Tuning I need help tuning my Matt Dubber Special Edition!!!

Do they have an ACCURACY guarantee or is only the POWER guaranteed?

You can expect at least sub MOA at 100 yards with the right combination.

My Ken Hicks no power plenum MK2 shooting 26gr (My own home made JSB 25.39gr copied pellets) is half inch or better at 100 yards and literally one holers at 80 yards and using the commercially made store bought 25.39gr JSBs are right at one inch or at MOA with a GOOD pellet LOT batch or 1.5-2 inch with a typical sub par JSB tin.


 
Another thought, which size 26gr javelins did you buy (217 or 218)? I would hope that they didn’t sell you the wrong size since you purchased the rifle with them.

I am shooting the .217’s. I have heard Matt say that you want a higher reg pressure (like 150-160) for slugs because it makes the valve close faster, eliminating extra air washing out behind the slug which could cause instability. I may try that tomorrow to see if I can get better accuracy at higher reg pressures.
 
@Smok3y I am shooting at 30 yards. 1.5” groups are unacceptable to me at that distance. I agree, should I be shooting at 100 yards, 1.5” wouldn’t be terrible but I would still expect sub MOA in good shooting conditions.

Dang! I was truly hoping you weren’t going to say that. Yeah, at 30, I completely agree. I would be pretty pissed too if I paid that premium. 

Are the speeds inconsistent as well?

No, the speeds are pretty consistent. After each adjustment I’ll take a few shots to let the gun settle in, and once it’s settled the velocity is steady within about 10fps extreme spread. I had a buddy recommend I check to make sure I have the right size moderator on it. The gun came with the DonnyFL Koi, and maybe they accidentally put on a .177/.22 model instead of a .22/.25 model. Maybe I’m getting baffle strikes.

The Koi has 2 baffles, same bore size a the muzzle, the muzzle opening measures out 9.51mm, according to my micrometer. I would think you notice the lead dust on the muzzle face it that was happening. I feel for you, you've got the Javelin slug and the 960fps described in the Utahairguns.com ad. I haven't experienced the Javelin slugs, but if they come naked like FX Hybrids, I would lube the bitches! I would also try the transonic route, Matt, Gerhard and Rolf do all the time, and they are Patriot Slugs, the makers of the Javelins..
 
Another thought, which size 26gr javelins did you buy (217 or 218)? I would hope that they didn’t sell you the wrong size since you purchased the rifle with them.

I am shooting the .217’s. I have heard Matt say that you want a higher reg pressure (like 150-160) for slugs because it makes the valve close faster, eliminating extra air washing out behind the slug which could cause instability. I may try that tomorrow to see if I can get better accuracy at higher reg pressures.

I think Matt runs the power tune model and shoots the heavier slugs, he always prefers the higher BC slugs.


 
Do they have an ACCURACY guarantee or is only the POWER guaranteed?

You can expect at least sub MOA at 100 yards with the right combination.

My Ken Hicks no power plenum MK2 shooting 26gr (My own home made JSB 25.39gr copied pellets) is half inch or better at 100 yards and literally one holers at 80 yards and using the commercially made store bought 25.39gr JSBs are right at one inch or at MOA with a GOOD pellet LOT batch or 1.5-2 inch with a typical sub par JSB tin.


They do not have an accuracy guarantee, the gun only comes “power tuned”, not harmonically tuned.
 
UPDATE: I talked to Ernest about it. I asked him if I should try to up the reg into the 160’s-170’s in order to make the valve close faster, as Matt talks about.

Ernest strongly recommended to try other slugs before going around and adjusting everything ad nauseam. His exact words were:

”The liner selects the ammo, not you!!!”

Having consulted the oracle, I have just put in an order with Nielsen. I’ll be trying the full gamut of their most popular slugs and if I can’t get any of them to shoot, I’ll try the various hybrid slugs out there.
 
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Hey, how’s it going? I know you talked to Ernest but I’ve been watching this thread and wanted to chime it. Slugs are not usually easy to just pick one out and have it shoot, it’s a process. It can happen that way but rarely, very rarely. I would almost consider it crazy to start shooting slugs without cleaning it thoroughly, checking to see how well it shoots with pellets and breaking it in...With and without the moderator. Clean it thoroughly, put it back to the original settings and adjust only one thing at a time and take notes as you go. You’re talking about high reg. settings for slugs but you’re only wanting to shoot 26gr. slugs. When the gun came to you at 110bar. It doesn’t seem very high but for a .22 and 26gr. I would consider that a pretty high reg pressure for those projectiles. There just isn’t much mass. I just tuned down my .25 Impact and it shoots 33.95gr. pellets at 920fps at 110bar...My valve adjuster is closed down to three lines and my HS preload is only about half way. These guns are very capable. After you figure the gun out a title bit, then mess with turning it up to 120, 130, 140bar, I just don’t think that much will be necessary. Maybe? That’s a lot of air with the power plenum. Even then, some guns shoot great with a high reg pressure and a fast shot pulse, others the other way around. It really is a balance between the hammer and regulator pressure. Another thing to watch out for is that slugs can foul a barrel very fast. Even out of a barrel that has been polished and waxed, I can only shoot about 150 slugs before I have to clean it. If I don’t accuracy will suffer. The same barrel will shoot 500-600 pellets before I clean it. 

I guess my point is that any of us that shoot a lot of slugs have been in your situation, you’ll get it. It’s so important to take everything one step at a time. After you get some different slugs to test, set your regulator wherever you think you want it, open the valve adjuster all the way and just adjust the power wheel up and down to start. It’s also really important to “season” with about five shots every time you switch slugs before you start shooting groups. Test at close range and as you adjust the velocity with the power wheel, you’ll see the groups either tighten or get bigger. Pick two or three slugs that look the most promising and stick with those. If you mess with too many at a time, you’ll be confused. After you pick the best 2-3, you can dial them in close or move out farther. I usually start at 50, move back to 75, then 100 and beyond. Find a promising velocity with the power wheel like I said and then adjust regulator, start closing down the valve adjuster etc... Don’t worry about shooting too fast, these guns and slugs were designed for “fast”. You are nowhere near transonic. That’s somewhere around 1175fps at sea level, I think? Some will tell you that slugs shoot good at lower velocity at that can be true. However, most of those same slugs will shoot great fast too. More often than not, most of these slugs shoot best between 925-980fps. Stick with it and don’t get discouraged. I’m sure you’re gun will shoot but when you start messing with things and get it out of whack, it may not seem like it. I’ve seen it many times and have done it myself. Get the gun back as close to original as possible, take off the moderator and take it one sep at a time. Use the power wheel to adjust velocity at first and go from there. Be sure to clean it about every 100-150 slugs if you see your groups start to go South. 

Good luck, you’ll get it.

Stoti
 
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@Stoti thank you for info and encouragement. I checked the moderator and there are no signs of baffle striking. This morning I dropped the reg back down to 100bar (how it came to me from UA) and got the hammer spring back as close to spec as I could. Shot the first group and it was about 1/2” at 30yds, velocity 960 fps.

After adjusting the power wheel down to 5 and cycling the spring a few times, shot my next group which is the one shown in the pic. 0.347” CTC. Not slug on slug yet, but still much better than I was getting.

Now I’ll continue to slowly turn in that valve to see if I can tighten it up at all.


Thanks for all of your help in this process! You’ve all been very encouraging and given great info.
 
Have you tried shooting a string with nothing attached to a barrel? No moderator/silencer/LDC, nothing...I would even remove the shroud, just to eliminate some possible errors.

Using a moderator does not mean it removes/breaks the turbulence at the exit...from the barrel exit and not from the ldc exit?

Inside there (whatever you call it) at the very last 6-10" before the projectile gets out to an open air and a next 10" maybe...this is a long way and many weird things happening inside. Each in a micro seconds steps....
 
BigHUN is correct in that it doesn’t have to be making contact all the time to be causing accuracy issues. If it’s not 100% concentric, it can cause accuracy issues. With that being said, .347 CTC even at 30yds is very encouraging. It looks like you’re on the right track. Good for you. Now that you know there is some potential, mess with one adjustment at a time and take notes each time you make a change. I’d leave the regulator and either use the power wheel and HS preload for the majority of adjustments and leave the valve adjuster for the very end if you feel it’s necessary. Like I said, I never even used to even use it, like many other people but it can tighten things up at the end of the tuning process. Once you get it dialed in and shooting great, write down all of the settings so you can return it to where it shoots best if you make changes in the future. I would still be sure to test all the other slugs you bought, even if one is “supposed to be the best”, you just never know. Each gun and liner has subtle differences so you just never know for sure what will shoot. 

Sounds like you’ve figured it out and are on track to be shooting “long” in no time. I’m happy for you. Be sure to keep us up to date with your progress. and everyone always wants to see pictures. Have a great evening.

Stoti
 
We in Canada have no moderators/ldc's, can be pretty laud at a time.

I was playing couple days this summer with a simple muzzle break directly attached to the liner nut. I can confirm a difference in precision it makes. I also noticed that it is not a same thing how far the stripper cone is from muzzle, need to play a littlebit.

So finally I ordered one custom ...what is that thingy called... with a stripping cone integrated. In my setup the cone is about 23mm distance from the liner.

20200629_134230.1610931211.jpg


You guys may not like it much still laud as the black original piece, but the exiting air blast is stripped at least.
 
I would also like to add something. After a 3 year hiatus from Impacts, I bought another one. My new more mature approach has helped reduce frustration. When we get a new gun, we want to go nuts. We take shortcuts just hoping to get lucky so we can sling lead. Impatience and shortcuts will ruin a relationship with an Impact. With my latest gun I set the reg, turned my wheel to max and with an Allen wrench, worked the hammer spring up to my TRUE max speed for that reg setting. I backed my wheel to #4 and confirmed that my velocity dropped just a little. I turned my VLA in from 4 lines until I saw a slight drop in velocity. This is where I start my paper shooting for groups. I keep turning, and turning is almost the wrong word. I slightly tweak the VLA in a tiny bit at a time and shoot groups. Very time consuming. Lots of slugs. But when I nail it, my gun is freaking accurate and consistent. Take your time and don’t jump from one theory to the next looking for a quick fix. Be slow and be methodical. It’s already in your gun, you just have to find it.
 
I would also like to add something. After a 3 year hiatus from Impacts, I bought another one. My new more mature approach has helped reduce frustration. When we get a new gun, we want to go nuts. We take shortcuts just hoping to get lucky so we can sling lead. Impatience and shortcuts will ruin a relationship with an Impact. With my latest gun I set the reg, turned my wheel to max and with an Allen wrench, worked the hammer spring up to my TRUE max speed for that reg setting. I backed my wheel to #4 and confirmed that my velocity dropped just a little. I turned my VLA in from 4 lines until I saw a slight drop in velocity. This is where I start my paper shooting for groups. I keep turning, and turning is almost the wrong word. I slightly tweak the VLA in a tiny bit at a time and shoot groups. Very time consuming. Lots of slugs. But when I nail it, my gun is freaking accurate and consistent. Take your time and don’t jump from one theory to the next looking for a quick fix. Be slow and be methodical. It’s already in your gun, you just have to find it.

This is solid advice 👆.

My first slug experience was not good either. Just handling a couple of slugs my fingers were dirty Immediately with fragments of lead and gunk on them. I was immediately turned off. Put em in a empty water bottle with lots of dawn dish soap and a little water. Shook them gently for a minute and the amount of “crap” that came off was insane! They cleaned up very nice. After touching hundreds my fingers don’t get dirty. Let them dry and sprayed a little ballistol on them. Still didn’t group great. I figured out how to indexed my barrel and now I’m hitting birds at 100+ yards with a compact wildcat lol. I now understand the slug addiction because they SMACK pest birds. Need to find a rabbit to try them on 😁