So what happens when you take an FX Impact M3 in .22 cal and wind it up to shoot as fast as it possibly can shooting the heaviest ammo available? Well you get this.....
https://youtu.be/rNfbosYAe-8
https://youtu.be/rNfbosYAe-8
FX Impact M3 maxed out slinging heavy slugs? You gotta see this....
- Thread starter UpNorthAirGunner
- Start date
Great video! Very good information. Convinced me on the utility of the harmonic barrel tuner. Also, those Javelins look good.
Question: is the 1050 fps velocity where those slugs perform the best even before the harmonic adjustment and that's why you shoot at that velocity....or you wanted to shoot at 1050 fps and you needed the harmonic tuner to make sure the slugs perform well at your particular chosen velocity?
For example: JSB's perform best at 880fps. With the harmonic tuner now you can dial in JSB at any velocity (up 150 fps or down 150 fps ) as long as that velocity does not cause fatal flight issues..like wobbling?
Question: is the 1050 fps velocity where those slugs perform the best even before the harmonic adjustment and that's why you shoot at that velocity....or you wanted to shoot at 1050 fps and you needed the harmonic tuner to make sure the slugs perform well at your particular chosen velocity?
For example: JSB's perform best at 880fps. With the harmonic tuner now you can dial in JSB at any velocity (up 150 fps or down 150 fps ) as long as that velocity does not cause fatal flight issues..like wobbling?
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Great shooting Chris! Looks like you’ve made harmonic tuning a lot easier. I’m getting about the same accuracy with my .25 Impact X w/PP and NSA 43.5 at 885 to 890 FPS. But it’s taken me hundreds and hundreds of slugs get there. BZ on the tuner!!!
Mike
Mike
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With slugs I have found this concept of a specific FPS is a bit flawed. If your slug is stable, there a MANY different accuracy nodes you can find across MANY different velocities. With pellets, I have found similar, but the issue is that you will hit this point when some or ALL of your shots are spiraling if you push them too fast. You want to stay away from that zone and is why a lot of competitive shooters go down to the mid 800s.
The way you tune with the harmonic tuner is:
#1 set your gun up to find that perfect balance of regulator and hammer spring tension (valve adjuster all the way out).
#2 Is the ammo stable? Crank up the velocity. If you have a scope camera that can do 240 frames per second shoot a 10 shot group and watch for wobble or down right spiraling.
#3 Put 5 to 10 dots on a paper and put it out at 50 yards. Start at zero hashes on the tuner and shoot 5 shot groups for all those dots.
#4 Rotate the tuning weight 2 hashes each group. You will see the groups tighten up and then open up and then also change orientation. This is evidence that barrels move up and down in waves AND oscillate.
Find the best two dot groups and try one hash mark on each side of that setting and you can often tighten it up even more by going even a 1/2 hash up or down from your best group. If the ammo is stable, I have been able to find a harmonic accuracy node at every velocity I have tried. Thus why I think this concept of "what velocity does XYZ" projectile like best is flawed. Every gun is different and the harmonic signature of every gun is different. Every shooter holds their gun different. All of that goes into the black magic of harmonic barrel tuning.
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Thanks Mike! Ya if nothing else, this method saves a TON of ammo! I am lazy when it comes to tuning and I like things being easy. Plus I have interviewed a few high level competitive precision shooters who hand load their own ammo (powder burners) and they will tell you that when you find that perfect primer / powder charge combo that gives you super tight SD / ES with your velocities - DON'T MESS WITH IT! That was an AHA! moment for me in all of this....
Up to this point we have been tinkering with our power wheels and hammer spring settings chasing a harmonic accuracy node, but what we are also doing during that process is ever so slightly changing the harmonic signature of the platform by changing the velocity. The harmonic tuner isolates JUST the barrel harmonic aspects of the platform. During this discovery process I have become a disciple of SINGLE VARIABLE TESTING!
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Well done! And thank for taking to time to do this. Now i just have to wait for fx to come out with some of the tunerx for my 2 Mavericks. Crazy hit on the golfball!!
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Very nice free hand shooting there!! Can’t wait for all the M3 refinements shows up in a crown!
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Years ago I did some benchrest shooting and we used barrel weights and vibration dampners. Awesome to see it coming to Airguns now! Great job with your FX partnership and making this happen! Do you know approx how much that system is going to cost when its released?
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You know that gun is a $5000 investment by the time you acquire all the bells and whistles!
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William, this is definitely nothing new. It is old technology that has been proven on many rifle and pistol platforms in competition shooting as Chris mentions in his video. Also, as he eludes to and my sentiments echo, that airguns will benefit even more from this technology than powder burners that have proven its effectiveness. This is due to the relatively lighter weight materials that our barrels are made of and the greater vibrations. The barrels flex much more and transfer vibrations more. I also would make an educated guess that at the slower speeds our projectiles travel at, the waveform of those vibrations are even larger. This means that if the pellet leaves the barrel on the high part of the node and then the next one on the low part of the node, the point of impact difference between the two is going to be even greater than the faster stuff. I am not an expert by any stretch, but have been around this stuff both in and out of the military for a long time. Anything you can do to reduce that waveform and make sure that the pellet or slug leaves the barrel at the sweet spot in that waveform is going to help quite a bit in shrinking our groups. I think it is pretty awesome that its being introduced to our sport and have no doubts that the top competitors will be using this technology pretty quickly. Hopefully I will too.
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Awesome! I think this is a big saver for time. Or just really dialing in on accuracy. Great job! Now just need to get it setup for 1/2-20UNF and sell like hotcakes to many many people!
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Curious, is the tuner attached the barrel (CF sleeved barrel) or the inner or outer sleeve? Maybe in the Near future you can break it down for us to see.
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You 100% see change in harmonics due to temperature change. Hell, you see harmonic differences by putting a sun shade on your scope vs NOT having sun shade. Every little thing affect harmonics. My friend Dan Lowe who competed in the Brazil Olympics, shot for the ARMY Marksmanship Unit and got into airguns and then turns around and wins big bore at EBR was telling me that they literally clock and mark EVERY SINGLE BOLT with white paint on their rifles to ensure every single thing stays the same as to avoid harmonic differences. That was my approach in designing this device was to be able to adjust and manipulate the harmonic signature of your platform at the most microscopic level.
Furthermore, this may sting to talk about it a bit, but it is why Ted Bier didn't do that great at RMAC a few years ago. HIs suppressor wasn't tensioned down. In Ted's defense that reason was real and replicable. PJ Clark from Wisconsin Airgunners and I had been doing quite a bit of research in even changing your suppressor to the next size large just to see what affect it had. Just moving from an Tanto to a Sumo changed groups a lot at 50 rounds and beyond. There were a bunch of people online saying it had to do with airflow around the projectile (which I think is total malarky) when in actuality it has everything to do with the fractions of an ounce of weight change at the muzzle. This reinforced my findings of shifting the center of gravity just microscopic amounts can change your POI and thus being able to control it. The dampening aspects we baked into this was based on a TON of research I did with Limbsaver deresonator devices and even rubber drain pull plugs put onto airgun barrels. Years went into this project. So cool to finally have it OUT!
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It is integrated into the OEM shroud. The CF Sleeve is actually a really cool design where it is sandwiched in the barrel kit housing between the barrel liner and the outer steel housing creating a bit of a tensioning AND stiffening aspect. The CF also ads dampening to the overall barrel harmonic signature and then we added additional dampening elements on the outside of the barrel kit housing within the shroud. It all works together to get the results you see in my video.
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