X times stronger even though the steel is the same.

 
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Another thing is that set screws are not meant to hold load. For that pins are used.
Since the threads adding "sheer factor" witch is not so funny to guess or calculate.
You cant just use the section area of a thread groove and use for strenght calculations.
Specially if there is fautige involved. If there are fauige crack start it could eventually break even if only
loaded with maybe 30% of the static max load it ws suposed to hold for.




 
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