Do not use Superlube Grease for PCP Handpump

[John "spysir" Blount]

For the 1st 20 years of modern pre-charged airguns in the U.S. 99% of folks used Trident

https://www.amazon.com/Trident-acc577-Silicone-Grease-2oz/dp/B0000DCVZL/ref=asc_df_B0000DCVZL/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=198063634469&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8814142403484176425&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9033724&hvtargid=pla-343141348794&psc=1

Never any issue ever.

Wasnt too many years back a major hand ump repair place told everyone to use motor oil which was again roven to be very bad advice.

An $8.00 tu of trident will last many many years. Nice for treating burns also.



John

 

[get2anthony]

Good to know and thanks, John. Trident is what I was going to order if I wasn't able to get to the bottom go the Super Lube ingredients. Trident looks to be 100% silicone grease (minus the fractions of teflon, and surfactants that are in Super Lube) and acceptable for o-rings for diving equipment.

 

[Elbowgrease]

I actually use silicone shock oil that you get at any radio control hobby shop. You can get it in different weights also. The stuff is very high quality. Never had any issues with it. As for grease I picked up some trident pure silicone grease. But as far as my hand pump goes I have only used the oil and its nice and smooth.

 

[Rodeo]

I use the RC 30 weight shock oil on my hand pump (AV G6). I used Hill Pump grease on the first rebuild and the pump was stiff and sluggish. Then I found out that I should use silicone oil on the pump. Pump was much smoother after cleaning and using the oil.

 

[dutoitk]

Hi Guys



Digging up an old discussion.



What type of synthetic grease can one use on the threads of air tubes and buddy bottles to prevent damage or premature wear of the threads. If not lubricated, the threads take a lot of wear when changing air tubes or bottles

From personal experience, I now know that silicon grease does not work as it causes seizing. Is there a non-flammable product on the market that can safely be used in high pressure areas.



Thanks

Kevin

 

[Bigragu]

https://www.amazon.com/Pack-100-Silicone-Treadmill-Lubricant/dp/B01MYGIH79

I recently used this product on my Airguns. I had to get some for the treadmill and thought I’d try it out. What I like about it vs the initial silicone oil I bought that was labeled for pcp use, was this stuff is thicker in viscosity, while the ones labeled for pcp use is closer to like the viscosity of 3 in 1 oil. The trident divers grease, I notice, quickly turns to a liquid state just from the warmth of your fingertips as you rub them together. Perfect for o rings as you really don’t want gobs of grease in your air tube or regulator washers.

Now, I have three levels of 100% silicone to pick from. The lightweight initial oil I bought, this treadmill lubricant, and also trident divers grease. If I ever rebuild a hand pump this treadmill lube is what I’ll use, as it will not only “cling” on better but not break down as fast as standard low viscosity silicone oil and that lightweight Trident grease. 

 

[get2anthony]

Superlube is what FX Airguns USA uses and recommends for airtube threads and O-rings. You can use it for all orings anywhere on the gun. I’ve even used it on my Hill Hand Pump MkIII without issue. 

 

[dutoitk]

Thanks for the replies so far.



I had been using Superlube multi purpose grease with PTFE (21030), but stopped after I read about the original posters issues with his Hill Pump.

I sent an email to Synco technical support and they recommended not using it with high pressure tanks.



What I have picked up form Technical data sheets and SDS.

21030 Multi purpose with PTFE: Fire rating 1. Not for pure oxygen environments. For use in almost all applications including metal to metal and orings.

92003 Silicone with PTFE: Fire Rating 1. Less applications. Mostly plastic, rubber and metal to plastic.

93003 Oring Silicone grease: Fire Rating 1. Orings, seals etc.

The fire rating worries me.

 

[get2anthony]

Hmm. If Synco is not recommending I will go back to Trident that John referred to above. I will also consult with FX Airguns on this as well. I will post what I find out. Curious as to the reasoning Synco might have given for not using with high pressure tanks?? It is approved for sealing vacuum chambers.

As far as the Fire Rating 1, that means it's pretty darn safe. According to HMIS, A Fire Rating of 1 means, "These chemicals include materials that will burn in air when exposed to a temperature of 1500 degrees F for a period of 5 minutes of less; and liquids, solids, or semi-solids having a flashpoint at or above 200 degrees F."

The SDS mentions that SuperLube Silicone Lubricating Grease (92003) was flash point measured at 572*F. 

Thanks for continuing this conversation. 

Cheers!

 

[dutoitk]

Probably find they are being very safe. They said I should use 93003 for orings in high pressure tanks.

I now use heavy weight silicon oil on all my orings. Think it is called diff or shock oil at the radio control car shops.

I have just ordered KRYTOX 205 for the bottle threads. Looks like it is bomb proof stuff.

 

[get2anthony]

All,

So again, I had to go back, review and investigate based on the most recent discussions. I have CONFIRMED with Synco that both 93003 and 92003 are acceptable for use with the o-rings, materials and pressures in most, if not all, PCP airguns and air tanks. These two products are Silicone Grease. The SuperLube O-ring Silicone Lubricant 93003 is 100% Silicone, and the SuperLube Silicone Lubricating Grease with PTFE 92003 is ~95% silicone grease with an emulsifier and PTFE as the remainder ingredients.

Most importantly, #21030 Multi-Purpose Synthetic Grease IS NOT COMPATIBLE. It is a Hydrocarbon Grease and will degrade most o-rings. Being a Hydrocarbon Grease it is indeed COMBUSTIBLE at high temps and pressures. Note: the Multipurpose Synthetic Grease is NOT Silicone grease. SuperLube does not equate Silicone.

When I first looked into this issue I posted the links to the MSDS with the SuperLube product numbers - much higher in this thread.

It clears up this issue for me and I hope it helps others. Happy Shooting!

 

[dutoitk]

That is great news and thanks for investigating further.

Unfortunately I have the multi-purpose grease 21030. Will have to put it far away from the air rifle bench.

 

[nervoustrig]

An open flame test confirms the Super Lube #21030 will indeed ignite and sustain a flame.



The annotated photo explains my observations compared to a basic silicone dielectric grease.



Bear in mind this is a deliberate apples and oranges comparison. The silicone grease is worthless as a metal lubricant. And the fact this particular flavor of Super Lube will burn is not a knock against it, just an observation that it should be used with caution if a source of ignition or extremely high temperatures are present. Per the technical data sheet, it has a flash point >428F (220C) and a fire point >572F (300C).

How or why any of these conditions would exist in a high pressure pump or PCP is beyond me. Years ago, before I knew any of this, I used it in a Benjamin pump rebuild. It gave me no issues, working until the final stage O-ring gave up the ghost. I didn't use it again for this purpose, not because of the flammability concern but because of its viscosity. I spoke to Duane Sorenson of Sun Optics who advised cleaning out all the old lube and using a good synthetic motor oil. In other words, the guy who designed the pump said use a lubricant with virtually the same flammability ratings as the Super Lube synthetic grease. So I did and I had no problems associated with the lube.

That's not to say I think either of them are great choices for that application, just that the technical data and my experiences do make me wonder if we are missing a critical piece of information when someone says they had a hand pump ignite. Granted, nowadays I only use 30W silicone oil in hand pumps or any dynamic O-rings in an air rifle. It works well, lasts a long time, and won't ignite. Good enough for me. For static O-rings, I use the dielectric grease above. Cheap and effective.

 

[spinj]

SuperLube 100% silicone grease is not the same as SuperLube synthetic grease. Each is different from the other. Most lubes for high-temperature applications contain 100% silicone and are labeled “food grade.” FX was correct in its recommendation, you just bought the wrong product of the brand, however.

 

[wolfgrw]

I don't have silicon grease where I live, only silicon spray. Do you think 700°C resistant molybdenum disulphide grease is safe? I've done a fire test with a lighter and it did not ignite.
I really need to grease my HATSAN pump...