Altaros M2010 New PCP Airgun for 2023

[Altaros]

But I these guns like the M24 are kind of waste of knowledge. Not sure about the reliability of these guns but I think the construction and the valve are not so bad from the theoretical side.

I kind of agree with you on that. This technology would deserve a full investment in the overall sophistication of the whole from the start. On the other hand, we are a very small company compared to FX for example. It produces what we have the possibilities for at the given moment and finance capital, since the company has never used any credit or involved investors.

Somewhat interesting description for a valve which, from a physical point of view and from real data, is the best that has ever been produced and due to the construction it will be very, very difficult to overcome, but I take your point of view
The point is that the most effective system can be achieved by maximally limiting the parasitic space between the valve and the projectile, and it is not much better to reduce this space more than when the wall of the valve directly presses on the projectile. At the same time high performance can be achieved maximum flow into the barrel. Well, here the hole for the barrel is always the size of the barrel, so again this hole cannot be enlarged any more.
if I didn't know that this is the best system that can be according to current knowledge, We wouldn't have invested tens of thousands of dollars to get panthets in the US.

e. I have now and Impact with 800mm barrel and I need to tell you the M24 is much more stable and less hold sensitive during shooting with 40grain slugs. Not sure about the valve open times but I assume the M24 has a very low valve opening time as it has much less recoil than the Impact. Also for first I was like only 600mm of barrel? Yes the M24 with the 600mm is much less hold sensitive but maybe it could be more effective and use lower reg pressure and have higher shot count with a 700mm one.

thank you for this information, which has not yet reached us. I haven't had the chance to shoot with the new FX impacts with more power yet, but what he says makes sense.
The M24 valve opening speed is very fast (short time for full opening), as the pressure helps to open quickly, at the same time, thanks to this, the firing pin is very light and moves only 12mm when released.
At the same time, it is located exactly in the axis of the barrel and, best of all, it moves in the direction of recoil. So, again, an ideal design in all respects, even better than firearms, where the firing pin goes against the recoil.
So against FX impact it is something completely different and all these elements certainly contribute to a much calmer shot. On the other hand, you experienced this with the aforementioned bad plastic stock. When you experience the M24 in a robust aluminum chassis, the shooting experience is many times better.
LW is able to deliver a 700mm barrel to order, but it is also a matter of the fact that the M24 is built according to its real model and therefore also with regard to appearance and design, and M24 SWS firearms primarily had a barrel length of 600mm.
If you use a 700mm barrel, of course the performance will increase. We are talking here about 10-15 m/s for 40gr slugs.
We will deal with models with a longer barrel in concepts that will not be built directly according to some real model

 

[Altaros]

This gun (M24) is a great conception I think excepting maybe the unstable pressure around the barrel. It can be a great stuff but its screaming for higher quality materials (steel,etc) instead of cheap plastic and aluminium. Yes I know that will/would push the price up but trust me there are lot of people who are okay to pay a bit more for the quality instead to get disappointed for still high price. Me personally would buy the M24 (or any other your gun) if it would have a universal magazine for any slug and higher shot count with slightly better overall quality.
So now I am curious about this new model if its excluding some upper mentioned "problems" non-perfectness. Looking forward to get it into my hands and see how is it going.

thank you for the overall summary. I have a similar opinion on it and I believe that we are gradually working towards the M24 model that you would like.

Originally, I wanted a rifle that would be technologically high and at the same time affordable. The M24 concept was created around 2011, just like the prototype, and it fulfilled this requirement in the first series.

From the beginning, however, I had a vision for the model to be perfect in all respects, i.e. including top-quality workmanship and materials. I would like to implement this vision for the year 2023 - 2024, as the technological side of the matter has already been proven in the real market environment and it is time to offer a model that will not only be at the cutting edge technologically but also in other non-technological parts.

 

[Airfuture]

thank you for the overall summary. I have a similar opinion on it and I believe that we are gradually working towards the M24 model that you would like.

Originally, I wanted a rifle that would be technologically high and at the same time affordable. The M24 concept was created around 2011, just like the prototype, and it fulfilled this requirement in the first series.

From the beginning, however, I had a vision for the model to be perfect in all respects, i.e. including top-quality workmanship and materials. I would like to implement this vision for the year 2023 - 2024, as the technological side of the matter has already been proven in the real market environment and it is time to offer a model that will not only be at the cutting edge technologically but also in other non-technological parts.

I hope your new rifle will be more advanced than the Skout Epoch (if that's even possible)

 

[Peashooter]

at the same time affordable

That mean a lot to me on a fixed income thats not terrible high ( pension )

Dont need a Pagani airrifle, i can make do with a VW golf GTI rifle just fine, it will still get me there.

 

[explorer]

Since Explorer brought up a lot of things I want to respond to, this post will be long.

To Explorer
Thank you for your feedback on our M24 rifle. Since some of the information is written in a very negative way, I also want to include the opinions of our other customers, as others do not see the negatives mentioned by Eplorer in such a harsh way. At the same time, I will add my perspective on the matter, as a designer and shooter who has been using the M24 for 12 years.
However, there are also very interesting observations in your post that no customer has written to us yet and I will comment on them as well.


Certainly some customers will prefer another rifle for the reason that they want a higher shot count. I agree on this, it is due to the fact that we mainly create products that are special compared to the normal mainstream. At the same time, we are trying to change the paradigms of the industry itself. My prediction is for the future, not the immediate present. I myself remember when I solved the shot count, which was about 5-6 years ago. But I'm usually 2 years ahead of the current trend. While most had a power of around 40-50J and shot pellets, I already had a rifle with a power of 70-80J and shot slugs at hundreds of meters.
the current development will uncompromisingly lead to the fact that people will have to decide whether they want to have a shot count and be satisfied with some limited performance, or they will stop dealing with the shot count, since the most accurate systems will use such a huge amount of air that a bottle on the rifle will only for hunters in the form of a few shots. For example, as is the trend with the FX Panther, where the maximum shot count will be a similar number of shots as with the M24, i.e. around 10-15.
These are pure facts, no fabrication or opinion of mine. you can already see how many YouTubers shoot their videos with a bottle attached. What I started practicing 4-5 years ago with pellets, because it is simply much more convenient.
Yes, maybe this trend is not so noticeable at this time, but it is only a matter of time for a significant part of shooters.


yes, you are right that the stock of the current M24 is probably the biggest weakness of the entire system. It can be shot accurately, but it requires unnecessarily demanding training and effort. Shooting from aluminum stocks is incomparably more comfortable and safer for the shooter, and at the same time brings a very good benefit in the form of increased weight of the entire system (yes, for many airgun shooters, the greater weight is a disadvantage, but that's only because they haven't yet had the opportunity to find out how difficult it is to shoot a 70 -100J with very light rifle).
That is why I give maximum priority in our company to the transition to an aluminum stock.
On the other hand the plastic stock, in turn, fulfills the function of reducing the price and makes this rifle significantly more affordable even for customers who do not want to pay high sums for an airgun. For the aluminum stock, it is necessary to expect a significant increase in price.

Since some of the information is written in a very negative way -yeah i do, but you dont have to worry about this this is my "normal" and i have this strict,critical and strange kind of attitude against everybody and every manufacturer but the way of communication does not representing the overall situation

At the same time, we are trying to change the paradigms of the industry itself. -that is something very great and you can be proud for yourself for this, im neither into the mainstreams, just continue this way

the greater weight is a disadvantage, but that's only because they haven't yet had the opportunity to find out how difficult it is to shoot a 70 -100J with very light rifle -yes exactly most of people dont really know how the weight and balancing can affect their accuracy they only car about the rifle but at some point at high precision the hold of rifle,weight,balance etc. are getting more and more important

The rifle is primarily built and tested for the ATP slug -noticed, but i think its much better if it would be optimized for more commercial slugs also as the altaros slugs are really great i tried and measured them and need to admit they are having really good quality level but some people are more cost sensitive so lot of them are trying to find cheaper alternatives-this one is more a marketing than technical decision- sell more rifles or sell more slugs its your choice

there is a magnet and you can pull it out with your fingers -wow great this one i didnt knew about to now, i thought i need to disassemble the rifle
I consider this to be the biggest unfair contribution of the entire post. -I am sure that its not a great to see this comment on a international airgun forum but this is just the true, im not a payed agent of other company to make negative marketing but just a person who appreciate the true and honesty and simply this is what im experiencing-altough the complains are more for the quality (reliability) and not for the working of the products, for example i think the M24s regulator and system with valve is working excellently so im not questioning the work but the build quality based on what i heard! and not what i experienced as to now with the M24 i had no problem

The point is that the most effective system can be achieved by maximally limiting the parasitic space between the valve and the projectile, and it is not much better to reduce this space more than when the wall of the valve directly presses on the projectile. At the same time high performance can be achieved maximum flow into the barrel. -exactly and this is why i think its just question of time that your "tens of thousands of dollars" by the time will pay off because as i see you are the first who recognized that this is the future and the right way for the valving in the airgun industry

When you experience the M24 in a robust aluminum chassis, the shooting experience is many times better. -cant wait for it, depending on price maybe i would also get for my M24 -is the M2010 chassis P&P for the M24?

LW is able to deliver a 700mm barrel to order, -sure they can produce any barrel but they are not selling them commercially yet

Although my negative tone and communication I think you are on a right track with your technology but i think they would be great products if you would come with own design instead of being stuck with making airgun variants of firearms. I can imagine how great would be a rifle with your technology in a custom rifle with magazine and big bottle for air etc,etc.

Regards

 

[Silvio]

I also have to say that the rifle looks really good with the aluminum chassis. If you make the magazine a little smaller in height, it can hardly be distinguished from the original.

Regarding the other comments, I have to say that the 10 shots at 75 J are completely sufficient for the competition because you can fill up again immediately after shooting. And with an even higher performance, 5 shots are perfectly sufficient for hunting.

All in all a very successful rifle.
Thumbs up.

 

[Altaros]

to explorer
I think we both have the same thing. Getting the M24 rifle technology in the right coat (meaning stock) and a few other modifications (magazine) where it would be fully utilized.

Although the thread is about the M2010, since we discussed the M24 here anyway on the last page, it is appropriate to insert a newly created review from YouTuber Gregor, other parts of the review should follow:

 

[Peashooter]

THX for the link to Gregor's video.
I will be looking forward to see at what price the M2010 will sell, but i assume its a bit more than the M24

 

[DanT55]

Sorry if I missed it.....any plans to distribute in the US?

I also find it very interesting that you have the air cylinder around the barrel and really innovative that the plenum is in the bolt and acts directly on the slug. The FX Panthera has a variation of this and based on what I have heard they seem to think it is something newly invented but really only executed differently i.e. plenum around the barrel and standard carbon tank on the stock.

Good job.

DT

 

[Peashooter]

IMO i can not see why you cant have full pressure around barrel, the pressure on the barrel and in the cylinder are uniform, so i can not see how / why shooting and pressure slowly dropping should mean POI shift.

IMO the shroud / air cylinder could be a little larger and not take away too much from the look, say 5 mm more so the barrel was the same OD as the,,,, is it receiver it is called, but the part the barrel screw into.
That would boost shot count some i assume, even if this are not really a issue for me shooting tethered as i have explained before.

In regard to the OT rifle the M2010 you could also have the back part of the reservoir larger OD as it is hidden by that cage, but if the front part was a bit thicker like the OD on the moderator used in the video in post #1.

WIN - WIN i feel.

Very much interested still, but a bit sad about the fact that most if not all videos i have seen are .22 caliber, and i am looking for .177

 

[Nomadic Pirate 66]

This gun is so boring.

 

[Altaros]

Project airgun M2010 cancelled.
the reason is a complication with the delivery of the given stock. The project will be replaced by an aluminum chassis manufactured by us, thereby avoiding the problem in these supply chains.
This stock will be backwards compatible with current or already sold Altaors M24 rifles.
The stock prototype is almost ready and will soon go into series production.

 

[Peashooter]

Sweet.
Whats with you CZ people and airguns, you almost have a new brand pop up every year.
The new Epic brand look sweet too, especially the 2 model, even if it look to be old pipe with reservoir / regulator / plenum and valve in the end, like my AGT are and many other CZ made guns seem to be.