HW45 Piston Damage

[cjtamu]

Just finished adjusting my trigger following instructions below. Now breaking cleanly at about 1.5 lb. Gave it a little longer first stage and a very short crisp second, which suits me just fine. All that can of course be fine-tuned but this is a great place to start. Thought I’d post here for those who haven’t seen.

Weihrauch HW45 – Trigger Adjustment

Last week, I acquired another, yes, a fourth HW45 air pistol. "Four!" you say? Yeah, I must be a magnet for them. I'll go into my reasons in another post. Anyway, whilst I had all four together I checked them over for variations and chronographed each of them to see how they compared.Immedi

www.jimmiedeesairguns.com

 

[cjtamu]

Yeah boyeee, believe we done found ourselves a pellet! Couldn’t ask for more. The Excites were almost as good. Heavier so little slower and about 1/10 less FPE. Spread of 7 and SD of 2 so not exactly terrible. I like the sound of the Hobbies better although shot cycle actually seems a little smoother with theExcites, little less muzzle flip. In my highly scientific offhand spinner shooting last night the Hobbies had a slight edge in accuracy. Bout to order a bunch of them because this gun is a blast to shoot.

 

[Mycapt65]

Awesome! I'm happy for you. So what was your final spring and seal arrangement?

 

[cjtamu]

OEM spring and breech seal. Parachute seal from D&L in Canada. Suspect it’s the same as the Aussie seal, purple color. Link below. Very small amount of ARH moly on spring and edge of piston seal. Seriously, I use a Q-tip like makeup applicator. This gun doesn’t need a lot of lube to make power contrary to what I’ve read elsewhere. Almost no dieseling. No smoke at all, can’t smell it unless you sniff the barrel. Don’t ask how I know ha ha ha. Polished spring ends. Couldn’t find a 1/2” nylon bolt to make a spring guide for the muzzle end. Believe that’s a good idea and will do later. Will certainly help putting it back together. With the light lube it pinged a little for 75 shots or so until everything distributed but that’s gone now. Having a blast trying to master it. All the difficulties of a springer combined with all the difficulties of a pistol. What could possibly go wrong?

CAS1 9074 Piston Seal for Hw45

Replacement piston seal for HW45/Beeman P1. Also fits HW25. NEW LOW FRICTION DESIGN NOW WITH FRONT PARACHUTE GROOVE FOR BETTER PERFORMANCE NEW PURPLE MATERIAL IS MOLYBDENUM DISULFIDE IMPREGNATED AND PERMANENTLY LUBRICATEDHAS 1.5 TIMES THE LIFE OF PREVIOUS RED MATERIAL AND IS RATED TO 1000 BAR...

dlairgun.com

 

[Mycapt65]

Thanks. I have a new oem spring and CAS seals. I've been hesitant to do anything that would cause a power loss. I'm admittedly addicted to power. At least as much power as I can get while retaining accuracy. Detuning is not in my nature. Your reports are very helpful to my dysfunction. I suspected the gun would have a nicer cycle with the CAS seal but was leary of the power it might cost.
Stay
Well
Ron

 

[cjtamu]

Thanks. I have a new oem spring and CAS seals. I've been hesitant to do anything that would cause a power loss. I'm admittedly addicted to power. At least as much power as I can get while retaining accuracy. Detuning is not in my nature. Your reports are very helpful to my dysfunction. I suspected the gun would have a nicer cycle with the CAS seal but was leary of the power it might cost.
Stay
Well
Ron

Simpatico. I like mine to shoot as hard as possible while still being uber accurate. Not too much to ask, is it? Mine was sick when I got it so no data with OEM seal to compare to. Assume you have some. I’m also at 36’ AMSL so I probably get a little bump.

 

[Mycapt65]

Simpatico. I like mine to shoot as hard as possible while still being uber accurate. Not too much to ask, is it? Mine was sick when I got it so no data with OEM seal to compare to. Assume you have some. I’m also at 36’ AMSL so I probably get a little bump.

Lol. I'm like 10' AMSL, so no difference there. I'll have to look at my notes tomorrow. Mine was dieseling like hell and 20 cal when I got it. I think it was about 5-5.5 FPE with some pellets. I converted it to 177 so it wouldn't be so expensive to suck at shooting it. I think it hovered around 5 FPE in 177. I took it apart and cleaned it to eliminate the dieseling and no surprise it dropped under 5. I added RWS spring chamber oil to the spring chamber. That eventually made it's way to the compression area and restored old smokey to it original fire breathing self. 5 FPE is so anemic in my book I can't give up any power. I had a 1377 back in the late 70s, early eighties that was more accurate and more powerful. I don't see the attraction in these guns after owning one. Basically I have a $400 tin can tipper.

 

[cjtamu]

The Tinbum kit mod Steveoo talked about for 6 FPE where you copy the nylon guide out of steel might be your ticket. They’re challenging as all hail to shoot. Saw a post from AirNGasman where he said he considered shooting a springer pistol the hardest thing to master. And said he’d never seen anyone do it. Made me feel better. Getting trigger adjusted to my liking made a huge difference.

Edit: His exact quote below. I thought it was hysterical.

“In my opinion recoiling spring-piston pistols are the hardest guns of any kind to shoot well. Matter of fact I can't say I've ever ever seen anyone accomplish it.”

 

[Mycapt65]

Don't get me wrong. There's times I do reasonably well for a few shots in row. Say under half inch at ten yards. Then I minutely shift my grip or concentration and I'm an inch away. Usually my variance is up and down. The gun used to have extreme spreads of like 5 or 6 so its not a inconsistency thing with the gun. Outdoors I've relegated it to shooting beer cans as far out as 25 yards. I can hit them just enough to stay interested. The gun isn't enjoyable to cock so eventually it gets put down.

Never really been a pistol guy. As a kid I was an excellent shot with them. Even one handed at moving targets. Still my 1377 was a drag to pump between shots so I never took to it. I had a 38C co2 pistol that I was deadly with, as long as it was warm out and had a full cartridge. In NY there's a lot of the year co2 isn't an option. Even under perfect conditions the power wasn't impressive. In fact we'd play war with them like people do paintball. They stung enough to tell someone was out. Lol.
Pcp pistols would probably address all my pistol concerns but I'm too cheap to buy all the support equipment for rifles much less pistols.

Oh well. I guess I'll keep this pistol for it fun value and learn to have a sense of humor about it's performance. It's my one Weihrauch I haven't tamed.

 

[cjtamu]

Yeah, I think that’s exactly what AirNGasman had in mind. At 5 FPE this will be 15 yd and in gun. Just ordered a red dot kit for it to help my old eyes. Have red dots on several CO2 pistols and they’re great. CO2 will be usable a lot more in AR than NY. Have considered PCP pistol but haven’t done yet. Already have a hand pump and filling those small tubes would be easy. Viable and much cheaper support equipment alternative.

 

[Mycapt65]

Yeah, I think that’s exactly what AirNGasman had in mind. At 5 FPE this will be 15 yd and in gun. Just ordered a red dot kit for it to help my old eyes. Have red dots on several CO2 pistols and they’re great. CO2 will be usable a lot more in AR than NY. Have considered PCP pistol but haven’t done yet. Already have a hand pump and filling those small tubes would be easy. Viable and much cheaper support equipment alternative.

Tru I never considered a that it'd be easier to hand pump a pcp pistol. Co2 still doesn't have enough power and the perpetually buying disposable cartridges is off putting.

What are you going to use to mount the red dot to the 13mm rail? Regardless of manufacturer claims, I still haven't found one that works.

 

[cjtamu]

Tru I never considered a that it'd be easier to hand pump a pcp pistol. Co2 still doesn't have enough power and the perpetually buying disposable cartridges is off putting.

What are you going to use to mount the red dot to the 13mm rail? Regardless of manufacturer claims, I still haven't found one that works.

Below is what I have coming. Have a set of BKL adapters but they sit up so high. This looks much lower. Neat site. He has a variety of red dots, adapters, and some other nifty items.

Vector Optics SCRD-1911 Frenzy 1x17x24 Red Dot Pistol Handgun Sight 21mm Picatinny + HW45/75 Adaptor

Vector Optics Frenzy 1x17x24 Red Dot Pistol Handgun Sight 21mm Picatinny (SCRD-19II) 3MOA Red Dot Size, 8 Level (NV) Red Dot Intensity, On/Off Switch IPX6 Water Proof, Pistols Compatible, Weaver Mount, w/ Cap Automatically turns off after 4 hours placing alone Adaptor included to fit 13mm Dovetail…

premium-quality-air-rifle-accessories.ecwid.com

 

[Mycapt65]

Below is what I have coming. Have a set of BKL adapters but they sit up so high. This looks much lower. Neat site. He has a variety of red dots, adapters, and some other nifty items.

Vector Optics SCRD-1911 Frenzy 1x17x24 Red Dot Pistol Handgun Sight 21mm Picatinny + HW45/75 Adaptor

Vector Optics Frenzy 1x17x24 Red Dot Pistol Handgun Sight 21mm Picatinny (SCRD-19II) 3MOA Red Dot Size, 8 Level (NV) Red Dot Intensity, On/Off Switch IPX6 Water Proof, Pistols Compatible, Weaver Mount, w/ Cap Automatically turns off after 4 hours placing alone Adaptor included to fit 13mm Dovetail…

premium-quality-air-rifle-accessories.ecwid.com

You'll have to update me on how this works out. I looked through all their pictures and couldn't find one of the adapter.
On my copy of the pistol the dovetail isn't even parallel. It has nearly a 1mm taper from end to end. I'm not too hopeful a clamp on model will stay put without a set screw set into the gun. I refuse to marr the finish so I do the best I can with the irons. I'd love to figure out how to improvise a peep sight on that gun. As bad as my eyes are with irons I still think my issue is with the guns hold sensitivity.
Looking forward to you taming yours.

 

[cjtamu]

Wondered same. Guessing they cut one of the Eaglevision mounts to length but we’ll see. My dovetail tapers from just over 14mm near muzzle to about 13.5 I think on transfer port end? Assuming it’s designed that way maybe to ease putting mounts on from narrower end? The BKL mounts should hold and not mar. All one piece of Al and you actually flex it to clamp. Just not crazy about how high they sit. If the new mount has set screws to rail there will be heat shrink or similar protecting the rail.

 

[Mycapt65]

 

[cjtamu]

Well, Mycapt65, I don’t know if I have this thing tamed but this is a trick bit of kit. The dovetail to Pic rail adapter is piece on right side in first photo. Spring loaded, no set screws. Just slips onto rail like normal dovetail mount. RD is on Pic rail mount already. Fit it onto adapter and tighten the screw on Pic rail mount. Done. No set screws into the rail. Other small piece is a recoil stop. Recommended for HW45. Again, mounts just like a dovetail ring would. Not crazy about the aesthetics of the stop, emailed them to see just how strongly they recommend it. Also asked about screw torque. RD manual said no more than 16 in-lb for their mounts so I have everything at 15 including the recoil stop.

Edit: The top of the BKL mounts would be about double the height of the recoil stop in the pic. Great for a small scope I guess but way too high for RD.

 

[Mycapt65]

Looks pretty cool. I agree it'd be nicer looking with out the stop. I tried similar snap fit internal adaptors and they always buckled when clamped near hard enough to hold on to the rail if they had any room above of below them to deflect. The stop probably alleviates that the need for over tightening.

If this set up proves itself over time it will be a great discovery for HW45 owners. Well done you.

 

[cjtamu]

Thanks, Ron. Heard back from the owner this morning, super nice guy. He said if you like re-zeroing frequently then you don’t need the recoil stop ha ha. Said the HW45 just has too much recoil and no matter what you do the RD will slide forward without it. The nice thing about these guys is that they love their HW45s and shoot them regularly so they’ve field tested all this equipment on their own guns. See what I think after a couple tins of pellets. Buddy coming down and weather looks decent so we’re likely to get a little testing in.

 

[jccams]

That adapter is great, I put one on my HW75. I don't need a recoil stop on that pistol but I could see the HW45 needing one.

 

[Steveoo]

The wear to your piston is unusual as it is 90 deg to where you might expect it (more usually coming from cocking arm galling, or 180 deg to the cocking arm caused by the force applied from the cocking slot side...

Tin bum kits damp these guns but destroy what they were designed for, namely 6ftlb hand canons.
They will do much better with the weight left in the piston, preventing piston rebound but learning to shoot the gun and enjoying 600 Fps instead of 450 fps..
You can get 600 fps and a reasonable damped cycle by selecting pop gun phase pellets but with big dia skirts which seal the gun up better, using all the available compression volume.
Hobby and Superdomes do a good job of this, as do the larger skirt AA FT.
Then go learn to shoot it...
Piston head is teflon....