Are Kral Air Guns under rated?

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Perhaps a valid reflection ? ... perhaps not ?

Look where EVANIX out of KOREA is at here some @ 7-8 years later. HATSAN of Turkey pretty much the same thing.

Pound the promotion for a few years, get some high profile distribution and key folks to talk them up & make new models pretty quickly to keep ahead of brand name stagnation. **** YET all along provide nearly NO parts or pieces & very limited stateside servicing to the general public.



There still around but only a shadow of there former self it would appear. Very few dealers any longer etc ...



So a valid question could be asked ... WHY ?



Just a conversation here .....



Scott S
 
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Qball- what guns from Kral have you had?

No, not Hatsan. Kral. What parts could you not find?? 



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I don’t have any Kral because back when I look at them they has zero parts available anywhere Or Google can find. Even as of 5 minutes ago there are scantly a dozen parts available at pyramid. I could be lacking in google foo but I can’t find parts for them.



crosman and FX on the other hand have exploded diagrams of every single gun and part so I just need to find the part number and order directly. No Google foo is even needed nor unknown third part parts. This is kind of service and parts availability I like to have for the guns I buy. Why? Because I once a while F* up my guns and need parts. Where do you get a whole trigger assembly for any of the kral guns? 



correct me if I’m wrong about Kral, I’m happy to be wrong. 


 
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I think you'll be seeing Kral around for a long time. Crosman/Benjamin is getting parts for their guns made by the Kral cousin Reximex. Triggers and valve components are interchangeable but the majority of Benjamin gun is specific to them. Kral just invested in a new production facility that I doubt anyone that was planning on flooding the market and ducking out would have done. They are also listening to buyers and making upgrades to models as needed. You will start seeing them in more competitions. They are very eager to grow the US market and support it. 



Here's the new facility. 

IMG-20201007-WA0011.1638291839.jpg

 
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I think you'll be seeing Kral around for a long time. Crosman/Benjamin is getting parts for their guns made by the Kral cousin Reximex. Triggers and valve components are interchangeable but the majority of Benjamin gun is specific to them. Kral just invested in a new production facility that I doubt anyone that was planning on flooding the market and ducking out would have done. They are also listening to buyers and making upgrades to models as needed. You will start seeing them in more competitions. They are very eager to grow the US market and support it. 



Here's the new facility. 

<img src="
IMG-20201007-WA0011.1638291839.jpg
" />//www.w3.org/2000/svg%22%20viewBox=%220%200%20210%20140%22%3E%3C/svg%3E
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Great to see another manufacturer stepping up and make the investment so we the consumer will have another good option with good support like crosman and FX. Once they get their act together I’ll definitely take a look at their offering as long as they don’t jack up their price. Crosman has many very inexpensive guns with fantastic support so hope kral can follow suit. 
 
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Under rated .... ????

That required what a given brand is rated RELATIVE TOO for it to give it a degree of relativity.

Dollar spent, performance for said dollar ....favorable.

Long term ownership with service / parts down the road years from now .... Likely none.

What you get for what you pay, time and use requiring service and parts like any mechanical devise for long term ownership or to those buying used years later .... Totally bad investment of ones money.

Simply like many brands and types of products sold, a near disposable product sold for those not willing / wanting to invest in better gear and manufacturers that will be here years from now settling for what my dollar buys today.



No I'm not bias ! .... Realistic and practical YES
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I agree totally. 👍👍 Try getting parts for a nova Vista air rifle aka avenger, Aspen, liberty,or origin. There's not a whole lot of parts available for the Sumatra either. Chinese and Korean air guns just don't have the support of say a cross man or a FX.
 
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If it matters Turkey moved from the lira to the dollar. Weak economy. 

COVID Destroyed shooting sports. Ammo and reloading is both difficult and expensive now. Airguns are in vogue. I would think Turkey if possible, would want some of the US market. I don’t think they are after the FX or Daystate market yet. 


Harvard Business called American the Walmart nation. We will sacrifice quality and accept lesser durability for price. Price point is America. Benjamin sells “craftsmanship “ at a favorable price point with Remimex guns. 

You may disagree with that marketing strategy. But, they think it will work. 

Troy believes he can find a niche in the growing airgun market. And it is growing. That is American business. Put your capital at risk for profit. Good for him. If they do indeed improve he prospers. 


 
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I just checked with PA. They have a lot of Kral parts available. The debate about part availability is a non issue.
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They have them today ... what about a year or years down the road when the majority of them in use most likely are going to need them ?



That is really the crux of many statements made ... STATING THEY HAVE PARTS NOW is a distraction on the conversation IMO.
 
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Business question. How long should I be required to carry an inventory of spare parts for a 500 to 700 dollar air gun? It cost me to stock and maintain spares.Five ten fifteen twenty years? Keep the spares when repair cost exceeds the value of the gun? Guns at this level are disposable when repair exceeds value. Honda says ten years on motorcycles. 


Most people do not rebuild their old guns. Minor repairs maybe. Gunsmiths charge for services. Now if a model stays current you are in luck. Spares cover many years. FX good luck. Change is faster than women’s fashion. So how long? People want current models. Few hoard old air guns.
 
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Troy Hammer is the go to guy for all things Kral.

I sent Troy 3 types of my 25 calibe cast bullets, he tuned my 25 Bighorn to get 903 FPS average for the first magazine, the 2nd magazine averaged 902 fps. And it was not a cliff tune.

Troy thought that was pretty good, but he did not give himself full credit, those roundnose are 47.7 grain bullets that was 92 FPE for the highest shot.

This was with the MpMolds roundnose boattail bullets. When I read the message from Troy, he had written 46 grain roundnose bullets, but the only round bullets of the three types actually weigh 47.7 grains. Evidently I did not label them before the wife sent them out.

I will say it again, Troy Hammer is the go to guy for Kral airguns.



Roachcreek



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Business question. How long should I be required to carry an inventory of spare parts for a 500 to 700 dollar air gun? It cost me to stock and maintain spares.Five ten fifteen twenty years? Keep the spares when repair cost exceeds the value of the gun? Guns at this level are disposable when repair exceeds value. Honda says ten years on motorcycles. 


Most people do not rebuild their old guns. Minor repairs maybe. Gunsmiths charge for services. Now if a model stays current you are in luck. Spares cover many years. FX good luck. Change is faster than women’s fashion. So how long? People want current models. Few hoard old air guns.
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think you just pointed out what Motörhead is trying to say, these are disposable guns. If you expect that then Kral gun could very well be under rated disposable guns. 


going back to crosman as example they sell parts DIRECTLY, not some reseller who would rather use the space for items that sells all the time. You can easily find parts for crosman gun well over 10 years old, they will sell the parts until they are no longer made and completely sold out. FX is the same way, they will sell old parts as long as they still have some no matter how long it has been. Just give crosman a call and see for your self. I fully expect to be able to get parts for my crosman guns 10 years later, they may be new but designs are old already and all cost less than $450 dollars each. So far FX has been stellar also but I don’t have an old FX gun. 


this is a distinct advantage crosman and FX have because they are a true manufacturer with their own service center/warehouse. Most of the other brands are not on the same playing field when it comes to services and parts availability. At least none I know of. 




then again it’s your money and spend it how you want, we are all old enough not to give a rat’s tail about what other people think of what we spend our money on. Like the old saying: Opinions are like assholes, everyone’s got one. 
 
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Point well made. I get it. They, Krals may shoot well. Provide fun and be the new toy for awhile. But in the end they simply fail and either get fixed or set aside due to cost. While the upper end guns go on and have an extended service life, as their value declines more slowly. Better repair to value ratio. Heirlooms maybe? 


Crosman has not not upgraded some of their guns for decades. Stocking repair parts here would be cheap.


But I think it is unreasonable for consumers to expect to have parts for any gun indefinitely. Especially lower end guns that are disposable after a life of maybe ten years at most. Have you noticed how British and German guns have such long production runs. Biggest change was a regulator in Britain. Designs are well dated, even if functional. RAW new?No Theoben of yesterday. 


Same with Turkish guns. Bulk are a decade plus in age. Not all. But most. I think parts and support must factor into this. 


FX appears to run counter to this. Multiple models. Rapid change. Moving technology. Parts nightmare unless well automated. But you can’t argue with their growth and expanded market share. And I see older 500s at matches. Still running. 

Troy will sell his Krals. And get more. They serve a market niche. Not everyone is committed to this addiction to spend more. And he knows how to get the best from them. He will fix them until they either buy something else or quit the game. For that he deserves ever penny he makes. He has found his calling for now. Place for everyone. He is lucky, most people in America dislike what they do. At least he is passionate about it.







 
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I don't see the relationship between being an "under rated" brand vs the availability of parts or service for the rifles. What models and parts dealers choose to carry is up to them not Kral. Is the average air rifle owner going to shoot 20K plus rounds a year and wear out parts so fast that this should be a concern to them? 

They are certainly "under represented" on this forum and in airgun forums in general. Some brands built their reputation on the competition circuit Kral's who primary focus is in the shotgun market instead has chosen to built airguns inspired by the higher end brands and make them more affordable. Does the average first time airgun buyer care which model won the EBR or RMAC? Does he or she also want to spend $1,500 plus on their first pellet rifle? 

The Kral's I have shoot great for a great price which is why I have them. If other factors about the brand are influencing your purchase decision that is fine but that has nothing do with the quality of the rifles or their overall value relative to their cost. 
 
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I just checked with PA. They have a lot of Kral parts available. The debate about part availability is a non issue.
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They have them today ... what about a year or years down the road when the majority of them in use most likely are going to need them ?



That is really the crux of many statements made ... STATING THEY HAVE PARTS NOW is a distraction on the conversation IMO.
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WHAT? A distraction from the conversation? YOU brought up the parts issue. I proved your point invalid!!!!!! Take your L and move on.


 
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Nothing against Troy or anyone else that is trying to find a niche to earn a living with, Good luck to him.....really. In my opinion it is a fools errand. No dealer , distributor or franchise holder can economically provide product support without the manufacturer's support. At the moment Kral, Hatsan or Snowflake in China do not support that business model. Their business model is build and sell cheap with no product support. These products rarely shoot well out of the box. If however an end user is prepared to accept this limitation and is also prepared to invest both time and money to these inferior products to make them shoot acceptably, then go for it, but what you cannot do is to state that it is economically viable. It is not. I guarantee that the cost to do that will exceed the cost of a new Daystate or FX. I do this myself. I bought a Snowflake PP700SA. In fact I bought two. The first one leaked like a sieve and the regulator did not regulate. I gave it back to the dealer who sent it back to the distributor for repair. Three months later it came back with the same faults. The dealer gave me a new one. Guess what, when the tank pressure approached 180 bar that gun leaked. In the end, I invested both time and money to make the second one work correctly, but I did this with wide-open eyes. I really like the weight and feel of that gun and there are no others with those attributes that I like.
 
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