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Tuning Dwell time questions

Trying to get a better understanding of where dwell time fits in the tuning process. I understand that at best you are just wasting air if the valve is open after the pellet has left the barrel. Working with Delta Wolf so all is electronic.

1) Is the acceleration of the pellet linear? If yes then I can take muzzle velocity/2 x dwell time to calculate where the pellet is in the barrel when the valve closes.

2) Is there an optimal distance from the muzzel to close the valve to reduce turbulence, etc.? Don’t really care about saving air at this point.
 
Hopefully I can not muddy the water, here.

There is a misconception by some that the DW valve is electronic. It is not. There is a solenoid that the gcu applies power to that draws a hammer in to strike the valve stem. The gcu creates a pulse at the selected voltage, for the selected time(dwell) to create a very specific amount of total energy applied to the solenoid. You could look at it as a very controllable spring to drive the hammer... still mechanical valve, though. There are some advantages though. The hammer will always have the same stroke, but there is NO preload and the movement is virtually frictionless, and the speed of the hammer can be very high without hammer bounce issues.

Soo... I really don't know how you would calculate the pellet position in the barrel at valve closure but the standard tuning stuff still applies. The higher the reg pressure, the faster the pellet will accelerate, so shorter pulse of air equals more efficiency for given velocity. What Daystate has given for your tuning info is a reg pressure number in the Factory mode that it expects for calculation purposes. It's VERY high so that all the projectiles you are likely to use will be covered at the velocities it is capable of. These are NOT optimum for best performance of MOST of what you'll shoot. The way that I've approached it it to lower the reg pressure to the point that it will only make a few ft/sec over the target velocity, no matter how much dwell and voltage are applied, then back them off to the target velocity. The voltage and dwell are almost interchangeable for varying , but you should stay a bit away from max voltage (88 v, I think) to be safest on electronic components. Lowering the reg pressure will give an error INDICATION when in Factory mode on early models but in no way is an actual problem. It just has to calculate in a different part of the curve. As a note on rifles I've shot so far, when the reg pressure is high, the ES will likely be higher and first shot after sitting will likely be slow. The plus is that you can use about any projectile it's capable of launching with one reg setting.

All that said, there are differences in the accuracy from different reg pressures. Harmonics and pellet obturation are likely suspects. Chasing power is easy but chasing best accuracy may require a bit of tinkering. 

I realize I didn't directly answer your questions but feel they are based on a conception of an electronic valve. I hope I've enabled a visualization of the system so you can adjust it with more confidence.

Bob
 
Bob

Thanks for correcting my statement on the valve and all of the information is useful to me. I am chasing accuracy and targeting around 890fps with 33gr .25 cal. I can get this velocity with many combinations of voltage and dwell and was wondering if there was any rule of thumb. Hit it hard for a short time or go the other way. Sounds like it is trial and error on harmonics from here?
Regulator is set at ~145-150 depending on the temperature.
 
150 bar should be a great start point. I tend to stay near the middle of the voltage... say, below 81v. I haven't personally seen an advantage in moving one parameter vs the other. Dwell seems to give greater changes, to me. The idea of more voltage over less time or less voltage over more time.... just haven't really seen a difference. Reg pressure, however..... huge differences.

Bob
 
Maybe the Mk2s need more speed to be accurate, but the King Heavy (Mk1) seem to like 855 to 870 FPS. I have mine set at Dwell 2995 micro-sec and Voltage at 82.5 volts. Reg at 132 bar. The gun averages about 860, and first shot after turn on is normally in the 853 to 855 region. Very accurate at that speed...

Mike
 
I don’t have the DW but I thought you just dial the speed you want and shoot. Well at least that is what was in the YouTube video. This sounds a bit more involved, but doesn’t sound too different than RW.



also didn’t realize there is still a physical hammer. Wish the computer system on the daystate would hook up with the L2 hammer less system. 
 
Qball

There are two modes, factory and advanced. The factory mode is where you input the velocity you want and the gun figures out the settings via trial and error. It works but currently has some limitations that limit it’s usefulness for me. It takes too many shots to attain target velocity, once it has settled on the appropriate settings you cannot see what they are for future use, and if the gun powers down the whole process starts over. As a former programmer I can see a lot of potential with a few SW revisions. I posted an example using factory mode over a 100 shot string a few weeks ago if you want to see how it performs.

The other mode is advanced. In advanced mode you tune yourself by inputting a voltage for the hammer strike and a time (dwell) for how long the valve stays open. Thats what I am playing with now. Without much effort I was able to try 10 tunes in about two hours; couldn’t be much easier.

I never had a RedWolf but I believe it is very similar with the addition of a regulator and the built in chronograph.
 
Qball

There are two modes, factory and advanced. The factory mode is where you input the velocity you want and the gun figures out the settings via trial and error. It works but currently has some limitations that limit it’s usefulness for me. It takes too many shots to attain target velocity, once it has settled on the appropriate settings you cannot see what they are for future use, and if the gun powers down the whole process starts over. As a former programmer I can see a lot of potential with a few SW revisions. I posted an example using factory mode over a 100 shot string a few weeks ago if you want to see how it performs.

The other mode is advanced. In advanced mode you tune yourself by inputting a voltage for the hammer strike and a time (dwell) for how long the valve stays open. Thats what I am playing with now. Without much effort I was able to try 10 tunes in about two hours; couldn’t be much easier.

I never had a RedWolf but I believe it is very similar with the addition of a regulator and the built in chronograph.

Andy, did you see improvement in accuracy with the Advanced mode? I am glad that you are having success with your DW.
 
This is an old thread. I have found this article that explained a few things:


My 3 takeaways reading the above linked article:

1. Dwell Time. Keep lowering the dwell time to preserve air and lower noise. If the valve is still open when the pellet has already gone you are wasting air. It seams you want to close the valve much before the pellet even reaches the end of the barrel. I guess keep lowering dwell time until you no longer have the speed you want?
2. Hammer Voltage. The higher the regulator pressure the harder the hammer needs to hit or else the valve will close too soon.
3. Regulator pressure is obvious.

I guess 1-2-3 is a mix and if you change 1 you will change all 3 variables. Anyone, please correct me if I am wrong in any of the above.

It would be great if someone would post a step by step method.
 
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