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Definition of Magnum

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That would put that pellet at about 920 fps out of that rifle. If that were the case that group would be a one in fifty group.

Show us a ten dimes target from that rifle. 

http://oldspooks.com/agstuff/Targets/challenges/
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That rifle is packed to go to a friend, but I do have a couple other contenders for that challenge.

greyprimerswarmgen2_003.1613125229.jpg



The FPS you say sounds about right. Gamo claims 1300 with alloy pellets.
I don't get what ya mean by "one in fifty group" You mean it would take me 50 times to do it? No way, maybe 1 in 10 at worst.



Just waiting for a string of good days to practice, set up the cameras, etc.

25Y-dimechallenge001.1613124492.jpg


30 shots is a lot, but I've done 60+ shot events before, I think I can handle that part.
Just a matter of recording it.

I did this, 10 shots, with a $150 gamo "silent cat" .177, benchrest outdoors. Give me enough time on a fair day, I can repeat that regularly.

hn_ftt_177ammo2021a.1613124610.jpg


I hope to break Guinness record for longest air-rifle shot before I kick the bucket. About 150-meters if I recall. Requires open-sights and a very light .177 pellet.



In spite of all my pretty wallpaper, that's just a lot of talk until I do it. :) 

But proved more than once I'm a pretty good shot for someone who really still feels like a rookie shooter.

ravcondigitalbusinesscardDEC2020a.1613124869.JPG




Sorry readers for the side-bar. Pretty sure the OP's question's been answered by now. :)
 
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I intended to just break-in a new rifle, but it was going so well, decided to record a bit. It shot great out-of-the-box.

Not my best "evidence" video (which is rather a pain to setup), but here's another cheap break-barrel, at 20-yards benchrest:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKJIz9wu7Zs



I have no doubt I'll nail that dime-challenge, but it's not high on my list to triage. But when I do, you can sure bet I'll share it! :)



/exit stage

 
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Sorry readers for the side-bar. Pretty sure the OP's question's been answered by now. :)
Click to expand...

Well, sir, there wasn't any question in my post. Just a suggestion that the group you showed when you told the other poster to "aim small" was "cherry picked". Neither was there any reference what so ever to your abilities or qualifications (nor any statement of my qualifications, for that matter).

Let me show you the difference between a magnum spring rifle and a rifle closer to 12 fpe. Neither of these targets was "cherry picked".

Here is a target from my Diana 48 .22 shooting at about 18 or 19 foot pounds, thirty shots starting with a cold barrel in sequence, 25 yards. The last 28 of them touched a dime when aggregated on the same zero.

d48.1613140093.jpg


Here is a target I shot with my NOT MAGNUM D430L .177, thirty shots in sequence, warm barrel, no breaks, no sighters.

d430l.1613140224.jpg


That, sir, is the difference between a MAGNUM spring rifle and a NOT MAGNUM spring rifle.
 
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I have no doubt I'll nail that dime-challenge, but it's not high on my list to triage. But when I do, you can sure bet I'll share it! :)



/exit stage
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I'll be looking forward to it. Show me a target that looks like either one of those shot at 25 and not 20 yards with a spring rifle shooting more than 21 fpe in .22 or 16 fpe in .177 and I'll be impressed. Mind you there are people on this forum who can do it unsupported but not with a magnum rifle (I am not one of them anymore). So ...

You don't need to jump through all the video hoops. They are pointless. Either your word is good or it isn't. I figure it is.
 
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I was speaking of the original post, "definition of a magnum". Sorry about the confusion. My bad.



Every magnum I've used shot about the same as every non-magnum.
But I've only had two magnums (the gamo & a walther), so there's limit to my experience.


Sure it was cherry-picked. I'm not gonna show my worst. :)
But I have a trash-bin full of ones like it. Just about ANY air-gun and ammo will do that at 25-yards, in my experience.



Someone hollered out that Gamos can't hit a barn door, or such. Just had to show that even some el-cheapo guns can do just fine. :)



ALL the target pics above are at 25-yards.

The video is just a example, but yes, it is at 20-yards. It was something current and handy I had.



I have a few I managed to capture on film. But I hate the distraction and extra work of doing so. I gotta fine me a cute camera-girl in my 'hood who loves airguns.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnj7GXMed_V1UGiXLJZhyjw/videos



All my best, and thanks those who hung around for our side-bar. :)



Oh, and some excellent shootin' there @Cornpone, warmed up or not!



f
 
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Meh, You know from your own experience that shooting groups from a bench is about the rifle. Like I said there are shooters on this forum who can shoot groups like that unsupported. I'm not one of them but there are.more than one so I'll leave to you figuring out who they are. I don't want to offend some by naming only one. Seriously, there are many better shooters here than I am.
 
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OK, here's my take. Magnum simply means physically large. A magnum wine bottle has the capacity of two regular bottles. Look at the famous .357 magnum cartridge. It's larger than its ancestor, the 38 special. Therefore a magnum air gun is a gun that is significantly larger or heavier than most, regardless of power. Yes, they are more powerful, but that's just because they are bigger.

IMHO, any air gun over nine pounds is a magnum. That's because it's getting too heavy to lug around in the field. I have a HW100 carbine with a titanium bottle and red dot sight that weighs about 7 1/2 pounds. Even though it slings a 14 grain pellet downrange at 900 fps, I don't consider it a magnum. 




 
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The sole purpose of the .38 being made larger was for power. Magnum means power with any reference to guns and is even listed as such in the dictionary- "a gun designed to fire cartridges that are more powerful than its caliber would suggest". Size/weight has nothing to do with it in the least and I would imagine there are zero claims to a large or heavy rifle being a magnum unless its power output is the focal point. Even the 9.5lb, 43.5'' M1 Garand is not a magnum. 
 
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You are correct that magnum means power in reference to firearms, and is often defined as "a gun designed to fire cartridges that are more powerful than its caliber would suggest." 

But airguns are not firearms. They do not have cartridges. And what would you call an HW90 with a 12 foot pound tune? Is it still a magnum? My HW95 with a Vortek PG3 kit picked up about 2 foot pounds. It is now "more powerful than its caliber would suggest" and therefore qualifies as a magnum HW95. (LOL). 

Magnum is a relative term. You need a baseline value. The problem everyone has is deciding what the baseline is.

So that brings us back to my original definition of a magnum airgun: anything over 9 pounds. If I have to sweat lugging it around the forest, it's a magnum. A magnum wine bottle is just a bigger, fatter bottle.


 
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Since airguns are still considered by so many toys the terms gun and cartridge would have to be generic and simply not considered in the dictionary definition. A 12fpe would gun never be considered by anyone in modern times being a magnum regardless of weight, size or any other dimension. Notice how you are the only one that considers parameters such as size or weight a magnum yet? Does your 95 make the 20fpe or more mentioned by at least several others here? That is considered a magnum by many or most (LOL). Magnum never has nor will it even mean heavy for firearms, airguns, cartridges or anything else. Do a bit of research and you'll see the baseline and accepted parameters of what a magnum is. It will never refer to weight or size and wine has nothing to do with guns of any type and is a only part of the definition. It should be pretty clear that a magnum of wine is entirely separate and has no bearing on reference to guns of any type. The base line and first mention of magnum in reference to airguns belong to the FWB 124 a very light air rifle so there is another baseline you'll find if you do any research. The OP asked the definition of magnum here on an airgun forum, it is likely there is no interest in over sized wine bottles or size or weight of an airgun but you could ask. You could also try going into any number of gun stores and ask to see a magnum and see if they ask what weight or length gun you want or if they bring out a large bottle of wine (LOL)
 
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You are correct that magnum means power in reference to firearms, and is often defined as "a gun designed to fire cartridges that are more powerful than its caliber would suggest." 

But airguns are not firearms. They do not have cartridges. And what would you call an HW90 with a 12 foot pound tune? Is it still a magnum? My HW95 with a Vortek PG3 kit picked up about 2 foot pounds. It is now "more powerful than its caliber would suggest" and therefore qualifies as a magnum HW95. (LOL). 

Magnum is a relative term. You need a baseline value. The problem everyone has is deciding what the baseline is.

So that brings us back to my original definition of a magnum airgun: anything over 9 pounds. If I have to sweat lugging it around the forest, it's a magnum. A magnum wine bottle is just a bigger, fatter bottle.

Click to expand...

It is related to shooting and the common use of the term is related to power. It seems to have nothing to do with weight.
 
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Magnum, in regards to springers, means the rifle is among the most powerful compared to other springers. Which is usually around 20 fpe give or take a few fpe. 
I have a John in PA tuned RWS 54 putting out 22 fpe. Cocking effort is lighter than my stock 48 and is butter smooth. Accuracy wise it can hang with the best PCPs. It’s a joy to shoot a magnum springer and not feel any recoil like I would with a 48. One of my favorite guns to shoot. 
 
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While I would guess the definition of "Magnum" with regard to spring-air guns remains fairly constant over the years, which particular guns are/were considered "magnum" varies with time.

When I bought my Wischo/BSF 55n back in 1971, it's rated velocity of around 750 fps (0.177 cal.) seemed "Magnum" at the time (being listed as one of, if not the, 'fastest' SPRING-PISTON air rifles of the time. Then, of course came progressively more 'powerful' guns: FWB-124, Diana/RWS 45, HW80/Beeman R-1; each time reaching velocities thought unattainable a year previous until we are now significantly "more powerful" than any of those (maybe that has something to do with more scope and parts breakage than in the past?).

But to me, the first "Magnum" spring-air (well, not exactly, but it does start being a HW35) gun, and for sure the first time I saw the word "Magnum" in a description of an air rifle is (as written up in the 1968 Air Rifle Headquarters Catalog I happen to have laying right here on the table...) is "The 54 EL Magnum Barakuda" (priced at the time around $100 US). This is the ether injection gun rarely seen (and I assume ever more rarely shot) now-a days. In fact, due to worry about the gun's power levels possibly resulting in airgun legislation/restrictions (and perhaps the hazards associated with using/storing ether) ARH would only sell them to ARH clients that had already purchased a "sporting air arm" from them previously. I only knew of one person around here where I live that had one, and it was stolen (over 30 years ago) from him in a home burglary. I don't have a photo of one, but a search of "HW54EL" should result in more info/photos (possibly on this forum).
 
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Nice HW 54! I never have figured if it's supposed to be EL54 or 54EL (the ARH catalog stated "54EL", while W.H.B. Smith's book states EL54; I assume what's stamped on your gun answers the question)? I don't blame you for not wanting to shoot it (at least not with ether boost anyway).

I have often wondered if some Barakuda owners would charge the ether system before cocking the gun rather that after (I assume doing that would inject the ether behind the piston rather than in front?), resulting in no 'ether boost' at firing.

I suspect keeping the seals intact in a 54 might have been a bit of a problem (due to both the heat/pressure and possible effects of ether on the seal material). I wonder what types of seals were used in the later Daisy VL series guns, and how they held up to the pressure boost from the 'special' ammo/pellets they used? Were those VL series guns ever referred to as "Magnums"?

Anyway, the use of the word "Magnum" Barakuda in the '68 ARH catalog pre-dates the FWB-124. I don't recall ever seeing the HW35 listed as "Magnum" (in ARH literature or elsewhere).
 
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It is Barakuda EL 54 and again I never saw it listed as a magnum although I have no ARH catalogues. Some incorrectly call it a 35 Barakuda or some variant of that. Some 35's were converted using left over parts but it's not considered a Barakuda unless stamped as such. The only way it would qualify as a magnum is to augment/diesel it which is not what is necessary to fire it and only an option. I also mentioned never seeing the 35 listed as a magnum at any point. The only way the ether injection will work is after cocking so the vapor can get into the compression tube behind the ammo and in front of the piston. The VL would again not be a magnum any sense either airgun or firearm. As a firearm it is below 22LR velocity I believe as an airgun well below 20fpe. I believe Beeman catalogue may have the reference to the 124 as a magnum but not sure exactly where or when.
 
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