Conduction heating of compressed air.

I'm curious to know why I haven't been able to find any information on this. I can't be the only person to have thought of it, as a matter of a fact it was literally my first thought when a friend of mine showed me his new air rifle and all the random crap he can shoot with it. 

I'm a hard science and engineering guy but I'm also fairly well informed in the legal arena (at least as well informed as you can be with US law and 6 million pages of code that change every quarter) 

The federal definition of a "firearm" is essentially anything that uses a cartridge or can be readily converted to fire a slug from a cartridge. The definition of a "weapon" is a tool intended to maim or kill. Hence a muzzle loader, or other "gun" can be considered a weapon but is not considered a firearm as the slug and load are separate. 

Obviously laws vary immensely by state but based on that loose information and the fact that there are production air rifles obtaining close to cartridge level muzzle energy. I believe I saw one manufacturer claim a muzzle energy of around 500 ft/lbs or almost 700 joules. Which for compressed air alone is Impressive.

A .308 cartridge has a muzzle energy of a much more powerful 3500 joules or more owing to the massive pressure that can build up from nitro explosive detonation. This massive internal pressure is how solid fuel missiles can obtain such high velocities. 

At the end of the day both an airgun and cartridge round work under the same principle, a gas is expanded through a nozzle causing an acceleration of the slug in the opposite vector.

The difference is the pressure ratio. 100 grams of gas expanding through a nozzle at 200 bar vs 1500 bar or more is going to going to achieve a higher velocity. Higher pressure requires that more energy in the form of heat be added to the system. More heat energy, more expansion, higher compression ratio, faster slug. 

So... why not use electricity, or some other form of conductive heating to exponentially increase power with a minimal increase in complexity and would still not have to be treated as a firearm given that there is no combustion of gas or solid material. 

Instead of:

Compressed gas > regulator valve > nozzle

You would have compressed gas > regulator valve > heating chamber > nozzle

An electric current run through some sort of mesh would be reasonably efficient at adding heat, but there would obviously be some inefficiencies within the chamber and nozzle. Compressed gas leaving a tank is only at ambient temperature or very close depending on how recently it was filled, increasing the gas temperature from say 20 degrees C to 200 degrees C would be easily obtainable and increase power 10 times minus all our favorite variables like friction, nozzle choke, non laminar flow etc

There seems to be alot of competition for powerful air guns. 🤔 


 
The Govt will attempt to control anything they feel competes with their values and pressure placed upon them by voters etc. Eventually anything having a kinetic energy value of "x" will be regulated. 

And yes the idea is impractical when presented against other means of achieving the same goal. However, until such regulations exist I felt that the discussion was in the boundaries of discussion. 

A bicycle is impractical compared to traveling large distances in a motor vehicle, but becomes valid if I needed a way to travel without a driver's license or license plates for example. 

I wanted to discuss improving the muzzle energy of a compressed air rifle without combustion. I read the forum rules carefully and didn't feel that it was in violation of anything.


 
Derailing threads with politics is not good for discussion continuity. Nuff said bout that, so that I won't derail the thread myself.



OP, you must understand the law of the conservation of energy...i.e. energy cannot be destroyed, only converted from form to form., As well as the ultimate speed limit of the universe... The speed of light. The shot cycle of the PCP is so short that to effect any kind energy transfer from storage (battery or extension cord?) to transmission (wire harness) to transfer mechanism (wire grid?) In the plenum somehow interfacing with the air in the plenum without slowing or interfering with the laminar flow of the air in the plenum. Add to that the cooling that occurs due to Boyle's law (reduced pressure cools the gas as it leaves the PCP storage)... There are a few issues that beg resolution. Just how many watts or joules of energy transfer are you planning on adding to the shot cycle? Now, do it 50-100 times per tank fill. It will take more than a Prius car battery, for sure 

The melting point of lead is around 760-ish degrees. The o'ring melts far lower temps.

Theoretically, heat could be used to expand the air in the plenum. Anti-gravity is just about as likely, Imho. 
 
I'm aware of the problems posed with heat transfer in a sample that small. The overall heat increase would be minimal. Maybe 100 C. 

I was really just curious to see if there was anyone who had done any experiments or modifications involving gas temperature. The answer seems to be no... 

I apologize for being non specific. Every forum is different. I posted in general discussion for a general discussion about heat and airgun performance. 

I am a felon, I'm not allowed normal guns, hence my interest in air rifles as something neat I can work on without going back to the Pen for another 5.

If you are interested in discussing design and fluid dynamics then you can do so. If you feel I have a hidden agenda then you can avoid me and my posts. If a mod thinks this is a discussion best saved for a different forum then I'm open to suggestion. 


 
Here is a handy link to the AGN rules. The 3 LAWS - Airgun Nation

And the text copied directly from there:

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Good luck ;)
 
THE KEY WORD IS "FIRE" AS IN FIREARM. YOU KNOW THE MUSKETEERS WHO CARRIED A LIT FUSE TO SET FIRE TO THE BLACK POWDER IN THEIR MUSKETS. FROM MUSKETS TO TODAY WE HAVE IMPROVED THE FIRE the matchlock, wheel lock, flint lock, cap and ball, and the primer power in the early rimFIRES and today the PRIMER (fire). each involves FIRE and GUNPOWDER .The law doesn't say " Rapid heating of a the gasses in breathable air"
 
This older post appeared on my radar under the new format. Otherwise I would not have noticed it. I did not see anyone directly address the error in the proposal:

“…increasing the gas temperature from say 20 degrees C to 200 degrees C would be easily obtainable and increase power 10 times…” - FALSE

One response:
“…The gas laws clearly identify the linear relationship between temperature and pressure….” - TRUE

Another response:
“…The use of measurement units is suspect, as well…”- TRUE

For the linear pressure/temperature relationship to be true, we must be using an absolute temperature scale. Kelvin, not Fahrenheit or Celsius.

20 C = 293 K
200 C = 473 K

Rather than the 1000% pressure increase envisioned by the op, we only get a 61% increase in pressure. A 10x increase would require 4730 K = 4457 C = 8054 F.
No easy way to contain 8000+ degrees F. We are almost in plasma territory. The high temps need to be generated and released almost instantly, or else we get a melt down of the gun.