Hades Vs. The Dome

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Hades aren’t as accurate if stretched out because it has lower BC compared to the domed version. Interestingly in my tests hades are just as accurate as any doomed 177 pellets under 30 yards out of my FX and crosman guns. In Calm conditions I have no issues with all the holes touching at 35 yards or pellets on pellets at 20 yards. The 10.3 grain doomed pellets do have better BC not really not that big of n improvement. 
 
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In Puerto Rico we eliminate pests like iguanas and the Hades do not work like the domes one.

The domes are best for those pests.
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Jesfranco, 😊

that is very interesting. 👍🏼

Would you have some data to help me understand better under which conditions the domes kill better than the Hades?



• Caliber: 

• Power (the muzzle energy or the muzzle velocity of each pellet): 

• Typical ranges at which you see the domes killing better than the Hades: 



How much wind do you usually have?

Thank you! 👍🏼

Matthias


 
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Jesfranco said:
In Puerto Rico we eliminate pests like iguanas and the Hades do not work like the domes one . The domes are best for those pests.
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Hi Jesús,

Would you help me understand why the domes are better than the Hades?

And do you think slugs would even be better, or just as good as the domes?

Thanks! 😊
Saludos desde Perú. 👍🏼

Matthias
 
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So your gun doesn’t like hades 🤷‍♂️. It happens. Hades vs 25.39 domes out of my M3 and Maverick are practically equal out to 55 yards anyway. The domes are a little more consistent but it’s hardly noticeable. Haven’t tried them further but the hades aren’t even designed to be shot at long ranges. They have a worse BC than domed pellets . I think 70-75 yards and in they are a great choice to prevent over penetration and are very deadly. For further distances you will def be better off with domes.
 
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Hola Matthias !

I will talk about our experience in the field .

Our game is iguana and small feral hogs . The dome ones are a better all purpose pellets , also good for distance . The Hades are killer up to 35 - 40 yards , very good . The slugs are more deadly no matter distance , you must test your toy first . The slugs are like pellets , some barrels like them and others not , is a universal thing , ”continue testing until you find the ones your toy likes the batter“ .

Ah , slugs are for powerful toys , not break-barrels . Our results for hogs are hp , flat nose slugs or round cast ones for better penetration , remember shot placement . And for iguanas hp or round pellets for short or long distances and Hades for short to medium . For iguanas pellets (round , hp or Hades) are best because of price , you can use slugs but , prices are higher , we left them for hogs . I make my own , see photos .

Very important , I am not an expert , members here are the best for answering your questions , no doubt . What I am telling you is only a scratch of info , If you look for more in this site are tons .

Jesfranco

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Jesfranco said:
Hola Matthias !

I will talk about our experience in the field .

Our game is iguana and small feral hogs . The dome ones are a better all purpose pellets , also good for distance . The Hades are killer up to 35 - 40 yards , very good . The slugs are more deadly no matter distance , you must test your toy first . The slugs are like pellets , some barrels like them and others not , is a universal thing , ”continue testing until you find the ones your toy likes the batter“ .

Ah , slugs are for powerful toys , not break-barrels . Our results for hogs are hp , flat nose slugs or round cast ones for better penetration , remember shot placement . And for iguanas hp or round pellets for short or long distances and Hades for short to medium . For iguanas pellets (round , hp or Hades) are best because of price , you can use slugs but , prices are higher , we left them for hogs . I make my own , see photos .

Very important , I am not an expert , members here are the best for answering your questions , no doubt . What I am telling you is only a scratch of info , If you look for more in this site are tons .

Jesfranco

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Jesfranco,
¡francotirador! 😎

Thanks for your explanations. 👍🏼

You have some very exciting animals to shoot. In Peru things are a bit limited, depending on where you live.

Nice job on the slugs.
Glad to hear the Hades DO work out for you — at closer ranges. 👍🏼

Cheers,

Matthias
 
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Trucker3573 said:
So your gun doesn’t like hades 🤷‍♂️. It happens. Hades vs 25.39 domes out of my M3 and Maverick are practically equal out to 55 yards anyway. The domes are a little more consistent but it’s hardly noticeable. Haven’t tried them further but the hades aren’t even designed to be shot at long ranges. They have a worse BC than domed pellets . I think 70-75 yards and in they are a great choice to prevent over penetration and are very deadly. For further distances you will def be better off with domes.
Click to expand...
I use .25 hades, barracuda hunters and extremes at about 925fps (muzzle speed) at 75 yds all the time unless it is windy or I have to shoot past 80yds than I switch to slugs. I haven’t found anything that my panthera hunter just doesn’t like for ammo yet. At 900fps i was getting under 3/4” groups at 50yds with crow magnums. I have tried them in .22 with 4 different guns and 3 different .25s and this was the only one that would shoot them under 2”
 
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crowski said:
When I referred using the Hades, I only shoot springers and very rarely do I shoot past 45 yds.
I like the JSB 15.89 dome, same grain as Hades. Crow
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I have never tried to shoot a group with a good break barrel but I hope it is easier than the cheap ones! Lol my 75 year old neighbor has one of the $300 .22 Benjamins I should go get it and give it a try. The only thing that turns me off from them is for 300 you can get a avenger or notos wich aren’t great but still a pcp that i am hooked on
 
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IMO Hades and most other expanding pellets are almost worthless. Especially in spring guns. To expand they have to be driven faster than most springers can drive them from the get go. PCPs can expand them at close range but will fail to open at long-distance.

That's if their diminished BC allows you to hit the target in the right spot. Of course some PCPs could drive them supersonic or close to it to have enough velocity to open them at longer ranges. At those muzzle velocities accuracy degrades even more.

IMO most expanding pellets are really only worth using in PCPs at short range. For longer ranges their better off with slugs that retain more energy.

Bottom line a well placed dome is better than an expanding pellet that won't open or hit the mark at real world distances. Then again if your real world distance is inside of twenty yards. Have at it.
 
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Mycapt65 said:
IMO Hades and most other expanding pellets are almost worthless. Especially in spring guns. To expand they have to be driven faster than most springers can drive them from the get go. PCPs can expand them at close range but will fail to open at long-distance.

That's if their diminished BC allows you to hit the target in the right spot. Of course some PCPs could drive them supersonic or close to it to have enough velocity to open them at longer ranges. At those muzzle velocities accuracy degrades even more.

IMO most expanding pellets are really only worth using in PCPs at short range. For longer ranges their better off with slugs that retain more energy.

Bottom line a well placed dome is better than an expanding pellet that won't open or hit the mark at real world distances. Then again if your real world distance is inside of twenty yards. Have at it.
Click to expand...


Ron,

though I really don't like how discouraging and bleak your reply sounds — I think you're basically right. And how do you argue against reality? 🤦🏻‍♂️

In my study of hollow point (HP) performance the critical issue always has been their impact velocity. Low impact velocity — and the expansion didn't happen, or only very little.

And that impact velocity depends not only on their muzzle velocity — most guns can sling a standard .22 HP at 900 or 950fps.

It depends on what happens between muzzle and impact — which is determined by their ballistic coefficient (BC).

And the BC of most HP is LOW at best, and more often simply LOUSY.

So, yeah, Ron, I'd agree with your conclusion to use HP at closer ranges.



🔶 However, there is one other issue that expansion tests will not tell:
● A round head/ dome will slice through flesh much like it slices through air — it's high BC in air is also a high BC in flesh — meaning it will slip through flesh much easier — crushing less tissue in the process.

● A wadcutter, on the other hand, does not pass easily through the air (low BC), and neither through flesh. It will not slide as much as a dome, but rather crush a lot of tissue as it pushes its way through the soon-to-be corpse.

● A similarly shaped HP like the H&N Terminator or the JSB UltraShock would interact with flesh in a similar way.
So, hitting a quarry with a flat point rather than a round point will make for a more severe wound. And I find that good.

Matthias


❌ A couple of years ago I had a 4-part series here on AGN about terminal ballistics, with expansion data, the works:
What kills'em dead — the mechanics of killing.

❌4-Part Series: Ballistics, Expansion Tests, Lethality Mechanics, Hollow Points

4-Part Series on Ballistics, Expansion Tests, Lethality Mechanics, and Hollow Points I just posted a four-part series today that might be interesting to you: Here’s an overview and all the links: ● PART (1) Quarry: What kills’em dead – the Mechanics of Killing • What kills is a Permanent...
www.airgunnation.com www.airgunnation.com
 
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Mycapt65 said:
IMO Hades and most other expanding pellets are almost worthless. Especially in spring guns. To expand they have to be driven faster than most springers can drive them from the get go. PCPs can expand them at close range but will fail to open at long-distance.

That's if their diminished BC allows you to hit the target in the right spot. Of course some PCPs could drive them supersonic or close to it to have enough velocity to open them at longer ranges. At those muzzle velocities accuracy degrades even more.

IMO most expanding pellets are really only worth using in PCPs at short range. For longer ranges their better off with slugs that retain more energy.

Bottom line a well placed dome is better than an expanding pellet that won't open or hit the mark at real world distances. Then again if your real world distance is inside of twenty yards. Have at it.
Click to expand...
What gun do you have that won’t shoot hunting pellets accurately to 75yds?
 
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850renxrs said:
What gun do you have that won’t shoot hunting pellets accurately to 75yds?
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Depending on your definition of accurately, all of my Weihrauchs springers. I wouldn't trust any of them for hunting accuracy with any pellet at 75 yards. I've never found a hunting pellet that was as accurate as the guns favorite dome at 50 or even 30 yards. It's all a moot point because none of my springers will have enough velocity at those ranges to expand the pellets.

I'd like to see a skirted hunting pellet that can expand at 75 yards and still hit a one inch target. The impact velocity required to open most expanding pellets at 75 yards would require a muzzle velocity so high that they'd be too squirrelly to be accurate. Again that depends on your definition of accuracy. There's a big difference between a head shot on a squirrel and a body shot on a raccoon. With my springers I wouldn't try either at 75 yards. Again that's with any pellet. Look I'll pot shot birds at that distance but not fur. Well maybe I'd try bunnies. They're easy to kill, but I don't get them around here too often.
 
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