I'd like to hear from some folks on which they prefer in .22 cal. Looking for something that I'd feel comfortable using when I don't want to risk banging up my rifles with wood stocks, lugging my Carnivores out into the muck, or letting a friend/coworker borrow if they had a pest problem that they wanted to handle themselves.
AT44 or BT65 in .22?
- Thread starter JDShapp
- Start date
AT44, as BT65 is too heavy.
You refer to a problem of muck. Unfortunately air rifles lack the design of many other classes of weapon and therefore suffer from jams as a result of dirt, water, and my worst problem.....fine sand and dust that gets blown into magazines, bolt mechanism, trigger mechanism and barrel....then there is salt. I often have to dismantle and clean an air rifle after every trip to the beach or estuary area. If using a .22 I usually end up just taking a modified QB78; cheap and therefore little lost from damage/corrosion. I know of one gamekeeper who often has a QB78 with 4x32 scope literally knocking around in his pickup, and have heard of others who do the same.
You refer to a problem of muck. Unfortunately air rifles lack the design of many other classes of weapon and therefore suffer from jams as a result of dirt, water, and my worst problem.....fine sand and dust that gets blown into magazines, bolt mechanism, trigger mechanism and barrel....then there is salt. I often have to dismantle and clean an air rifle after every trip to the beach or estuary area. If using a .22 I usually end up just taking a modified QB78; cheap and therefore little lost from damage/corrosion. I know of one gamekeeper who often has a QB78 with 4x32 scope literally knocking around in his pickup, and have heard of others who do the same.
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Probably should have said elements rather than muck. Actually my idea is to keep it in a rifle bag in my jeep at the ready.
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AT44 is a bit lighter and the BT65 is too much gun for 22 cal unless you detune it to shoot slower.
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Looks like the AT44 is the best choice. Hopefully I can find a good bag to if it for storing in my jeep.
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I have an AT44 QE tact in .22. I chose the tact model because it's length is adjustable from 42" to 45" so you can make it shorter while carrying it and then quickly pull the shoulder stock out when needed.
The shoulder stock is also removable on the tact so you can use it as a 36" "pistol" instead. These guns have no recoil so I can aim fairly well without a shoulder stock when I'm using a bi-pod. The tact model also has more rails for lasers and lights etc.
I don't use mine anymore since getting my Cricket but while I did, I found it to be very good for the money. It is accurate, fairly consistent for an unregulated gun and powerful for the price / caliber. Importantly for me, the QE model is the quietest .22 rifle I have ever used. As backyard friendly as full sized air rifles get. Their ATP2 pistol is even quieter I believe. Extra mags are cheap too.
The downside is that the build quality is consistent with the price range. It is functional, not aesthetically pleasing but you won't worry about a few scratches. The one thing that bothers me is the automatic safety which is somewhere between annoying and an abomination.
The BT65 is slightly nicer but nothing that would make a real difference. It was far too long and cumbersome to consider for my needs. If anything would benefit from a bullpup design, the Hatsan QE range would be it.
The shoulder stock is also removable on the tact so you can use it as a 36" "pistol" instead. These guns have no recoil so I can aim fairly well without a shoulder stock when I'm using a bi-pod. The tact model also has more rails for lasers and lights etc.
I don't use mine anymore since getting my Cricket but while I did, I found it to be very good for the money. It is accurate, fairly consistent for an unregulated gun and powerful for the price / caliber. Importantly for me, the QE model is the quietest .22 rifle I have ever used. As backyard friendly as full sized air rifles get. Their ATP2 pistol is even quieter I believe. Extra mags are cheap too.
The downside is that the build quality is consistent with the price range. It is functional, not aesthetically pleasing but you won't worry about a few scratches. The one thing that bothers me is the automatic safety which is somewhere between annoying and an abomination.
The BT65 is slightly nicer but nothing that would make a real difference. It was far too long and cumbersome to consider for my needs. If anything would benefit from a bullpup design, the Hatsan QE range would be it.
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I was thinking of something more a long the lines of just the basic AT44-10 QE. It's not fancy, has the rail for a bi-pod, and its short enough that I shouldn't have any problem finding a bag to fit it. As for the auto safety, after using the Hatsan springers I have, its almost second nature for me to automatically release the safety.
Of course once I do get one I'll get to have fun going through all the .22 pellets I have on hand to find the best ones for it.
Of course once I do get one I'll get to have fun going through all the .22 pellets I have on hand to find the best ones for it.
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I have found the same, it in the same place and does not requires extra hand movement off the trigger like the BT platform. I have the wood stock, and despite its weight, its well balanced and shoulders really nice.
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Do Hatsan springers have the safety in the same place? The safety on the AT44 is at the back of the action and requires that you break formation to operate it.
I will ill never think auto safety is a good idea. The other extreme is having no safety at all like the Cricket which also isn't good. My Career 707 has the right idea. A nice switch that I lets me decide.
I will ill never think auto safety is a good idea. The other extreme is having no safety at all like the Cricket which also isn't good. My Career 707 has the right idea. A nice switch that I lets me decide.
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Ive had 4 Hatsan springers with the safety at the back of the action, 1000 and 95 exactly like the AT44. I like to put my thumb on the back of the action, so its second nature and does not require any additional movement of the hand, for me anyway. I dont mind that sort of auto safety so long as it allows no further positioning from shooting grip. The BT on the other hand, I cannot hit the safety from trigger position.
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Usually on my BT guns I flip the safety off before fully shouldering them. On my springers that safety action is more like pulling back the hammer on our old 12 gauge single shot, just nowhere near as hard. The AT44 is just a push of the thumb instead of a pull.
After seeing the one x-rays posted of some guys finger after it got in the way of an accidental discharge I'd rather be safe than sorry.
After seeing the one x-rays posted of some guys finger after it got in the way of an accidental discharge I'd rather be safe than sorry.
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A manual safety allows anyone worried about an accidental discharge to keep the safety on until it is time to fire, if they walk around with the gun cocked. There really is no advantage to auto safety.
Having the gun automatically turn the safety on every time I cock it has resulted many times in me missing a shot and my prey getting away because I forgot to turn the safety off. It also eliminates the possibility of a quick follow-up shot. I kept thinking that I would get used to it eventually but I never did. It was annoying and awkward every time so eventually I upgraded to something else.
It doesn't really matter on a springer because you have to reload every time anyway. If I pay extra for a repeater, I want to be able to fire quick follow-up shots or there is no point.
As an entry level PCP gun, the AT44 is worth a look. It is a good first PCP rifle that isn't terrible to pump and has spare air cylinders available. If it was between a .22 Marauder or the AT44, I prefer the AT44. In .25, it is not clear-cut.
If noise isn't a big part of the decision then I think the Sumatra carbine in .25 is a lot more gun that either the Marauder or the AT44 without a huge price increase. I love them almost as much as my high end air rifles. The carbine is nearly the same length and weight as a .25 FX Wildcat and way more powerful. Plus, the under-lever allows very quick follow-up shots. They are loud though.
Having the gun automatically turn the safety on every time I cock it has resulted many times in me missing a shot and my prey getting away because I forgot to turn the safety off. It also eliminates the possibility of a quick follow-up shot. I kept thinking that I would get used to it eventually but I never did. It was annoying and awkward every time so eventually I upgraded to something else.
It doesn't really matter on a springer because you have to reload every time anyway. If I pay extra for a repeater, I want to be able to fire quick follow-up shots or there is no point.
As an entry level PCP gun, the AT44 is worth a look. It is a good first PCP rifle that isn't terrible to pump and has spare air cylinders available. If it was between a .22 Marauder or the AT44, I prefer the AT44. In .25, it is not clear-cut.
If noise isn't a big part of the decision then I think the Sumatra carbine in .25 is a lot more gun that either the Marauder or the AT44 without a huge price increase. I love them almost as much as my high end air rifles. The carbine is nearly the same length and weight as a .25 FX Wildcat and way more powerful. Plus, the under-lever allows very quick follow-up shots. They are loud though.
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Sumatra is to nice for me to use it as a beater/borrower. Same goes for my wood .25 Marauder. Pretty sure I saw a way to modify the at44 awhile back to do away with the auto safety, but when I do get one I'll be leaving it stock.
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I managed to get an AT44 short, and since I was out of my usual splatter targets I used some old graph paper instead. So far it looks like my best pellet could be the JSB 18.1gr, but I used the last of my test pack. Second was a tie between Crosman HP, and H&N Hunters. But this was all at 30yds so I'm really curious to see how the groups open up at 50yds.
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While the extra fps and shot count looked nice. I went with the short because it fits me better I think. That and finding a case for it may be less difficult.
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After getting a new tin of JSB 18.1gr pellets I squeezed out a couple dime size groups at 30yds tonight. With some luck I'll get some chrony work soon to see where it stand and get a chance to see how it groups during daylight hours. Really beginning to like the lever action more and more.
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I do not know what makes the Hatsan an entry level pcp? Is it the price? I do not think that any pcp is an evtry level rifle as dangerous as they can be, and especially with the high power Hatsans.... I shoot all the time with Daystates, FX Bobcats, Evanix RSII, Jkhan, and many others, and those are not doing no more then a well tuned Hatsan can do, I have a AT44-short in .25cal short and hitting my targets at well over 120yards and 80yards is a routine shot. I can not even think about the last time that I shot under 50yards. A BT65 in .22 is way too much. If you took the time to tune and or to regulate it, It will be a very nice shooter. Is it a FX, Or Air Arms piece of art? No its a rock solid hunting rifle that Hatsan went thru extreme measure to target a price point that can be affordable to many, with the same accuracy and power as others in the high end market. I would wait cause their 2016 line up is yet another example of good things to come.. If I were you I would look into the Bull Boss in .25cal
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