Air Gun Accuracy

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Ginuwine1969

Ginuwine1969

Member
Jun 28, 2015
802
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California, United States
What do you think an airgun accuracy be? I've seen a lot of people including myself complain that our gun is not shooting up to par. But what is par? People often reference centimeters or inches when talking about group size because its an exact measurement. I think when it comes to expectation of an airgun though we should start thinking of them as MOA shooters. "Ginuwine, what do you mean", you say? And i will get to that in a second. So the question is, What is a good starting point for group size? A MOA reference will cover all ranges (whether you shoot in your back yard 10-30 meters or yards). I believe that anything short of 75 yards a quality airgun should yield 2 MOA group or less out the box, and 3 MOA at 100 yards / meters because of environmental effects on the pellets, given you have the best pellet barrel combination. I think some of us have too high expectations. Like if my gun doesn't shoot 1 MOA at 100 yards there is something wrong with it. And at the end of the day that is just not true. poop, most of the best shooters here can't get 1 MOA 50% of the time they shoots and some dedicated a lot more time practicing than most people i know. Most powered burner shooters can't do it either. all my guns at this time shoot 2 MOA or better at 75 yards or less. So my new minium expectation right now is 2 MOA @ anything 75 and less and 3 MOA for 100 yards (high powered PCP). If you get better GREAT, but lets just get a little more realistic when judging group size. 50 yards = 1 inches, 75 yards = 1.5 inches and 100 yard is 3 inches. That's my starting point for group size, and my 2 cent. I started off saying accuracy but then some of you would instance point out that there is a difference, "hitting a specific point in space is accuracy" and aiming at the bull eyes and measuring groups are something else. What do you think? SpinJ has had a lot to add on this topic in the past and is a great shooter. Post is inspired by all the recent post about the Fx Impact issues although other guns accuracy issues come up as well, and i'm sure most of them are QC issues and meant to help other members get them resolved, but I wanted to just address expectation that we as airgun shooters may have.
 
It is a very rare occurance for me to be able to shoot MOA. At 50 yards that equates to a half of an inch and I just cant seem to hold the rifle steady enough at that distance. For me, 30 yards seems to be the farthest I can go and still shoot MOA or better. Its interesting because when I first got into this hobby I kept reading about all these people who had guns that regularly were able to shoot MOA at 100 yards and it falsely set my expectations way too high. Now, like Ginuwine, I am happy to get 3 MOA at 100, although I have beat that a few times with my Air Ranger. Also, IMO group sizes measure consistency better than accuracy.
 
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Ideally airgun accuracy is ever changing for the better with each individual shooter and airgun. For example I could not shoot MOA at 100 yards with my RAW HM 1000X .25 when I first got it even though it was capable. I was not. The addition of better optics, wind flags and practice produced the desired results. So for me accuracy in an airgun is reaching that airguns true potential along with yours whatever that may be.
 
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3 MOA at 100 yards? Hell no. I would expect 2 MOA at least with a .22 and up. I have only shot such long range twice, once when I was on the top of my game and once when I wasn't. You can guess what my resluts was when I wasn't lol. But when I was on the top of my game I shot four groups in progression, 5 shots each. The groups avareged out at 1,7" CTC wich is less than 2 MOA and the range was 110 yards. (390mm barrel, or 15,35") If it was a .25 I would expect better, closer to 1MOA. Because what is the point of going up in caliber, increasing air consumption, increasing ammo cost, increasing noise level if it doesnt increase accuracy and does the job better?

Anyway those are my two cents, take it or leave it
 
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Ginuwine1969I think all bore should be judged on reasonable acceptable performance ranges. i.e. a .177 can shoot at 100 yards should it? I could drive a car using only my feet, should I?
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Haven't you ever been Louisiana they drive with there feet all the time😆
I think expectations should fit within quality, precision, caliber, and design
I mean you start comparing a Ford Pinto with a ford GT Mustang and guess what
Both will get you to A too Z but how fast they do so and what precision they do so at is going to be a huge difference.
 
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"Erik"3 MOA at 100 yards? Hell no. I would expect 2 MOA at least with a .22 and up. I have only shot such long range twice, once when I was on the top of my game and once when I wasn't. You can guess what my resluts was when I wasn't lol. But when I was on the top of my game I shot four groups in progression, 5 shots each. The groups avareged out at 1,7" CTC wich is less than 2 MOA and the range was 110 yards. (390mm barrel, or 15,35") If it was a .25 I would expect better, closer to 1MOA. Because what is the point of going up in caliber, increasing air consumption, increasing ammo cost, increasing noise level if it doesnt increase accuracy and does the job better?


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if I look at the results of the 100 meter target matches I shoot, 3 MOA at 100 meters (so 7,5 to 8 centimeters) is quite a good estimation. Most quality airguns can deliver this kind of accuracy with finding the right pellet. If you start training en experimenting you can decrease it to below 2 MOA.

1 MOA @ 100 meters consistently is very hard to reach, I don't know anyone that's capable of doing that with an airgun (there are some insanely good shooters in our competition). I've shot a 6mm group with 5 shots and 8 mm group with 10 shots at a 100 meter range, I guess there was some kind of luck involved because I can't repeat that consistently. I'm currently at about 1.5 MOA on average with my .22 @ 40 joule.

The bigger calibers are better capable of bucking the wind due to their higher BC value. A .22 and below are just not good at flying at a straight line with wind. Below is a picture of my 100 meter match result of last week at a range with an open roof and some wind:


(short target explanation: inner gray circle = 1cm, next circle = 3cm, next circle is 6,6cm)

As you can see, when the wind lay down the groups were decent and as soon as the wind picked up they started flying of path. The open roof causes horizontal tornado shaped airstreams in the range which cause inconsistent opening of the groups. Unfortunately it's very hard to compensate for this with no wind indicators
 
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"Willie14228"

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Easy on the feet neighbor!!
I drive through Houston and would have done better, than them, with a blindfold and my feet!!!
I have had the same question many times. Are my goals unrealistic? In another forum I follow, some guys and gals are showing great groups at 100 yrds. Granted they have alot of practice and kits that cost way more than mine. 
I started this hobby adventure because of videos on youtube showing spectacular shooting at long range. I just didn't realize how much effort goes into shooting like that.
I have since lowered my standard to something more realistic, and will continue to strive to achieve them. When and if I do, my standard will change and I will strive for better, whatever that group size is!
 
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 Post pictures if you feel group size is unrealistic 10 shot groups, I have some MOA targets I'm trying to upload PDF for 8x11 paper. The smallest MOA ring your entire group is in side of is your MOA. If your group is 1.1 inch or 1.9 inches at 100 yard that is still 2 MOA group. The picture posted above if I understood the explanation is on average 2.6 inch groups which would be 3 MOA, and I believe 2 groups where 2 MOA. Still meeting realistic expectations. Any distance is find 50, 75, or 100. I know a couple of guys who shoot powder burners and they say 2-3 inches at 100 yards is good.
 
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I think some said this already in this thread, but just want to underscore it. That is, accuracy has much to do with how much time and how many pellets you shoot from your rifle. It takes time to know how a gun shoots, how the trigger blade reacts to your finger, etc. Let alone finding the best pellet and the best speed for that pellet.

In terms of what is possible in terms of the rifles. I'd say sub MOA at 50 yards up to 50% of the time, sub MOA at 75 yards around 30% of the time and sub MOA at 100 yards maybe 10% (or less!) of the time. We'll have to see if the FX Crown changes this.....
 
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This is what my fx Impact in .25 does. I shot this yesterday. First group is 5 shots second 6 (to help illustrate) third 5. The middle group is crap as I used a different hold to make a post on another forum about how important holds can be. I was trying to show that on my gun loading the bipod had adverse effects on accuracy. Then right after I can go back to a light hold and things work again.


I should add, I have had my Impact for just over 3 weeks and have over 2100 pellets thru it. It has only seen jsb 34 grainer's. I have tweaked everything back and forth probly 6 times lol.


rcr7ex.jpg


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Let's not mention the gun, but I will say my Impact can't do the same...

.22 JSB 18, 872fps, 80 target shots, 7 sighters at the bottom row, 25.5m, from a bipod and rear bag.

My opinion is meaningless, but for me at this range and indoors I look for the 2 mm ring 80 % of the time, the 5 mm ring should be hit with every shot, bad shots due to me not doing my thing result in the 5 mm ring not being hit.

target circles are 2, 5.5, 11, 16 and 22 mm. For me I deem this string accurate

https://imgur.com/7ieSm



 
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I don't know if its because I'm blind in one eye and cant see out of the other,so to speak-But I really have to hold my mouth right out past 50yrds.depending on wind in 22 My bobcat mk2 in .22 has shot so many 12 shot moa groups @ 50 on high pwr.w/18.13s and on pwr.2 w/16 gr. -shot mostly in a building but I rarely get less than an 1" @70-Since I started shooting .25 cal.1500 pellets ago .shooting the 34s since i don't have to play with the wind,as much,I'm getting alot more moa groups @70 I've been watching Youtube vids .Started keeping both eyes open looking threw scope ,trying to exact mimic the actions that got me the shot I want again-and trying to shoot in the wind alot more often, is starting to help some,I bought a stable table built a little hand trailer,lawn mower wheels-2x2.5s and a milk crate,for my measuring wheel and target box,drag it out in the pasture- set up and move the target box360 around me,stared that last wkend, found I fight the wind for stability with the gun,no wonder the pellet cant figure it out
 
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